Absence during term time

[tamzin12]

I have just received a fine for taking my child out of school for 6 days during term time ( last week of school). I am a travel agent and dont believe fines should be given if parents dont take the mickey. My child has a 98 % attendence and has just acheived level 5 to go to high school in Sept. I have done a bit of research and it seems East Sussex Coounty council have no lee way and just fine - and dont give the 10 days absence as most of the other councils seem to do in the rest of the country. I did not sign the offical form or hand one in. I just gave in a typed letter stating family commentements. Is this fine legal. as I have not signed anything in the first place.? I would be grateful of some comments, and whether to take this further and refuse to pay- as per my comments above. thanks

So good it posted twice...

Well I usually keep mine working until the thurs simply because I don't like the chaos but it is rarely new stuff, usually stuff like science quizzes etc. but I think it would be quite disingenuous for us as teachers to pretend that the vast majority of schools do not wind down in the last week, many having DVDs during that week and 'toy day' on the last day.

This would annoy me no end. I don't think it's unreasonable to take a child out for the last week of term. But you should have filled in the form. Quote the Human Rights Act at them. Which says you are entitled to a family life. That seems to work for everything else.

Is this just an english thing as being from Scotland I never hear of anyone being fined for taking their kids out of school for holidays. Someone i know took her kids out for three weeks for once in a lifetime holiday to Disneyland no problem.

We cram so much teaching in to every day it drives me mad when children miss weeks here and there. Extenuating circumstances I agree with, death, wedding etc but a week in turkey, no!!!! Especially when the child is struggling with school anyway... (not saying yours is OP, sounds like the opposite.)

(Perhaps, to blur threads a bit, that's why so many Olympians come from private schools - no fuss about authorising absences for training and competition there).

Much easier to do that out of 17 weeks' holiday though

I don't think a few days per year hurts tbh and I would pay £100 to save a grand or two! It's also a bit of a moot point considering the number of childhood illnnesses etc a child could easily be off with chicken pox or or a sicky bug for a week. If their education is that critical to a few days then really the school year should be more than 38 weeks or the day should be 30 mins longer. It's an example of the minority of parents taking the piss and taking their DC out for weeks per year spoiling it for the majority of sensible people

In Scotland Attendance Orders are issued rather than fines (I think)

olympicpark I totally agree with your point about cramming until the last minute with every lesson. In secondary it is particularly infuriating when you are preparing for public exams which seem to start earlier and earlier each year. You prepare for a really important lesson only to discover that a third of the class are going to be absent because they are on a vitally important Econoimics trip to Disneyland Paris for three days, or the A level statistics group are at Thorpe Park. Most school trips are genuinely 'enriching' for the students and a valuable use of time but some are, to be quite frankly honest, a school sponsorted jolly (not to mention a pain in the backside for the staff expected to teach meaningful lessons to the rest of the class without 'disadvantaging' the absentees).

As a teacher I can clearly see the link between poor attendance and poor performance, but fining parents for taking their children out of school for one week at the end of term? Who can seriously justify this? What about all those parents who keep their children at home because they have colds? As a form tutor I lost count of the number of absence letters excusing little Jonny from school because he had a 'heavy cold'. If I took a day of school every day I had a cold I would, quite rightly, be sacked for poor attendance.

Anyway, I could go on and on about this.....

It's the school holidays - I shouldn't be getting so worked up about school policies and procedures.

I hate people like the OP. They break the law then act they're Nelson Madela. Maybe U2 could do a benefit gig to raise the money to pay the fine. Remind me why doesn't the law apply to you?

Good point radical shall we ban any school talk! fears wouldnt survive long before school related guff pops out !!!!

I have a problem next year as I work in a different LA to my dc. Two half terms and Easter hols are different. I can't take time off in term time, so the only time we can go on holiday together is the summer holidays (which are different so only 4 weeks together). We usually go away Easter and a couple of half terms so the kids miss out this year. My husband can only have 1 week off in the summer holidays. Gutted :(

The law says this:

7: Duty of parents to secure education of children of compulsory school age

The parent of every child of compulsory school age shall cause him to receive efficient full-time education suitable?

a: to his age, ability and aptitude, and

b: to any special educational needs he may have,

either by regular attendance at school or otherwise.

Therefore education is compulsory in England, but attendance at school is not. I am wondering how this is reconciled with the introduction of fines?

I have taken two hols in school year this year. No fine and unrepentant.

Its total discrimination. There is no way I could ever afford a holiday during the school holidays

Same here. But as I work for a school it's tough shit, I have to take my holidays during my unpaid summer holidays. So sorry no sympathy for anyone else.

'What we do with our children is up to us. Travel is a great way to broaden the mind and learn new languages, new cultures etc. '

Wouldn't that be lovely? But nine times out of ten all they can tell you is that they stayed in a hotel with a pool and the amount of icecreams and fast food they've eaten. Most can't tell you the name of the town, and meet no indigenous inhabitants other than English speaking staff, let alone do anything cultural.

But their Mum wil have inevitably demanded reams of worksheets before they left - because you can complete any sheet without any teaching input at all you know.

I refuse, and say 'write a diary (if you must)'.

I once gave a particularly challenging parent the edited plans for the fortnight, showing what her DD would have covered instead of the worksheets she wanted.
That's what she's missing, that's what you can cover.

riverside whatever inside info you have is wrong.
every single person who doesn't pay the fine is given plenty of oppourtunity to pay and then a distress warrant is issued by the magistrates court. every time

And I have actual knowledge of that.

"Therefore education is compulsory in England, but attendance at school is not. I am wondering how this is reconciled with the introduction of fines?"

It's the "regular attendance at school" bit. If enrolled in a state school, the child must attend. There have been various education Acts which cover this. I'll check the date of the one introducing fines (and even imprisonment) - early days of the previous Govt, I think.

You can opt for private school or to HE instead.

Our school/LEA hasn't got particularly heavy on this yet (although I think they're about to this coming year) but there was nothing we could do about the child in my class this last year who had loads of dodgy absences - every Friday/Monday either side of holidays, plus 2 individual weeks, plus her birthday (where she told everyone she was going to a theme park). Parent was phoned each morning - didn't answer. When pressed for explanatory notes on return to school we'd get a scribbled "absent because ill."

No action taken.

OP, the absence was unauthorised. There has been plenty of warning about the potential of being fined if you take unauthorised absences, so the responsibility lies with you.

It just seems we all live in a nanny state!!. What we do with our children is up to us. Travel is a great way to broaden the mind and learn new languages, new cultures etc. Looks like I will have to pay , but next year Ill phone them in sick!!!

Learning about new cultures and languages does not happen when you lie by the pool/beach at a hotel, nor does it broaden your mind! Where did you go on holiday? Peru? Safari in Africa? Or, as I suspect, was it by a beach in Spain/Greece/Turkey/etc? I would love for you to prove me wrong, but I believe your holiday with the DC was more about sun, sea and sand and less about culture, learning language and broadening the mind...

Bunny, what a great idea for a review session!
I could create an extended question paper for the child to complete as homework, relating to the country they have just been culturally enriched by!
EuroDisney and Disneyland travellers might find it a bit hard to complete though.

we never make any pretence about "cultural" education when away, but it is very simplistic to say it does not happen. We have been to both Disney Paris and Florida - staying in a villa each time in a local community - so yep, you do get immersed...

Try speaking English in central France outside the parks and see just how far you get. Then get your pretty little daughters to speak French - even a few words and see every single door open.....

And one of the girls best memories of Florida was eating steamed crab claws from a riverside shack watching the manatees surface near Homosassa - not every day is spent in the theme parks - you'd go nuts (and need another holiday to get over it!)!!!

Kent operate this system. When my friend telephoned after receiving a fine they said they would not chase the money as the cost to the taxpayer would be disproportionate to the money recouped.

If it is because of persistant unauthorised absence they would take action.

Personally I would just pay the fine. Still cheaper than going away in school hols.