Controversial? Don't think parents should work/volunteer in their dcs' class...

[Nerf]

Have often thought this in passing, mainly due to my dm teaching me as a child and her being super strict.
Now mine are all at school this has come up a lot:

X's mum is a TA in ds' class. X and ds don't get on but my ds says anytime he 'tells on x' the mum takes her child's side.

Me being told about the the dinner ladies and what they have to do for my son at lunch. By a dinner lady at a social event unrelated to school and in hearing of others.

Me being told chattily about my son and his lunch habits.

Dinner ladies unable (seemingly) to be fair when their children are involved in incidents.

One helper taking my dd to one side as she came out of school to tell her off for her meanness to her dd. Has done this to other children.

They are just examples i know rather than guessing. But I think volunteering/ working is fine, just not in the same class or playground as your child....

I volunteer and was surprised to be always placed with my DCs classes. However I never work directly with my DCs and I sit outside the classroom.
I think that volunteering like this is a completely different situation from working as a teacher or TA in your child's class.

To be fair , let's not lose sight of the benefit to the school of ljkkk volunteering (arguing against self now)

I think a lot of the time it can be more trouble than it's worth, lougle, which is why so many schools have a policy of not allowing volunteers to work in their own children's classes. Obviously they've come to the conclusion that risking putting off some volunteers is preferable to the trouble that parent volunteers can cause.

I'm not sure I get some of your arguments lljkk. Surely if you stayed in the same class for several years you would get to know the teacher well anyway. If you move up with your child, then you and the teacher are an unknown quantity at the beginning of every year anyway.

I am not a volunteer parent. Our school in the first year we were in had no policy re who volunteered where. We had in our class several sahm who were teachers in their previous life who relished the opportunity to volunteer. And so did we (as the other parents). I think the reason I liked that was because I felt that that parent was an asset to the class.

She was a good teacher (IMHO) and I felt was a good influence on the class.

This year they changed the policy and people were up in arms. I don't think she volunteers anymore. I can see why - as a parent, I would rather know an extra teacher was in the class (this parent) than some other random parent who I have no knowledge of.

Having said that, I know of one parent who's now listed as a HLTA (what does that mean?) and does choir and music and that's for the whole school. Another couple of parents run language afterschool clubs. So that benefits all the students.

Parent helpers are needed in school absolutely but it's to benefit all the children and the school NOT to mostly benefit the parent moving her own child on...

My son doesn't benefit at all from my volunteering so according to lljk I should stop until he does.

Most of the volunteer stories on here are exactly the support schools need thankfully

In most cases I really don't agree with it but recently came across a mum who actually was able to balance te whole mum and child in the class thing so I guess it depends on the mum and the child.

I'm a governor and I help out in school. We had to have a particular class assigned to us and I asked specifically not to have classes my children were in and the ht agreed that should be the case. I don't think it would be helpful for me or my children and could be disruptive, not to mention how hard I would find it to be impartial to any issues involving my child . I'm still helping to improve the school and then indirectly my children's experience of school, and the other helpers are helping my children more directly so they don't lose out.
If I need any information on my children I have confidence I can ask their teachers, I trust them to be honest and I don't need to look for myself.

I'm sorry if you thought I was having a go lljkk. I wasn't and hoped my post would come across in the manner intended.

I just wanted to give MY reasons for not going into dc's classes as part of a balanced discussion. As I said originally, I'm not sure that there is a right or wrong.

I have helped with school trips with my dd's class though and my dh has been with ds and his class. That seems to be different and you normally get your child in your little group. Its never been a problem.

Totallt agree.

I used to work in a school thay had a lot of couples teaching there and had their children in classes.

I was once in a meeting where something cam up and I knew it had been passé back via their child to their mother and her oaf of a partner who was on senior management. Completely unprofessional.

I also tutored someones child who was a complete battle-axe. I was scared to go to her. I was misinfomred about procedures and put in a difficult position. It did not help that her son was a problem that she could not see.

The staffroom was interesting - you constantly had to watch what you said to who about what.

I enjoy working with a different class (and year group) my daugher is in. I have learnt quite a lot about the children I help out and it would be embarassing to have that knowledge about dd's friends.

The year 4 children have no idea that I am just a parent. The fact that they believe I am staff means that I can get more work out of them. I think my children's friends would play me up.

To be honest I don't think it is particularly healthy to be in your child's class keeping a sly eye on them while you help out.

You are with the child in the morning before school, after school and evening, weekends and holidays.

I think children need some time away from parents (ie school)) so they get a chance to grow and be themselves without being watched on.

I don't think there is anything wrong with a parent helping in their child's class and I think Lljkk has some valid reasons for wanting to help out in her child's class - I don't think there is anything wrong with wanting to see how your child is performing in class. However, OP I think the problems you describe are down to certain parents not keeping things confidential and that is a problem. I would be tempted to let the school know about said parents and ask them to remind parent volunteers that they mustn't discuss other children outside class and must let the teacher deal with any problems their child has whilst in class.
I did volunteer at my children's school last year, though not in their class because the school didn't like parent volunteers in Foundation, although they have no problem with parents being in their childrens classes further up the school.

We're not allowed to help/read with our own children's class, and if we go on trips to help our own children are not placed in our groups, which all makes sense to me.

Our teachers aren't allowed to teach their own kids either - in fact not even the same year (we have 2 classes per year).

The parent who helps in my class has a child in my class but doesn't sit in the classroom. I don't really have a problem but then this mum is sensible! Not sure how I'd cope with a nosey or troublesome parent. Probably have lots of laminating and photocopying for them. :o

I have volunteered in the past but always asked not to be placed in my dc's class. My dc wouldn't want me in their class anyway because for them school is school and home is home and my being there would muddy the waters.
I like helping out with the youngest children anyway because their activities appeal to me more than listening to twenty odd children read.

Interesting, thank you all for responding. I did complain about the mum who approached dd, and I will be mentioning my ds' perception of X's mum not believing X could ever be in the wrong.

I totally agree, also don't think it is good to teach your own dc but it happens at my ds's school.

I did work at dc's primary and in ds's year but not in class.

Thanks beer! At university we have to declare any vested interests so if we were somehow related to any of our students we'd need to say so. Even though all marking is done anonymously!!

It would be great if mums could help out, but unfortunately mums are not always discreet. This happened in my oldest's school and it was a nightmare. It's terrible when a young child's confidentiality is not protected and subject to immature local gossip.

Also the mum in tried to user her influence to manuever a child out of the top set with her daughter, because she felt the other girl was too bossy her daughter.

I currently volunteer at school but more for outings, swimming for my ds. My DD is going up in September so I will have more time (only work part- time) but would love to volunteer in class. I would be happy to do it any class and in fact I think it may be off putting for DD to be with her. Would have no problem with other mums volunteering in my child's class surely any extra help they can get is a good thing!

NERF:

I'm mixed on this. I think parents are so excluded from what is actually going on at school (no homework/ no work coming home) that sometimes they feel volunteering will at least give them a chance to see what is going on (as lljkk has described). But I agree - parents can cross that line.

I personally only went when invited: Reading mornings YR - Y2 and Maths workshops - as and when work would allow. I would often end up reading/ working with children whose parents couldn't come that day but wanted to be with my DDs.

I know that a volunteer parent read with my child when she was in Y3. I got more feedback on my child's reading and advice from this parent than from the teacher. And I'm hugely grateful for it - it was a real help and gave me a lot of encouragement when I was in despair about DD1's struggling so badly.

I think parent volunteers can be a great help.

Dinner ladies are another kettle of fish and aren't really volunteers. Some use this as an entree into being a TA at the school. In general most of these ladies are low paid and often poorly educated (many are school leavers themselves).

Our school is very strange governors/ staff children frequently get the special awards/ jobs and many of the other children grumble about this. I haven't kept score but my impression is there is a certain amount of favouritism going on.

Some dinner ladies had children in the school years ago - but just enjoy working with children. They bring in chalks, colouring books, toys, etc... they've purchaesed themselves to help make break times more fun. Many have helped my kids with bumps/ cuts/ scrapes and have helped calm hurt feelings/ resolve disputes.

I don't think you should throw out the barrell because of a few bad apples. My view is that good senior management should be ensure volunteers/ dinner ladies don't get too involved with their own child and see their role as a commitment/ job independent of their child attending the school. However, there clearly can be all sorts of problems with close personal/ working arrangements in a school.

In some ways I think schools can be even more of a political environment than ordinary working life.

What I don't like is being invited to comment on my sons behaviour by someone who knows me as a mum but happens to also work in the school and interacts with him. If it's not important enough that the school officially tell me, I don't see why I should be told by the TA in her capacity as 'standing at a party near me'. How can you work in a class, form opinions of a child, and not let that affect how you see that child in relation to your own?
I'm beginning to feel quite pissed off about it - clearly I have had some unfortunate experiences but it's irritating.