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Original poster

Am I mad to choose DS's school without ever visiting it?

52 replies

threeleftfeet · 18/08/2012 20:28

We're househunting. We've visited the schools near us and know the ones we like.

But a lovely house has come up in a place we hadn't considered.

I know nothing about the local school, except the following:

It's rated good with Ofsted.
It's a village school, and CofE.

We're atheists and if I had a choice I'd send him to a secular school - and indeed the next nearest school in the nearby town is rated outstanding and is secular. However I feel strongly that if your DC are going to feel part of village life it's probably not a great idea send to ship them out to a school in town when there's a good one on your doorstep which all the other DCs go to.

If we want this house we're going to need to act fast I think.

When looking at schools in our town i felt that the ethos was important and that's not really something that's easy to get a good feel for without actually visiting is it?

Am we mad to consider it? How do I find out what the school's really like without visiting it? (We don't know anyone in that village).

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IwishIwasinLondon · 18/08/2012 20:31

It would be preferable to visit first, but not essential IMO.

Where is it?

Original poster
threeleftfeet · 18/08/2012 20:35

The school's Pevensey and Westham C.E. Primary School

Here's the Ofsted

What are your impressions?

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onedev · 18/08/2012 20:38

My boys go to a CoE school & I love it but the one thing I would say is that God & the Christian message is taught a lot. As I said, I love the school & it's not an issue for us as we believe in God, but if you don't believe, then you may be upset at how much time is spent on God & Bible stories.

Ketuk · 18/08/2012 20:39

Term begins again in 2 weeks time.
If you like the house when you've seen it, put in an offer.
You can withdraw after youve seen the school if it's that bad.

Original poster
threeleftfeet · 18/08/2012 22:26

thanks for the replies :)

Onedev I'm happy for DS to learn bible stories as so much of our culture, especially literature - has bible references.

But I wonder how much it would be respected that he's an atheist child? Are the DCs expected to believe in your experience?

Ketuk. There's another house we're interested in too. if we go for this house and then change our minds we'll most likely lose out on the other one too. So the pressure's on!

If the school's terrible of course we won't stick with it. But we could just go with the other one if this is too much of a risk.

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Original poster
threeleftfeet · 18/08/2012 22:28

It's a standard CofE state school rather than a special funded one (what are they called?)

Does that make a difference?

(Never considered a religious school before so I'm clueless about this stuff!)

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onedev · 18/08/2012 22:34

I'm not sure re differences in CoE schools, I just know I've been surprised by how much my Reception child has specifically learnt re Jesus, God & generally about Bible stories. As mentioned, we believe in God so it's not an issue for us but he has learnt a lot & he also believes everything the teacher says as true fact - again not an issue for us but if your DC believes their teacher & you tell them something different, they may feel very conflicted.
Good luck, however you proceed Smile.

Original poster
threeleftfeet · 18/08/2012 22:50

Hmm, yes it could call problems I guess.

I'm going to be honest with DS about our beliefs so I guess it could well cause conflict. I will be very clear that it's just a story.

On previous threads about CoE schools people have tried to convince me that some CoE schools are less religious than some non-religious schools! I was always a but Hmm about that! But it makes sense it does come down to the individual school.

I wish this was happening in a couple of weeks. Or that I had a crystal ball!

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onedev · 18/08/2012 22:55

I can't comment on other schools as I only have experience of the one my boys attend but I commented as I was originally surprised by how much my Reception child knew that we hadn't told him about & think that if I were atheist, I don't think I would like it.

It is tough to know though & if you move, you could initially send your child & then change school if it's not for you. Good luck.

FallenCaryatid · 18/08/2012 22:57

OFSTED report looks good, tweaking things rather than major weaknesses.

Dysgu · 18/08/2012 23:01

Just to add - I work in a CE school where we do a lot of God and Bible 'stuff'

DD1 goes to a community primary school (our nearest school) and seems to have done at least as much 'stuff' about God and the Bible and takes everything her teacher and headteacher have told her as being true.

Original poster
threeleftfeet · 18/08/2012 23:12

btw, this is the school by the other house we're interested in.

Great school. But the house isn't as nice!

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Original poster
threeleftfeet · 18/08/2012 23:22

"OFSTED report looks good" i though so :)

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mariammariam · 19/08/2012 00:26

It looks nice and friendly. I would ring someone random from the area, like the churchwarden, library or pharmacy and quiz them about the school. No point trying the estate agent, as they'll obviously say the schools are great!

BreconBeBuggered · 19/08/2012 00:37

The school will be expected to live by its Christian ethos; however having had one child in an alleged secular school and one in a CofE one, it doesn't seem to me there is much difference in the amount of time focused on Bible stories and worship. My DC are both atheists (I'm agnostic), and whilst they didn't/don't argue the point at school, there was never a question of them taking any of it as the literal truth.

onedev · 19/08/2012 00:39

Apologies if I threw an erroneous spanner in the works - I didn't realise there was so much Christian religion taught in secular schools & thought this happened as we had chosen a CoE school. Smile

BlinkersOn · 19/08/2012 00:57

I would do this if need be. I would read up as much as I could and then probably not worry about it too much. I agree that it's best to send them to the local village school. We sent our two youngest to a school that we had not visited when we returned to the UK from overseas. It was the local comp and it turned out that the Ofsted report was very accurate. The DC's all settled very well.
Our family are atheists but our DC's attended a catholic junior school and a 'Christian' high school when we lived overseas. They learnt a lot of stuff that I found pointless but we weren't too concerned. I dont think it mattered too much.

Original poster
threeleftfeet · 19/08/2012 08:34

"I didn't realise there was so much Christian religion taught in secular schools"

It really depends on the school. I guess it could be said that there's actually no such thing as a non-religious or secular school in England and Wales - even though we think of them as so (I'm not sure of the rules in Scotland / NI) as there's an obligation for them to provide worship which is Christian in nature (this is very often in assembly).

(Ironically there's no such obligation on religious schools!)

However in practice this is interpreted in very different ways. One "non-religious" schools near us has a Christian head. They have hymns in assembly and prayer. (This is not one of our preferred schools)

Another school here fulfils their requirements by having a session where they encourage the children to have quiet time and think of "wonder and awe". They explore ideas about morality in an age-appropriate way. No one mentions Jesus or God in the context of "worship". (This is one of our preferred schools.)

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snowball3 · 19/08/2012 08:37

There is no such thing as a secular school. All schools, whether Cof E or not, have to teach RE and have to have a daily act of worship

Original poster
threeleftfeet · 19/08/2012 08:37

I really don't know much about CoE schools however. Except that when I've mentioned preferring not to send DS to one on the grounds that we're not religious, some mumsnetters previously have tried to convince me that actually they're not necessarily that religious at all! I must say I wasn't convinced!

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Original poster
threeleftfeet · 19/08/2012 08:40

"There is no such thing as a secular school. All schools, whether Cof E or not, have to teach RE and have to have a daily act of worship"

Indeed snowball but like i said it's open to interpretation. An atheist head may interpret the requirement so that it's done without any explicit mention of Christianity. In the school I mentioned above, they don't call it prayer.

An Christian head may simply encourage explicitly Christian worship - inviting children to pray and teaching them Christian hymns and the Lord's Prayer for example.

The two approaches are worlds apart.

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Original poster
threeleftfeet · 19/08/2012 08:45

Also, teaching RE is not the same as encouraging DCs to believe.
In a school with a Christian ethos it may be taught as truth. In a school with a secular ethos, it may be taught without any pressure to believe.

My SIL is an atheist RE teacher. She is bemused by how often people assume she's religious because she teaches RE.

He line is that of course she's not religious, as she's actually studied this stuff in some depth! she finds it absolutely fascinating and is by all accounts a great teacher.

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Original poster
threeleftfeet · 19/08/2012 08:45

*her!

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IWanders · 19/08/2012 08:49

Just thought I would say we are in a similar position, of moving home and not knowing what the catchment school is like apart from the website and hmie and it is quite a strange feeling as I viewed the current primaries my dd is in plus we will be moving from England to Scotland and schools have already started there.

I must say though we are happy she will be leaving her cofe school its a lovely school but it doesn't respect that we try to teach pagan values as I was raised, as much as dd comes home and says God makes rainbows and rain, well no he doesn't rainbows are prisms and rain is percipitation but hey ho. She is also taught about heaven and hell and as a family we don't have hell in our religion, I was never told about hell as a child and I am glad I never was. She also does a lot of hymns and the school is very socially moral. But we viewed the school and never picked up on this. I also thought it wouldn't bother me but it did as although it was teaching her values it undermined my parenting which was a bit annoying.

So I say you can never tell as a school will tell you what you want to hear and it won't be for awhile until you realise what exactly your child is being taught in terms of religion. If you love the house and the school looks warm and friendly then it should be a good bet that it will be a great school and you might just have to do a few parental tweaks at home regarding religion.

IndigoBell · 19/08/2012 08:53

Both the secular schools my kids go to have a vicar come in every month to do an assembly.

One of them took the kids to church 3 times a year.

The kids certainly came home thinking the Christian bible stories were true.

I'm sure that's a lot less than at the local CofE school. But here we have a choice. If you're in a village with one school, ie not much competition, I think it will be pretty random how religious it is.

Also, there are far, far, far more important things to get your knickers in a twist about. Eg whether or not they learn to read.

A CofE education won't permanently damage your children, and certainly won't turn them Christian.