Don't know whether to go state or private for Reception - September 2012

[HappyAsEyeAm]

We have a nearly 4 yo DS (think PFB, but I am trying to move on!) who will start Reception in September 2012. I am also pg with baby number 2. DS currently goes to a lovely little pre-school, without a primary school attached.

We are toying between starting him in state school or private school. We have applied for both to keep our options open. We don't have experience of either school, as all of our friends have first born children the same age as him or younger, so nobody we can ask for first hand opinions really. We don't know any children going to either school. Both schools are within walking distance of our house.

State - 2 form entry for the past 10 years, so a fairly big school. Excellent results, and Ofsted rate it as Good with many Outstanding features. We went to an open morning and we were impressed by the facilities, indoors and out, the children were very personable and confident, lots of intersting activities going on there, very recent artwork etc on the walls. Very impressive overall. It is very oversubscribed, and there will be 30 children per class.

Private - Ofsted rate it as Outstanding, the facilities are better indoors (science lab, kitchens to do cookery in, amazing IT facilities), not as much outdoor space (but definitely still enough), maximum 20 children per class, impressive teaching staff and resources, I liked the headteacher very much, very happy children, lots of children going on to state grammars from there at 11.

The private school costs £9,500 a year for reception plus whatever extras the children are signed up for eg music lessons. We can afford to pay this, and we could afford it for baby number 2 in 5 years time too. We would have to make sacrifices (like cheap holidays and having one older car), but we could afford it. It would mean that our mortgage would take longer to pay off though.

I am horribly torn. DS is timid, sweet and sensitive. But he also loves other children, making friends and is very imaginative. My heart says that he will be far better suited to a small setting (smaller class size), but I also know that he has been protected from a lot of rough and tumble, and maybe he needs to learn to survive in a less sheltered environment.

I am also conscious that if we start him at private school, it would be more difficult to transfer him to the state school as it is so oversubscribed. But if he started at state school, I can't see the private school being so full as to turrn him away.

I can't seem to make a decision.

I would go with the state option - both may be in walking distance for you, but it's likely that a lot of the pupils at the private school will be coming from further away, so he won't have as much chance of making local friends there.

The fact that he's a quiet and sensitive child doesn't mean that state school will be a struggle for him - if you were happy with the school atmosphere and the way the children behaved on your visit, then there's no need to think he'll find it difficult there.

And I feel that state for primary gives you more options later on - from my experience on MN, I'd say that parents who use private schools for primary find it pretty much impossible to imagine using a state school later. Whereas if you start out with state, and your child gets on fine there, then you have the option of either continuing with state schools or going private at secondary age.

I would apply to both schools. As the state school is very oversubscribed there may be a possibility that your ds won't get a place which would make the decision for you.
A 2 class entry school (60 per year group) isn't really that large and gives a lot of scope for making friends who live locally. The general consensus is that private education matters most for older children secondary and above. HTH

If it would be a stretch sending two children to private prep school, wouldn't it be better to save up a bit of money now and send them to a very good state primary, leaving your options more open for later on, if the state options at a later stage are dire? You wouldn't want to run out of cash avoiding the very good state primary school and then have to send your child to a dive of a secondary school because there aren't any other options open to you. Bear in mind, anyway, that private school fees go up dramatically the older the child gets - you may just about be able to afford the fees when your children are under 8, but then it will get more expensive, and then more expensive still...

My dss go to a two-form entry state primary and I am now fully sold on two-form entry, good school being a very desirable option. It allows far more flexibility within a state school's budget for tailored teaching to meet the needs of all sorts of children, given that it will be able to employ more staff and move them (and the children) about more creatively.

Nothing is ever perfect, of course, but that would be my choice.

Can you afford prep school for both your DCs because you have a trust fund or a heap of reserved savings? Because if your ability to pay for the school is dependent on earning, I would recommend going with the good state school that you have on the doorstep. Also, if you are in a grammar school area, you may want to save your money for later in case either of them does not pass the 11+.

9.5k for 20 in a private Reception class doesn't sound like a particularly good deal to me, dd only had 14 at that age. The cost will increase significantly over the next 6 years, by inflation+ and as he progresses up the school. Do make sure you can cover it and have reserves in the bank as it coudl be a long commitment .

Agree with riverside mum
(and think you live near me )
State secondaries in grammar areas can be very poor. If your DC are borderline and don't pass the 11+ you may feel the secondaries are unacceptable. Save your money for this!
Of course, they are more likely to pass at private but they just might not be bright enough. This won't change wherever you choose.
In your position I would go state. Spend on extra curricula like football or karate and ballet and pay for a tutor to get through 11+
Is it top 20% grammar or a super selective area?

Do you live near enough to be assured of getting a state school place?

As you liked the state school I'd suggest going for that and saving the cash for secondary

All else being equal and given that you can afford why not go private? What else would you do with the money apart from better holidays and newer car?

With respect to saving cash for secondary - this is far more expensive in most cases so may not be equivalent. The private sector is much more likely to prepare for entry into private secondary than the state.

DS in class of 16 - which is great; very good behaviour lots of comraderie; lots of individual attention.We went on a waiting list for a state school having not got a place but turned it down even though for us private isn't a financially comfortably option.

Am going to say the exact opposite to wobblypig. They both sound like lovely schools, so why commit yourself to paying £9500 per year when you can get a great school for free!

We were in the same position as you this time last year, dithering between the local very good primary and the local private school.

We ended up at the private school and have been delighted with it, really happy now we made that choice. Smaller classes, smaller school overall (under 200 in total) so everyone knows everyone else, excellent sporting facilities and outstanding teaching and clubs. And one term in, tellingly, most of the parents at the private school are happy too, but most of our friends at the local primaries are not so happy overall.

I would suggest that if you aren't sure at this stage, then you need to go back to both schools and ask more questions until you are sure, one way or another.

We had the same dilemna two years ago!.

dd started at state school, with a view to moving in Year 3, which would be the usual time to start Prep. school. However, we had some issues with the school and ended up moving her at the start of Year 2.

The differences stand out a mile, things like reading everyday, smaller class sizes, more PE/outdoor stuff, more structure to the day. The move went well and she had a little bit of catching up to do, mainly with spellings ad writing, although I do wonder if she would be a higher achiever if she had what she has now for those first two years.

While she is in the right school now, we have in fact saved £18,000 sending her to a state school until this September, which is a huge amount. We have just paid another £2,300 for the forthcoming term and although we can afford it, it does hurt to see that sort of money going out for an education that we should be able to get free (but didn't!). But hey, we are lucky to be able to do it at all.

If the state school can give you much the same and you are confident of that, then I would suggest to go down that route and reassess. It is so difficult to make an informed decision, when like us, you have no prior knowledge, you also have no idea how your child will respond to school, our dd could have thrived in her state school, but it very obviously wasn't right for her in the end, hence the change.

I have said it before and say it again, choosing her education has been the biggest and hardest decision we have had to make for her to date - I don't envy you!

Go the good state.
I wish I had your option - where we live primaries are either dire or catholic and oversubscribed (with no way for an agnostic family to send their child in).

...go FOR the good state...

Been there, got the t-shirt. We put our two children in a pre-prep school - was a very similar cost to the one you quote. We could afford it although we had less luxuries that year, only one holiday etc. The payment of school fees became a frustration very quickly and in the end we realised we would not be able to keep up with this burden for another 20+ years (including university). We would have struggled on but we were lucky - our son hated it there and so we pulled them out after one year and put them in the outstanding state school. My son absolutely LOVED LOVED LOVED that school - and thrived so much more. It is all personal and in the beginning we were totally all for private and thought putting them in state would be a really sad day. Now we would never go back down the private route. Yes, they have wonderful facilities and resources and I still believe that if you can afford it, it is a no-brainer. But I do not believe it is worth making lots of sacrifices and giving up holidays and struggling on when there is a good school up the road. Good luck with your decision. It is a really confusing time and I don't envy you.

Thanks for all the replies. Its very reassuring to her your experiences and benefit forom your empathy! In answer to the questions:

We would be paying the school fees out of earnings. We have some savings, but not enough by any means to pay two lots of school fees through to 18. But we both have fairly secure jobs and earn good salaries.

We are apparently within the same catchment area that has applied to the school for the last 5 years, so although the sibling numbers might fluctuate, we are seemingly as certain as you can be of getting a place at the state school of our choice.

If we weren't paying school fees, we would be spending the money on overpayments on the mortgage. Paying school fees wouldn't impact on our lifestyle (could sill afford holidays, albeit cheaper ones, could still afford a car, albeith a slightly older one, could still comfortably afford to buy all that we do now in every other respect).

We have the option of sending DS to the kindergartern in the private school for ten weeks before we have to accept the state school place. So we could see what we think of it and how he gets on.

always go for state first and move if/when you don't like it. It's nuts not to try out the good free option - what I did and dcs still there three years on, despite me thinking dc1 would probably only last a term.

Private primary only if state primary is poor or poor for your particular child.
Know two very bright siblings who had a horrible time at a normally very good village school because HT didn't do GT well at all.
Mum returned to work and they scrimped for private primary and then a very good state secondary.
I would save your money and use it where it will do most good. Whether that is on secondary, 11+ tutoring, GCSE tutoring, private secondary, a brilliant 6th form or university.

I thought I'd update you on our decision

If anyone is interested, we decided to start DS at state school in September, and see how he gets on. If he adjusts well, then great. If not, we can swap to the private school then.

Decision made, but not sure its the right one! Time will tell, and its all with the best of intentions.

We did the same with our DD and she is flourishing.

We knew she was bright and she is achieving excatly what I would have expected for her at this age. She is really benefitting from being very much 'part' of the community in the town we live in and I think she is enjoying doing really well and being recognised for it.

I do think primary schools have changed a lot in the last few years. Ours is very much focused on the ability of each child and ensuring that they all achieve to their ability. They are also streamed in Reception, which was one of the first thiings to really reassure me that my own (outdated, of course) experience of primary school (if you were bright basically just messing about or doing mysterious 'Cards' until everyone else caught up ) was no longer the case.

Hope her does well!

If the state school is good - go for it, and use the money you save to fund the inevitable swimming/ballet/karate/violin lessons.

We sent ours to a lovely state school and haven't looked back.

It's always better once the decision is made!!!

I think you have done the right thing, the state school may be everything you want it to be and he will thrive, but if not, then you have the option to move and I can rassure you that actually moving is much easier than thinking about it!

I was sorry to move dd from her state, despite it not being right for her, as she made some good friends from our village, however, she had two full years with those friends and still sees them, so that part of going to the local school was a great help and that will be the same for you too.

Best of luck with it, but do be careful that when something doesn't go right, or you are not happy with something the school/teacher does, you don't go into 'we should have gone private' mode!! I think we did a little bit of this to be honest, but then it was the right decision for our dd.

I was in your shoes last year with my PFB summer born, shy, imaginative dd (although the available state school was far from outstanding). We accepted the state school place but kept our options open until August! (Yes, very naughty, I know) We went with the independent school in the end for complex reasons and dd is ridiculously happy there so far.
Word of caution if you send your ds to the nursery part of the private school (which I would recommend to get a proper feel for the place)... Make sure you check the small print of the contract you sign because many places expect you to give a term's notice if you leave or else they assume he will go into reception. Ours had this clause and I gave 'provisional' notice in time to keep our options open a bit longer.

Ah, cross post OP. Good luck!

Mine are both at the local state school. We turned down a prep place for DS and decided to try the state school with a view to moving him if we weren't happy but he has loved school since day one and is doing brilliantly. We didn't even consider another school for DD but it quickly became apparent that the state school was not working out for her but we stayed with it for nearly 3 years hoping things would improve but they haven't and we have now accepted a place at a lovely prep for her. Our youngest will go to the state school, he just sneaks in with a sibling place as DS1 will be in yr6 when he starts. I think he will love it but if not, we will review again.

I would always start with state, it might work out brilliantly and if it doesn't you can move. Like KT9 said, making the decision to move our DD from a lovely state school was the hardest decision we have ever made but it feels like the right thing to do. It does hurt a bit that we are going to be paying nearly £10k a year for DD's education when her brother is getting a great education for free but her happiness is paramount and the plan is to move her back into state at 11.