Ashmount v Coleridge v Brookfield

[newto]

Hello - we're moving from outside of London to Islington (Whitehall Park area) at the end of the month and need to apply for spaces for our two daughters, currently Y2 and Y4. Unfortunately, we've missed all of the school tours and won't have a chance to see the schools before we apply. Ashmount, Coleridge and Brookfield are all about .5 - .6 away. We'll likely be at the mercy of which has open spots for Y3 and Y5 in September, but in the event we have a choice, I'd love to hear your thoughts on these three schools, their strengths, weaknesses, etc. Thanks!

Know Brookfield at one remove. All the children I know there are very happy and it seems a nice mix. If I lived in the area I would be very happy with that as an option - think they are good on creating a community feel but also the general standard is high.

From everything I have heard they are all great schools that people are really pleased to get their children into. I know a couple of kids at Brookfield who seem very happy.

Are you sure those are your only options? Wouldn't Hargrave Park be nearer than Brookfield and more likely to have places? Or maybe Duncombe? It's a little bit out of my area.

I do think Hargrave Park is close by, but I've not heard anything about it good or bad. I've at least heard good things about the other ones, which is why I was focusing on those. Just wondering if there are any factors to distinguish them from each other - e.g., is the curriculum the same? class size? after school programs? parent community? Thanks for your thoughts!

I think you'll most definitely be at the mercy of which school has places, let alone in the year groups that you need them to be.

Hope that your children get places in the same school,

You should also consider Yerbury.

I have a friend whose child is at Brookfield and is happy with it.

I'm in a similar position but a year behind, in a way. We are hoping to move to the Crouch End area later this year. My youngest will be starting in reception in Sept 2014 so we need to be wherever we are going to move to ready to apply for a place for her - not sure exactly which schools yet as it depends exactly where we move to. My worry is re my elder child, who is currently in Year 1. I can keep him in his current school - in Camden - for another year (and "commute" him back) but as it's a stand alone infants only school, we'll need to move him somewhere by Sept 2014, when he'll start year 3. I'm fretting about if/where spaces will be available. I guess it's not something that anyone can give me (or you!) any reassurance about until nearer the time. I'm hoping (?!) that ad hoc places come up from time to time?

I think that youand christinarossetti are right in that you will be at the mercy of which school has places. I'd be really interested to hear how you get on - good luck!

As regards open days - I know that Coleridge have them every Wednesday and Thursday. Are you able to go to one of those before the end of term? I know you said that you are outside London though. The next few may well be full up, but you might be ok in a couple of weeks (I've recently put my name down to have a look round).

also consider St Michaels in Highgate. Many come from Whitehall Park. There are often spaces further up the school due to home moves etc.

Really nlondondad? You think Yerbury would have 2 places coming up further up the school? I would have thought there would be a long waiting list for any available places. It is something to think about OP, other local parents may still be on waiting lists for popular schools, and willing to move their children mid year if places become vacant.

Are all those schools in different Boroughs? I think you would be offered the school that has vacant places in the Borough you move to. Is Whitehall Park Islington? If so you are more likely to be offered HP, or somewhere South Islington? I don't want to be a doom monger, just trying to be realistic. You could then stay on waiting lists for all your preferred options.

Lego, wont the school you are talking about have a Junior School by then?

oh, and Lego, we have two friends whith children at Campsbourne (SP?) who are very happy with it. I know it isn't one of the popular schools, and is a bit out of Crouch End itself, but worth a look.

Yes indeed you should consider St Michaels in Highgate; I did not mention that school because you had not listed any church schools in your enquiry OP, (St Michaels is Church of England) and there is also St Johns Upper Holloway, also C of E and St Josephs, Highgate, which is RC. All of which are reachable and have historically been used by people in Whitehall Park.

(By "Whitehall Park' I mean the conservation area not just that single road)

@ Roastchicken's comment "there are often spaces further up the school due to home moves etc."

Exactly so. This applies to all schools in Islington; in general more families move out than move in so as you go up a school vacancies occur. Note that how oversubscribed a school may be at reception is irrelevant.

In South Islington there are schools which are two form entry at reception, and by the time, seven years later, you get to year 6 they are down to one form!

Also there can be oddities. And Ashmount is an excellent case in point. In the last few years just before the move to a new building was confirmed, the school was undersubscribed. So basically in current years 3 to 5 there are vacancies, so if you have a child in one of those years now and you want a place in the general area, you should look at Ashmount. The Op certainly should, as if she liked the school, that would solve the problem for both her children....

Yes, Campsbourne and St Mary's at Hornsey also worth considering.

That's really interesting nlondondad. That makes sense that there will be vacancies further up Ashmout. I understand that it does get easier to get places, the higher up you get in a school I doubt that the Ashmount vacancies will be something that will benefit me - my son is currently in year 1, so when we move into the area, we'll be looking to get him into year 2 somewhere, or at the very least will definitely need to move him by the time he starts year 3 (sept 2014). I can commute him down to Camden for the rest of his year 2 but will need to find him a place somewhere for year 3.

As an aside, I find it really hard to get info from Haringey council. I've put various calls in in the past to both Islington and Camden - and it's so much easier, you just call up and speak to an admissions officer. With Haringey, the phone number seems to just lead you to a call centre as such and they can't (or won't) ever give out any info. You have to email - and last time I sent them an email, it took 2 months to get a response. Admittedly my enquiries are mostly speculative at the moment - I'm hopeful that once I actually apply, I can get information etc more readily. Who knows though!

GreenEggsandNaiceHam - ah, I think you know the school we are currently at. No, it won't be a full primary in time - that's a few years down the line yet. The kids get allocated to other various schools in Camden, which is a stressful experience in itself. As he has to move school anyway by the end of Year 2, then this seems like the time to move (which we are doing for other reasons). I saw your thread the other day - choosing between schools - I didn't have anything to add but am curious what you decided - maybe I should PM you.

Sorry, thread hijack!

We went for HP, I can't tell you why "out loud" :)

I just tried to PM you GreenEggs but can't work out how to! The "message poster" link doesn't seem to do what it says. Hmm.

newto - Camden council are usually fairly forthcoming with info - and it might be worth ringing Brookfield school (and indeed the schools you mentioned in Islington and Haringey) as they might know of upcoming vacancies - though obviously you would go on any waiting lists in the usual admission criteria order.

@GreenEggsAndNaiceHam

I think two of our postings crossed:

You said "You think Yerbury would have 2 places coming up further up the school? "

Well it has happened before. (in all three schools mentioned not just Yerbury

You said "I would have thought there would be a long waiting list for any available places."

Yes, there is, for Yerbury, as for any other oversubscribed school for RECEPTION. Not so much for later years. People looking for later year (or in year admissions) will usually be people moving into the area. Less usually they will be looking to transfer children out of a school they have decided is unsatisfactory. Of course if they are doing that, then they free up a place in the school they are leaving. I have known that to happen both ways - where a child is transferred out of school A to school B into a place made vacant by the transfer of a child out of B to A.....

You said "It is something to think about OP, other local parents may still be on waiting lists for popular schools, and willing to move their children mid year if places become vacant."

I suppose that MIGHT happen, but most parents are reluctant to change schools once they are established in them, and on the whole, they are right. We (who live in the Whitehall Park area) are fortunate that there are a lot of good schools around, so basically a reason for not moving to a "popular" school is that you would be moving from a "popular" school.

The underlying point, (which was actually made to me by the Head of Yerbury a few years ago ) is that because there is a net outflow of children from Inner London over the primary school years there is a rising surplus of places over all. A bit like playing musical chairs where the number of chairs is constant but the number of players gets smaller. After a while its not just about grabbing the nearest chair when the music stops, but about getting the most comfortable one....

I'm choosing to feel hugely reassured by that nlondondad!

I'm getting myself into a bit of a flap at the moment about what will happen to my son post year 2. I think I need to dial it back a bit and deal with one problem at a time - such as a) selling our house in Camden and b) finding a new place to live, ideally near to a good school, to make application for my younger child into reception easier and then, just hold my nerve for a place to come up for DS. Once DD starts wherever in Sept 2014 then DS would be fairly like to top the waiting list at the school she is at, but by then it will be too late in that I will need him to start somewhere by no later than Sept 2014 anyway. I could always move him twice though I guess (though not ideal). It's reassuring that ad hoc places do come up though.

Oh I see nlondondad. I am too blinkered by the "Yerbury Reception" thing where this year even children living on Yerbury Road didn't get a place. I. Must. Stop. Overthinking.

will pm you lego

DD was at Brookfield from Yr 1 to end of Yr 4 when we moved away.

It's a lovely school in terms of pastoral care, really good sense of community, nice ethos and good mix of kids.

Downsides, in my view, were no school uniform, calling teachers by their first names and lack of structured teaching. There was a good focus on creativity, which was all well and good for subjects like literacy, but basics such as maths fell by the wayside. I hadn't realised quite to what extent until DD moved to another primary school for her last two years at primary and I suddenly realised how much more she achieved when pushed to do so.

Brookfield is good for networking - some noteworthy politicians/singers' children go there!

@legowidow

As I understand it you currently have a daughter who will be applying for a reception place in 2014, you have a son who is currently in year one. You are not sure yet where you are moving to in Crouch End.

I would just comment that if you were to move your son successfully into year two during 2013 - 2014 that would then mean that your daughter had sibling preference for entry into reception in 2014 at the same school.

A point to bear in mind....

PM thing seems to be broken :(

Ah yes, thank you - that's a good point nlondondad. I have thought of that - it would be ideal, though I'm not hopeful about that route coming to fruition. I don't think we'll be able to move until towards the end of this year (need to sell and find a house first!), and I can't see a place coming up for my son straight away - so if there isn't a place then I'll commute him back to Camden for the rest of Year 2. I will have to apply for DD by Jan '14 and I'm not optimistic of a place having come up for my son at a preferred choice by then. I know that I could just move into the borough and they would have to place him - but if the option is e.g. a school at the opposite end of the borough e.g. in Tottenham, then I'll keep him where he is until the end of Year 2. But at that point, I'll have to take what there is.

a noteworthy singers child goes to Campsbourne ;)

@legowidow

I see your point, you would probably be applying for a place for your daughter, for six schools in order of your preference BEFORE your son has a place in a Crouch End School but also before you have an address in Crouch End to apply from. You really do need to check out exactly what the rules are.

perhaps Haringey will be more communicative by end of July when most of this years admissions round over, but if you still have a problem contact a Crouch End Councillor.

nlondondad - Sorry, I wasn't clear - I realise that I'll need to have a Crouch End (or wherever it is we move to!) address before I apply. That's the aim anyway - to have moved before application date. Though I think that I'll be cutting it a bit fine on that one - depending on how quickly we sell our house etc. What do you mean re checking out the rules? I would have thought that that will just be a standard application (I don't think that you need to be resident for a particular amount of time first do you?) Yes, you are correct that I'll probably be applying for DD before DS has a place. Therein lies the rub.

It's all so fiddly that part of me thinks we should stay where we are for a few years BUT we'll only have the lottery of where he gets moved to in Camden anyway, so it's six of one and half a dozen of the other really.

GreenEggs - Campsbourne is definitely on my radar of schools in the borough that I'm hopeful that I could get DS into even if I didn't get him into the preferred school closest to us. (I'm intrigued re the singer - give us a clue!) So much depends on where we move to - I'm putting the cart before the horse somewhat (though I will aim to move somewhere close to a good school obviously)

I've totally hijacked this thread - sorry OP. I will ask my friend at Brookfield if she's heard anything re any upcoming vacancies.