School don't seem to care

[king1001]

My son, aged 10 is just finishing year 5. He has just had to redo his maths paper. He did a lvl 6 paper and got 4 questions wrong 96%, which gave him a 6C, so I made him it sit a paper at home. The lvl 5 to 7. Which he scored a 90/120 without doing the mental maths section. He took it to school and showed his teacher who, asked him to sit a different lvl 5 - 7 paper at school. Which again he managed a 90/120 already giving him a 7C without the mental maths. He is gifted in other subject, too.

I am slightly concerned that without my having him do the higher level test at home, then he would have got the 6c with nothing more being done.

We have tried to contact the school and was waiting for a phone call or an email but nothing. They seem to not care about this.

I am not sure how we handle to situation we try with the school to get him on education trips with the year 6s but get told that its unfair to others in his class. We previously asked for him to go up a year which was denied. We are looking to move school but where to? Another primary school that takes the same approach? A private school that would offer better tutoring perhaps but with that comes a cost we can't really afford.

Where do we go from here?

Riight. You have read the book how to win friends and influence people?

And fwiw, calling other people trolls is against the MN Talk guidelines.

I'm sorry you haven't appreciated the very good advice you've been given.

I havent called anyone specific a troll but thanks, dont need to use the account anymore anyway.

Thank you morethanpotatoprints a genuine response.

His current teacher said he was a clearly gifted mathematician who is so gifted he can work out problems not previously taught. So we are cheating a bit as he works out things not taught ;)

Thanks for absolutely no advice on this thread. Great support and will recommend to all my friends to come on here if they need to be trolled.

You have had plenty of advice. You just didn't agree with any of it.
You clearly wanted people to say " oh you are so right to have your son do a higher test. What an incompetent school only testing your son on material that is too easy. Good for you on ensuring that he has now completed a higher test. What a genius your son is you need to get him into Mensa".
When what has happened is people have been realistic and explained that a test result does not enhance learning in the classroom and doesn't change the work that is provided to your son on a daily basis. People have suggested that you ensure your son has challenging and motivating work to do and that you look for ways to enrich that learning and stretch it sideways.

And king is rightly a little upset over some of the responses. Some people have tended to shoot rather than perhaps, if his original thread starter was unclear, ask questions.
In any case, some response are helpful so thank you to those.

As a parent, I just want what's best for him. That's all, not pushy, not making him do anything, he just loves learning..... :)

We don't go in a straight line with him, he moves forward and sideways in all of his subjects. We constantly work with him to keep him motivated. Like I said before, I don't like that our motives are called into question. Whether others agree or not, allowing him to sit the higher paper was what we felt we needed to do at the time. The school were behind us with this, they could have easily said no to allowing him sit it at school. I don't personally see the issue. It gives us a better idea of where he is going.

king, you clearly missed the advice in my rambling. DS' school is supporting him. They have denied him going up a year, which as i tried to explain is probably a good thing as an unhappy child who doesn't fit in won't learn properly (I am living proof).

I have 2 little sisters, a brother and a son who are all extremely gifted in various areas and 3 brothers and a daughter who really aren't (littlest sis and DS are both year 5, DS is on similar levels to your DS, littlest sis a bit above) so I really do know how frustrating school can be but it genuinely sounds like your DS' school is getting it right, your son is clearly a very bright boy but he is unlikely be the only one the school have ever dealt with. All you can do now is encourage his love of maths at home and start looking into his options for secondary school, unless private or home ed is an option.

Middle sis and little bro have found super-selective grammar is the best fit for them as all their classmates are bright so they aren't as far ahead of everyone but that really depends on area and personality, I hated the grammar and transferred to a non-selective, which I still hated but not quite as much.

I am slightly concerned that without my having him do the higher level test at home, then he would have got the 6c with nothing more being done.

It's the fact that this was wrote in the OP. Which is suggestive of the test result being important. Why does it matter whether he got a 6c or an 8c? What people have asked is whether the school provide your son with challenging and motivating work. If they do then you have nothing to worry about. If they don't then there is an issue. You haven't actually answered clearly about whether the school provide appropriate level work.
I am not questioning your motives as everyone wants the best for their children. Parenting a child who is highly gifted is challenging and different approaches are required. I am only questioning why you feel that the test result is an important factor.
I have removed my own child from one school due to him not being provided with work that was pitched at the correct level so I understand your consideration of that aspect. My child doesn't do SATs now and I am glad because they don't tell the full story and are not useful to the individual child.

People are only questioning your motives because they are trying to understand why you are posting on here and how they can best help you.

Getting defensive and name calling is unhelpful.

You appear reluctant to believe that any other pupil has achieved a level 8 in yr 5. In my experience, they have. One I have taught and another child who I am related to. If you were slightly more polite I would offer to PM you with some helpful information but because you have been rude and think I'm lying, I won't bother. Good luck.

I'm not sure you understand how this whole school thing works. Measuring (eg by testing) does not ensure progress by itself. You see very hung up on testing your son and proving his level and I'm not sure why that is.

As PPs have pointed out, the highest he can get in his SATs next yr is a 6 anyway.

Actually OP, although I questioned your decision to put your poor DS through another paper when he had already done excellently, I DID also suggest that you speak to the SENCO as your DS equally has special educational needs albeit at the other end of the spectrum. I also made the point that the state system does not always cope well with children as gifted as your DS evidently is.

Why you would take offence at that I cannot imagine. Will read some of the other responses now to see if you were given a hard time about this issue.

I think many people agreed with you that this is a problem for your DS. Stop being so touchy.

You've been given advice, you just don't seem to like it.

That said, I don't know why posters have been so confrontational about it. I, too, have a ds who, if he aces a test, will ask for the next test up simply out of curiosity. IME teachers do use tests to assess children who are out if the ordinary, if only to see what the child knows that the tea her has not yet taught.

Can I suggest that both King and King wife take a trip to G&T section where you will get more advice and discover a group of children just like your son.

Lonecat: the G&T section on here is not for the faint hearted. Accusations of stealth boasting and being economical with the truth have been witnessed by my eyes many times on the G&T section. I don't think anybody here doubts the obvious ability of OPs s

Obvious ability of OPs son. Some people have just asked about the learning opportunities provided usually to OPs son and have question the usefulness of testing to a higher level.

I disagree with those who say that G&T is not a SEN, it needs managing the same, otherwise dc can be bored, unstimulated and left to own devices. Some become naughty when bored or even disruptive.

That may be your opinion, but it isn't according to the Department of Education SEN Code of Practice definition of SEN:

Children have special educational needs if they have a learning difficulty
which calls for special educational provision to be made for them.

Children have a learning difficulty if they:
a) have a significantly greater difficulty in learning than the majority of
children of the same age; or
(b) have a disability which prevents or hinders them from making use of
educational facilities of a kind generally provided for children of the same
age in schools within the area of the local education authority
(c) are under compulsory school age and fall within the definition at (a) or (b) above or would so do if special educational provision was not made for them

Yes, children who are G&T should be given work that challenges them so they are not bored but so should all children, it's called differentiation, the class teacher should be doing that, it's not the role of the SENCO.

Op you seem to be coming at this situation all wrong; focussinng on tests, when you say the school have already identified his giftedness. The reality is that no matter what your son's score, a state primary school can't give him a tailor made service. If he is in a mixed ability setting then a teacher can only do so much (bear in mind a year 5 teacher will be no maths specialist in all liklihood. Better to consider what you will do at the end of next year!

Yes, this is about him working at his level at the school and about him being catered for. There is no one else like DS, I doubt across any primary school.

Sorry, but that's ridiculous! Your son is obviously very good at maths (he sounds able but not gifted in literacy), and it sounds like the school has supported his learning to date. Why are you so hung up on the levels?

Yes, children who are G&T should be given work that challenges them so they are not bored but so should all children, it's called differentiation, the class teacher should be doing that, it's not the role of the SENCO.

A lot of gifted children do fall under the responsibility of the SENCO. Gifted children often have asynchronous academic development and those who are very gifted often have emotional differences which makes it difficult for them to reach their potential without the correct intervention and strategies. Very gifted children are not those in the govt 10% top of the class definition but are a much smaller percentage of children and they do sometimes find it difficult to fully access the curriculum without measures being taken to deal with social and emotional difficulties and any asynchronous developmental issues. These children should very much be the responsibility of the SENCO as well as the responsibility of the class teacher. Unfortunately too many schools don't put the necessary strategies in place for these children because the efforts of the SENCO are concentrated on those at the other end of the scale.
I doubt that the OPs son is unlike ANY other primary aged child at any school but he is probably within the top 1 or 2% for his maths and within the top 5% for other subjects. Rare but not totally unique.
Good schools can manage very gifted children quite well. Other schools don't manage them well at all.

I suggested G&T as someone who is fortunate to be able post in there as I too have a DC who is similar gifted in Maths.

Yes you need to be bold, but there is good advice there too. It made me bold enough to challenge the school.

TheBuskersDog

I don't mean to be rude but couldn't give a flying toss what the DFE states, which is why we removed our dd who is gifted.
She needs as much extra support as my ds2 did with AS, he didn't get it though and was just deemed naughty, throughout school. Another thread though.
Anybody who falls out of the expected norm needs support of some kind, imo.

Morethan- if I remember correctly, your dd is an exceptionally gifted musician. I honestly don't think you could expect an ordinary primary school to cater for her needs, could you?

Sorry- pressed send too soon.

It seems a little unfair to use your dd as an example of how schools can fail G&T children.

Why this obsession with tests? Assessments to assign levels and identify next steps in learning that ensure children have work at a level to extend them has little to do with tests.

There's a misunderstanding here - the ks3 levels (which only exist for another 2.5 weeks!) aren't equivalent to GCSE grades - they are indicators of potential attainment after a 2 year course...