Teachers how do you like Y2 children to work out number bonds -20?

[MrsHeffley]

Dd needs work on these but I've no idea how to get her to work out the more tricky ones eg 15-9. They don't seem to be allowed number lines so I'm stumped.Dd says she's allowed to use her fingers but that seems clumsy and open to errors.

TIA

I would expect most of my class to know 5+9 (as instant recall ) then add 10 some would probably do 15+10-1

My boys just got all this naturally,dd is finding it harder.So when she's fumbling with fingers should I say work out 5 and 9 then add 10 ie tell her how to do it?

Should I tell her to leave her fingers alone?

Also how do you get number bonds to 20 into them?Is it worth doing lists of them either in order or muddled?Wondering if a bit of 10s and units might help ie show her that the 1 equals 10(kind of hoping she knows)already.Teacher not into number lines,not sure why.

What about 15 subtract 9?

In our school they mix the two classes up and into 2 halves.She's always been in the top half but has moved down(it all came out in floods this morning) just before breaking up.Pissed off I wasn't told but that's a whole other thread,if I had a bit more info it would be helpful.She has zero confidence re maths and I don't want to add to it but thought a bit of a boost might help her confidence to go back with.

Just want to boost her confidence,she feels crap.

Many thanks btw.

Mrs. Heffley:

If you're struggling and your DD has no confidence I would heartily recommend Mathsfactor.

1. Carol Vorderman is enthusiastic and endlessly positive in teaching (the beauty of video)
2. examples are clear and very visual
3. there's a lot of repetition so your child really firmly grasps concepts.

2 years ago my DD came home with 5 maths sum (10 - 1, 12 - 4, 11 - 6, kind of things) and couldn't do a single one. I was really shocked - I didn't get angry but my DD could see I couldn't believe she couldn't do any of that at all (this was march of Y2). She just said it's o.k. Mummy, Mrs X says I'm no good at maths.

Lots of bruh -hah -hah latter - we opted to support maths at home and went with mathsfactor. We've never looked back.

There's a one month free trial - so why not just give it a try and see (the beauty of this method is that for roughly 1 - 2 hours a week (5 homeworks) the maths keeps building and building and basically you have to do very little direct support yourself, save typing which now my DD is in Y4 she's more keen to do herself because my typing is 'too slow'.

Info here: www.themathsfactor.com/

Sincerely - we were in total despair about maths with DD1 - and this has turned things around completely. DD1 totally knows her stuff now, she's fast and she's accurate. She's also progressively moved up the ranks from bottom to top table - which has made her proud as punch. Given the low standards of maths tuition at our school, I'm not surprised - but I'm thrilled she's learning her basics (addition, subtraction, multiplication and division) soundly, which was all I ever wanted.

HTH

It looks good but being an ex primary teacher I feel I should be able to do it myself(and save the cash)however I am starting to have my doubts!!!!

It's much harder to teach your own child than to teach a class full of other people's children

So what should I do,I feel like crying myself let alone dd?

If Kumon is out are there any good tutors/courses etc?How do you rate Mathsfactor?Don't want to pay a fortune on something if there is a better(cheaper) way preferred by teachers.

Think I'm going to have to except I'm going to get f* all info from school(looooong story) so I'm on my tod with a bright dd who feels crap and has zero maths confidence.

The fingers thing is bugging me,don't know what to suggest to her.It just seems that fumbling and counting back/on on such big sums is going to end in errors.

Do I need to go over and over the number bonds or focus on strategies(if so has anybody got a complete list of the preferred ones now)?I've been out of this 8 years and it all seems to have changed.Don't want to teach the wrong way as I know it could make things worse.

Oh and I have PMT too!!!!!!!

Personally I try not to recommend anything to parents involving subscriptions
www.year2maths.co.uk/

www.iboard.co.uk/curriculum.htm#maths-year3numstrategy_yearyear2

www.andrelleducation.co.uk/shop/bm-resources/

www.andrelleducation.co.uk/shop/bm-resources/

mrz - are there any other websites for other years - years 3 & 4? - which are the same as www.year2maths.co.uk?

I'm afraid not although the parent site has things that are appropriate for other year groups

www.primarytopics.co.uk/maths/index.htm

yes.... much easier to teach someone else's child... you don't feel the same urge to throttle them when they disengage their brain and come out with the first number they thought of...

Yes last week I had to refrain myself from screaming "use the strategies you know" whilst thumping my head on the table.

Why are they not allowed to use number lines op????

I have had a lot of success getting children to recall number bonds quickly by using games on the whiteboard - for example hit the button

Start off with them knowing 5+5, then 9+1/1+9, then get them to learn and recall 8+2/2+8, with loads of practice till they are really fast. Then move onto if 5+5=10, 15+5/5+15=20.... You need to do it slowly, with loads of practice if she is struggling to get quick recall.

I really don't know.I suggested a while back to her teacher that I get out a no line and got a defo neg response.Very experienced teacher so I'm not going to quibble.

Do you think it would do any harm,anybody got any idea why they're not keen on them or prefer other strategies?

I assumed the teacher was looking for instant recall as BTM says (that's what I want from my class) but it doesn't explain why fingers are allowed

Maybe she wants her to develop quick recall, rather than the strategy of using a number line to work them out.

OP No number lines in year 2??

Why?

Well dd says she's allowed to use her fingers but let's just say it wasn't the most productive session so I gave her the benefit of the doubt.

So if it isn't an instant recall what are the favoured strategies?(doubles,bonds to 10 and 10s,multiples of ten from any given no then take 1 , 2etc as appropriate).It's hard to explain when she's not coming up with the ideas herself.Her brothers just did it.When you haven't taught them or know a focus it's hard.

Her teacher is fierce(but kind underneath) so getting any detail hard but dp and I am going in as all we got on her report was "LittleHeffley has made pleasing progress"

When dd1 told me in November (also yr2) that her maths table just seemed to discuss macdonalds, and I quizzed her further I realised that despite 'doing fine' she was actually behind in maths, I looked on the book people cos I love ordering books and found some ks1 books which we worked through, in particular there was a rules of maths workbook which was great. Now doing some ks2 mental maths books at home. She went up to middle table in maths, which in her aspirational MC swotty class is good. The main difference was in her confidence and her view of herself as being able to do maths.

Can you try asking your sons to articulate how they would solve the problem? Depending on your dd you could have a discussion over dinner, just asking everyone to articulate how they would add up/take away different numbers. I think (as a person with a statistical background but not a primary school teacher); everyone probably has their own strategy which works for them, maybe she needs to try a few. For 15-9 I personally would take five away from both sides, turning it into a more palatable 10-4. Not sure it is a prescribed approach but it works for me!

See what you mean by different strategies. Yours makes my head spin - and mine will probably make your head spin!

For nines, I do take away ten and add one back on. ie 15-9 = 15-10 +1

Mrz - do tell us what is recommended......

Another vote for the maths factor. My daughter is in year 4 now and has been doing it for 7 months. I really wish we'd started sooner. She had very little confidence with maths but has improved and moved up a maths group at school with all the practice.