Any early signs that a child will be capable of passing 11+?

[NumptyNu]

Potentially a question for teachers really, but feel free to chip in mums and dads with any useful info and experiences. My question is, does it follow that if your child is doing well in year one or two, that you can extrapolate out a few years and assume they will be 11+ candidate? Or vice versa, would a slow reader at age 5 result in a lower potential for passing the 11+?

Is this a classic case of primary schooling being a marathon rather than a sprint? Or is there a clear correlation between bright kids at age 6 going on to 11+ success?

As a psychologist I find the 11+ definition of 'intelligence' as tested in our area depressingly narrow, and as a result many very able children whose intelligence is along creative lines do not find themselves '11+' material. I have one who passed and one who failed. One who passed is logical, scientific and mathematical (even the flipping verbal reasoning paper has a heavy component of logical and deuctive reasoning in those flipping codes, rather than linguistic or creative reasoning). The one who failed is not a quick maths reasoner, though his maths is not bad if he has time. However he is a talented artist, creative storyteller, poet and tremendously quick witted a la Paul Merton (who also failed his 11+). None of these intelligences is valued or assessed by the 11+. It is genuinely their loss as of the two, he is the grafter and probably in his field the more talented

New all primary school children could benefit from some exam technique, as they will all regardless of 11= be doing exams.

More evidence for the well educated parents = higher attaining kids equation.

www.brookings.edu/blogs/social-mobility-memos/posts/2014/10/27-intergenerational-education-mobility-reeves

I once heard a radio 4 documentary that casually threw in a statistic that astonished me.

Apparently schools can only improve/ impair the educational outcome of a child by 10%. The rest is down to the family. The single most important factor being how supportive the parents are of education (come to parents' evenings, read with kids etc)

Clairewitch, maybe part of the 11+ could be a round of Just A Minute.

That would sort the sheep from the goats

39steppesmum Mon 27-Oct-14 22:10:20

some of the attitudes and comments I read on here by teachers - that stat doesnt suprise me.

schools need to look at problem in different way and do more to get that stat up.

It has long been the case that private schools tutor in Bucks. There are many parents who move from state infants to private for year 3 to get the tutoring and a curriculum tailored towards the 11+. My DD's private school in Bucks offered tutoring for 11+ athough the vast majority of children went on to independent schools,not the grammar schools.

As I mentioned previously, there are many schools in Bucks that get nowhere near 19% through to the grammar schools. 5% in some would be a fantastic result. These are schools that get 20% and more level 5 children but hardly any through the 11+. There are other state schools that have a very strong reputation and will get far more than 19% but the schools with the low percentage bring the average down. The percentage in the North of the County has traditionally been less than the southern/Chitern area. The inner town schools have less success than the village schools.

There are still plenty of Headteachers in Bucks who care not one jot about grammar school successes, but many parents do. Some Headteachers are not even bothered about helping parents appeal.

Sadly wit, art and story telling ability are not part of any 11+ exam. I am not sure where Paul Merton lived, but in Bucks he may well have passed! Some selective areas take nearer 2% of the cohort overall but these grammars are super-selective, unlike Bucks.

^Thats really sad and annoying.

Schools should be helping children with G potential!Education is their business after all they should be helping and directing them^

I agree. Schools should be doing all they can to help kids reach their potential- and if that end would be best achieved by going to grammar school then they should be doing all they can to help kids who should pass the test actually pass by preparing them for it. It should not be left down to who can afford tutoring.

Or indeed, who can afford to go to private school, as they seem to do their damnedest to prepare kids for the tests.

One thing that distinguishes at least some of the super-selectives anyway is the amount of homework the kids will be expected to do. One we looked at handed out a sheet telling you this - so you know well in advance. A child who is clever but happy to bumble along and who doesn't want to work hard may not be suited to certain grammars.

They are all different though. Go and look. Passing the test gives them more choice but it doesn't necessarily mean that passing = grammar.

The current information from Bucks in their Secondary Transfer Document clearly states that the "tests are not linked to the National Curriculum". It appears that if they said anything to the contrary earlier, they have withdrawn it now because the tests are not linked in any meaningful way.

State schools see their role in education as teaching the Curriculum as it stands at any particular time. They will not pick out children as having extra potential for a grammar school. They do, however, try really hard to make sure each child reaches their full potential within the taught curriculum to prepare them for whatever school they go on to. The independent schools do prepare children for the 11+ and I was asked if I wanted my DD to join the 11+ after school group. Bucks insist their exam is tutor proof. Of course it is not, but they have always believed children should not be tutored but know full well lots of them are......but only the ones with money. It has always been like this. It is a Tory Shire after all!!!

A lot of our state schools see the grammar vs secondary as divisive and do not wish to see it extended into the school day by tutoring some children and not others. That is why exam technique and assistance should be offered as an after-school club to all children whose parents want it, irrespective of ability to pay. You only have to look at the lack of free school meals children in Bucks grammar schools to see who goes to them. I would love to know what schools/tutoring the Level 4 SATS children in the grammar schools went to and received. As some of the secondary moderns are poor, there is a great premium attached to being at the grammar schools. They are nearly all outstanding!

One thing that distinguishes at least some of the super-selectives anyway is the amount of homework the kids will be expected to do.

Interesting how it varies. One of the reasons we chose a SS over local grammar was that it has less homework in Y7.

Yes the super selective DD attended had very little homework until 6th form. I think they moved at pace in class and were able to cover most work there.