Writing and phonics

[Notcontent]

Background is that I am a bit annoyed at dd's teacher who seemed to suggest that dd's spelling is not great because she needs to improve her knowledge of phonics.

Dd is 7 and her reading is great, as acknowledged by her teacher, but her writing is not as good as her reading. Before Christmas at meeting teacher said that her spelling is letting her down and gave me a sheet with the phonics sounds to practice with dd. But the fact is that there are so many exceptions to English spelling that a lot of it is just memory work. I think that needs to be acknowledged. We have been doing lots of writing at home and I think her spelling is pretty good actually.

I do agree that phonics helps with reading, and helps a bit with spelling, but that's not the whole story, is it?

If i had the money, i would turn that list into a poster and send it to every school in the English-speaking world, for putting up in the staff room, so that all teachers get a clearer idea of what learning to spell English involves.

and then what would happen masha?

Save yourself the trouble because there are also some excellent books around which have similar lists.

Like this one
A Teaching Handbook

Has lots of lists but much more helpful than the ones you post.

no just fat fingers and a dodgy keypad maizie

If i had the money, i would turn that list into a poster and send it to every school in the English-speaking world, for putting up in the staff room, so that all teachers get a clearer idea of what learning to spell English involves.

It would be binned instantly, I'm afraid, since it makes no sense.

All our classrooms have posters of Debbie Hepplewhite's Alphabetic Code instead, and they are invaluable.

I'm not sure phonics-mad teachers would make great recipients of the list, masha. I think sending turkeys photos of Christmas lunch might be more gratefully received. But Webster wrote a spellers' dictionary which went down well. I think he wrote it before he made a mashed potato of our language, but still.

Anyone who understands English spelling would be poor choice as recipients for masha's lists

oh that's a nice term' phonics mad'.

CG- have you come across the work of Debbie Hepplewhite ? Suggest you check out a real expert and one who is, by your definition, totally 'phonics mad'.

cg has no time for experts. She has her own unique slant on reading. Being influenced by experts would spoil the game.

Based solely on her own dodgy 'research', based on never having taught anyone to read ever.

Well, it's not that unique. It involves picking up a book and reading it. Funny that.

and coming to some very dubious conclusions hilarious in fact

That'll be on account of various premises, not on account of reading.

made up premises are still made up premises

The purpose of an argument is, in part, to test premises.

It is insufficient to claim that a premiss is false; it must be demonstrated, otherwise a victorious argument would simply consist of the statement: all of your premises are false, sir.

by making up things? are we back to Santa?

You have been pointed at serious academic research that demonstrates your premise is false. You dismiss it and any arguments that don't fit your world view as polemics. Simply refusing to accept any alternative view no matter how well backed up by scientific research is insufficient for your argument to be victorious.

The premises in that case did not fit the argument being proposed.

Many of the papers being linked to have been risible. Vague references to some research somewhere are insufficient to support an argument. Furthermore, it's unreasonable for phonicsy people to expect posters to rush off to the British Library every time they make a posting claiming to have scientific backing.

Arguments must support themselves in a forum.

Maybe you need to improve you own English or syntax CG- 'arguments must support themselves in a forum'

CG- have you read the Rose Report?

The Rose Report
In March 2006, following a UK government-commissioned national review of the way that reading
is taught, Jim Rose outlined his findings in his Final Report.

The UK government accepted Rose’s recommendations and these have replaced the government’s
previous ‘searchlights’ multi-cueing reading strategies. Rose stated:
“…the case for systematic phonic work is overwhelming and much strengthened by a synthetic
approach, the key features of which are to teach beginner readers:
• grapheme/phoneme (letter/sound) correspondences (the alphabetic principle) in a clearly
defined, incremental sequence
• to apply the highly important skill of blending (synthesising) phonemes in order, all
through a word to read it
• to apply the skills of segmenting words into their constituent phonemes to spell
• that blending and segmenting are reversible processes.” (para 51, Rose Final Report)

A frequent poster, is he?

Oh you are such a laugh.

Stick to the day job though- stand up comedy may not be your forte.

I don't know jaffacakesallround I find it hilarious that CG is recommending a synthetic phonics spelling programme on other threads