Why is year five an important year?

[LondonBus]

I keep hearing this from other mothers.

Is it because we are in a grammar school area and the 11+ is taken at the beginning of Y6?

Or am I totally missing something?

I don't know (but were not in an 11 plus area). I did realise that I need to start thinking about secondary schools though as you have to apply quite early on in year 6 and so I want to have a look at the nearby ones to get a bit more of an idea.

We live in a three tier school system, so for us year five is important because its the first year in middle school. Our children then go to high school in year 9. I guess that's not the case in your area though?

I think it's because the 11+ is in the first term of Y6. According to my teacher friends, a school always puts their best teacher in Y5.

My DD found Y5 pretty heavy going and this continued into Y6 as she didn't sit entrance exams until January.

Then it was working towards SATs in the Spring Term and during this last term - nothing but fun stuff!

Is it?
I've never heard that!

Because its the last year in primary where they actually learn something rather than doing endless sats revision

chickensaladagain that would be my point of view!

DS is middle ability, and I really wish he didn't have to be hothoused next year. It will probably do him good though, and he will have lots of fun in Y7.

I teach y5. And yes it is regarded as important, my colleagues and i have more years teaching under our belts than any other.,.. My brief from the head is always to get them up to scratch for sats as y6 only have a term to add to this and then revision - it's helpful if most arrive in y6prepped.
Parents often report it as a big jump and frequently express anxiety about dc keeping up at autumn parents eve but just as often tell us in spring how pleased they are with dcs progress and how well they have risen to the challenge...

That sounds good - DS could do with a bit of a challenge I think :)

babiesarelikebuses your name made me smile

DD1 is in Y5 and we are in a state-funded grammar school area, where if you pass the exam you can attend for free.

1. Competition to pass the exam is extremely fierce - something like 1 in 7 or 1 in 8 taking the test get a high enough score to go to grammar school. Many parents spend much of Y5 preparing their children. This can take many forms: hiring tutors, encouraging more reading, DIY at home practice with 11+ exercise books and on-line practice. A Chinese friend at work has gone all 'tiger Mum' and hired tutors, paid for all sorts of on-line practice subscriptions etc... and endlessly lectures me about how I should be doing more (which may be true - but little and often has always worked best for DD1 so we're holding steady with that).

2. As BabiesAreLikeBuses stated - many schools are highly aware that if they get the vast majority to NC Level 4 standard or better by end Y5, then the pressure is off the school and the Y6 teacher for KS SATs in May. This means that Y6 can be a normal school year rather than some form of 'cramming' factory. (Sadly our school has gone for cramming - I suspect because results are progressively getting worse and worse year on year and they're getting near the 'floor' target (minimum 60% pupils NC Level 4 in English/ Maths at KS2 SATs now/ will be 65% from 2014 - our school achieved 62% last year).

3. This is also the year that gradually as a parent you are aware that in October of Y6 (in our area at least) you have to decide a list of local schools by preference. So at this point you start to talk to other parents about their older children and how they're finding their senior school, etc.... In our area a lot of the senior schools are arranging visits (sports days/ dramatic arts days/ music days/ see what senior school is like sampler lessons days) which are being offered as free field trips. DD1 has been to 2 schools already since half-term and is visiting a third next week.

My DD1 is in a good place for KS2 SATs but we're still uncertain whether she's 'grammar school material'. It will depend on so many things on the day of the exam (early September here). But we have used this year to ensure that things we feel you should know before leaving primary: types of nouns (collective/ abstract/ pronoun/ proper noun/ etc...), grammatical terminology (preposition/ adverb/ adjective/ passive/ active/ etc...), sound calculation skills in maths and comprehension ability (which is DD1s great weakness) are improving.

Whether it's enough to pass the exam - who knows? - but we do feel (and the teacher has agreed) that this year's work has really helped DD1 progress as a student & a reader.

HTH

Hmm, DS is about to move into Y5 and I've never thought about it being a particularly important year (or heard anyone voice that).

Having just skimmed through the reasons I wonder if this really depends on where you live and the school your DC currently attend.

1. We are not in a grammar area
2. We don't realistically have a choice of secondary schools (90% plus of DS's primary go to the catchment school)
3. DS's school doesn't go SATs mad

(thinking about the teachers in Y5, they are definitely not the best/most experienced ones either!)

I think it's an area thing - if a lot of children are going private then there is a lot of pressure to be level 5 in time for exams in January. My DD school tends to get very good SAT results and there is also pressure to keep that up. From what I hear from Yr 6 parents there is a lot of revision for SATS and we had children in tears on the day due to the pressure.

I'm sure in grammar school areas the pressure points are different. In my school 90% go to the v good local comp but are sats targets are high as around 70% arrive with level 3 from ks1 so we need 70% level 5 just to break even (which isn't easy maturity wise).
I guess one of the things i do right from the start is make sure they are fully independent - look after own property, organise their own kits, complete reading record themselves (i email parents who ar still doing this for them by christmas), start learning as soon as they arrive (amazing how well rewards help with this), organise group projects themselves... Or as one parent put it at the end of the year "thanks for backing off and letting dd get on with it she's so much more organised and responsible now"

Thanks pollywollydoodle all the standard twin mum names had gone!

We're not in a grammar school area (London) and we don't have the most experienced teachers in Y5.

Actually, it seems like the last normal year before SATS kick in, as far as I can tell (not reached it yet, so may be wrong!).

SATS are in May of Y6, and the 11+ - for the few who take it - is in the January, so not as rushed as in some areas by the sound of it.

That said, dd1 is in Y4 and her entire class is going to a 'see what its like' day at the local secondary school soon, so they - and we - are already thinking about secondary choices.

Must be a grammar school thing. I've never heard this before. I'd only go so far as to say Reception & y6 are somewhat special. No others.

For grammar school friends it is a key year of tutoring for the 11+. For prep school friends it is the start of the search for senior schools and registering for those that do pre-tests in year 6.

I've never heard this either.

Those of you talking of preparation for 11+ and entrance exams in the autumn term of Y6, only a tiny minority of children sit either of those and it isn't a primary school's job to prepare children for sitting them anyway.

when children go into secondary schools - and these schools select by a number in certain 'bands' - how do they decide what level a child is at? Is it on the end of Year 5 levels? Or something else?

I've never heard that Yr5 is more important than other years either (am a teacher, and have had 3 dc go past Yr5). So maybe it is a grammar school area thing ? Or maybe just something made up by the people you've heard say it ?

Hi hopingforbest - my dd1 is in year 6 and is going to a secondary school where they put them into 5 bands and then draw names out of the hat. The children are put into bands based on the results of a non-verbal reasoning test that the sit in the November of year 6. I don know if that is how all schools using fair banding do it though.

If you live in a grammar school area I expect it is because of the 11+ at the start of Y6.
Otherwise, ime, no different to any other year.

We are in a grammar school area. So pressure is high. Parents are very nc level conscious. A lot of focus on reading, spellings, timestable and cat assessments from beginning of y5. My dc is only in middle groups in everything. But being in a very good standard school so even in the middle groups in year 5 there are already many high level 4 / level 5 children. In fact the school has problem with over populated top and middle ability groups . There are just simply not enough places to go round in top and middle groups. So many children have to stuck in so called lower ability groups. Many over-lapped abilities between groups. So it is no surprise that sometimes even children from lower or bottom ability groups managed to get gs places. Although state schools are not allowed to prepare children for 11+. The school gives cat tests to children in beginning of y4 and y5 and then midway y5 to help parents prepare their children for secondary schools. Even my dc feels the time in year 5 just went so quickly because of the endless preparations and tests they have to do throughout the year. During the summer holiday many children will continue to prepare for 11+ and year 6 sat (or year 6 SAD!).

It seems to be because of the 11+ then. DSs friends are now saying they can't go to orchestra practice/come for tea etc because they have to practice for the 11+/their tutor is coming round. DS isn't taking the 11 + as he won't be going to school in this town, and I'm feeling a bit for his friends. (And a bit relieved for DS)

In our area many parents like myself are not necessarily particular pushy or over completive by nature. However we just have too many grammar schools in our county and the left over comprehensive schools aren?t that great. So most parents feel somewhat a sense of duty to push or at least consider putting their dcs for gs test. Else just accept to take buses or cycle two or three miles to go to a school in another district every day. It will cost about £20 - £25 weekly so about £800 - £1000 per year per child currently. What if you have two or more children? So if you think about that it isn?t foolish for parents to pay for tutoring during year 5 to increase their dcs chances to get into a local gs. Besides we believe that all the preparation will help them in year 7 whatever schools they go to.

My dc stop going to music lessons since April in order to have more time for preparing 11+. It is not uncommon that some families move out of the area into other better school catchments during junior schools. The medias don?t present nearly a true reality of how and why the 11+s affect or disadvantage those families live in the grammar schools dominated areas.