What advice would you give for putting a 6 year old home educated child with SEN's into school?

[mummyloveslucy]

Hi, my 6.5 year old daughter has been home educated for the past year now. She went to a private school from the age of 2 to the second term in year1. She loved the nursery and reception but didn't get on at all well in year1. She has some special educational needs which are mainly related to speech, language and a general developmental delay in most areas. She also has a problem with incontinence of both kinds. This is due to long term constipation and she's now seing a nurse for bowel and bladder training. This is the main worry I have with her going to school. She used to hold it all day at school, which made things a lot worse. Then have the occasional accident. The children did laugh at her for this and I think she felt a bit of an out cast.

We're looking for a flexi school place at first, she may decide to go FT at some point. She wants to go to school to make friends, that's her only reason. I think it'd be good for both of us as I really need a break. She's an only child and it can be so draining having to be her play mate as well as everything else.

I've contacted 3 schools and I'll be having a look around them with my DH and daughter soon. We've seen them before in the past, but need to speek to the Heads re flexi schooling.

What advice would you give me regarding putting her back into school? She doesn't like large groups of children and finds it very hard to concentrate with any kind of background noise. (I know this isn't ideal) I also have concerns about bullying as she is so sensitive. When she was being teased at her old school, she didn't tell anyone. Her behaviour and self esteem were at an all time low. It was actually about 6 months later, she re-enacted a sceen with her dolls where one doll said to the others "Lets run away from Lucy, she's stupid" I talked to her about it and she said "that's what they used to say to me". She realises she's not as accademic as other children and being in school really enthesises that to her.

The problem with a private school is that they tend to have limmited knowledge of special needs and no funding if she needs extra. Whereas a state school has the experience and funding but the classes are perhaps too big. i think maybe the children might be more tollerant to special needs in a state school, as they will have experienced it before.

I know it'll be hard for her at first as she's unable to work independantly at all. I think it used to drive her teacher mad. She will work, if someone is there next to her guiding her through every step. If you walk away, even for a minute she calls you back/ doodles or just walks away (at home) We've been trying to work on this for the past year, without much sucess. She will draw on her own but that's it, and only for a short time.

She doesn't like doing any form of work unless it's made into a game and even then, has a short attention span.

Her special needs are not bad enough to get a statement, so does this mean she wouldn't be entitled to any extra help in school? She is gengrally well behaved. Not desruptive in class, but things just go over her head compleatly and she'll switch off. It's actually hard to know when this has happened as she looks at you as though she's listening, then when you ask her something, it's clear she hasn't understood a word.

I' open to any advice or suggestions really. I want this to go as well as it can and for it to be a positive step for her.

Does she enjoy home ed co-operatives with other groups of children? Would this be a solution to you needing to be everything for her? I home ed. mine and we go to other groups 4 times a week which allows them to socialise on a smaller scale than a class of 30.

I would go and visit some local primary schools and be open about your concerns. If they can't offer her what she needs I'm sure they would be up front about that.

I used to work as a peripatetic piano teacher in a primary school and had a few children come to me who weren't really interested in the piano specifically, but who needed one-to-one attention that they weren't getting and it was a pleasant half an hour for them working with a grownup to achieve something. As long as parents were upfront about that I didn't mind the fact that they weren't progressing as they weren't really old/mature enough. Obviously, they were paying for this time though - it wasn't something the school offered as much as it was something they could access through the school day.

I would work very hard on identifying the local school with the best record on pastoral support and anti-bullying and then arrange a meeting with their head and SENCO (assuming that we are looking at state schools here). Explain the situation and ask how they would deal with it.

Schools can vary enormously- it might be worth trying to get hold of some parents with SEN children and see what their experience has been like.

It is possible to get support without a statement and this is something you should ask the school about. Make sure to have all your paperwork in order in time for the meeting, an independent assessment of your dd's needs, the points you have made here written down clearly with spare copies for the members of staff.

I would also wonder if it might not be time to have another go at pushing for that statement. It seems to me- and I have been following your posts over several years- that Lucy's problems aren't really getting that much easier and that they will impact on her learning in a way that, to me, would seem to warrant a statement. But if not a statement, there's IEPs and School Action and School Action Plus.

Have you chosen a school for Lucy already? If not do any of the schools in your area have language units attached?

I'm thinking that even if her SN aren't sufficient to get a statement the expertise will be on hand in such a setting.

There are three levels if SEN in school - School Action where the school will provide additional support - School Action plus where the school will involve outside agencies (such as SaLt in Lucy's case) to provide further help and Statements which is really a contract of entitlement.

We do go to HE meet ups when we can. I don't drive, so it's not that often we can go. She doesn't really socialise well there either. She'll play with one child but preferes to sit with the adults. She loves having a friend at our house or going to a friends house, but despite an open invitation, she's only has 4 play dates in a year.

Have you applied for a statement already or just been led to believe she would n't get one ? She wouldn't necessarily need a diagnosis to get one. I'd ask what opportunties they could offer for 1-to-1/small group work and even some respite from the classroom if she finds it too much at first. Arrrange to meet the SENCO too to ask what support and contacts they can offer - could she do SALT at school for example, would they help her get a statement etc.

Thank you. So it might be worth trying to get a statment before she starts, or at least get the ball rolling. Would this make it harder to get a flexi school placement though? I know it's down to the discression of the head, but would a statement make it more difficult?

A statement might make it easier because it could be part of the statement that she attends flexi time and the statement can name the school

MLL - you need to apply for a statement.

Being unable to work independently means she needs one.

And when you're looking round the schools tell them you've applied, and are waiting to hear back. (The first stage takes 6 weeks)

Apart from that - go with the school that seem to want her the most. Don't worry about how big or small or anything else it is.

I think you need to talk to the head teacher and SENCO of each school to see what they can offer Lucy. I think you need to read the OFSTED reports, but ultimately go on gut feeling. It sounds if Lucy desperately needs help with developing her social skills. (meant it the nicest of ways)

Does Lucy get to meet people outside home ed groups. Does she do any hobbies. My children have made friends through church, but I realise this is not an option for everyone.

Certainly Lucy would be entitled to support under school action plus.

I think a school with a speech and language unit would be the kindest place for her, even if she does not get a place in the speech and language unit. She needs to be somewhere where the adults are positive about special needs rather than a ruthless SATS factory. Even if Lucy is not autistic some of the strageries that are used to support children with autism with developing friendships might be helpful to Lucy.

I also know several statemented children who seem less delayed than Lucy. Basically, the way I'd be thinking is "would she have any chance of accessing mainstream education without a statement?" If the answer is no, and given that the LEA has a duty to provide her with an education, then she should have a statement. Simple as.

Definitely apply for a statement yourself the skeleton letter you need is here My dd has a statement and she isn't behind at all (top groups for everything) and has none of the extra needs Lucy has but still has a TA to support her for twenty hours per week. IME it is easier to get a statement when your child isn't in school (dd's was issued before she started nursery) as they don't have to fail first.Write that letter now and send it before you visit the schools. With a statement you would get priority for admission to any school (even the over subscribed ones) so you would be able to choose the school you felt would meet Lucy's needs best.

That is interesting. It sounds as if she'd be in with a really good chance then. It's good to know it's better done before she starts, so she isn't made to fail first. That would destroy all the work we've put in, building her confidence. I'd probubly end up just taking her out and being back to square 1. It would also be nice to have our choice of schools. I don't mind how long it takes, as long as it's the right school for Lucy.

Thank you for the template letter.

Your poor DD! I just wanted to say that there are really good state schools--my DDs go to an infant school that is fabulous at both differentiating and making everyone feel included. Both my girls have needed extra help from time to time and this has always been provided in such a way as to not be stigmatizing. There is a good mix of abilities and backgrounds at the school and I'm just so pleased with how my shy DDs have come along since starting there.

There is a sure start centre attached to the school and they have parent seminars and small groups for children and parents there, which have been really helpful. I would look for a school that involves parents in a similar way. Where are you located? If it's anywhere near me I'll pm you the name of the school.

ditto the advice to apply for a statement now, so you can make some progress with the process before next term starts. I hope you find a school that suits you :)

I would delay starting your dd at school until the toileting problems are resolved if they are medical and will be resolved within the next year.

Presuming that faecal impaction has caused both the wetting and soiling. Ensure that the impaction has been fully cleared and then she remains on a daily dose of movicol and establish good bowel and bladder routines which should be possible within 6 months.

I would continue to home educate until there are no toileting accidents. There is nothing more heart wrenching that watching a whole class of children continually call yours stinky and it is most distressing to have the other parents complain about your childs presence in the class to the Head Teacher for hygiene reasons!!!

Yes, you're right! That would be heart breaking for all of us. It could take quite some time to sort out, as although it is medical, it's also partly behavioural. She doesn't like using the toilet and preferes to mess herself. The nurse also said that although we can hopefully get it more controlled, it could take up to 3-4 years for her bowel to work as well as it should.

I never even thought of the hygiene side of things. At home, I'm so tunrd into when she's done it or about to do it. She won't tell anyone if she has an accident. She'll be wet or dirty all day if no one notices. She also scratches her bum then will suck her thumb, so it's sooo important to keep a close eye out, which is easier said than done. Even for me sometimes.

You really do need to apply for a statement MLL

be careful of advice that it is behavioural as it is more likely to be caused by the pain of the original constipation that has made a huge fear of the toilet rather than actually prefering the sensory issue of being wet or soiled if you see what i mean. Not telling anyone that she is wet or soiled in this situation is very normal and does not indicate SN in itself or means she actually likes to be wet or soiled.

unfortunately professionals appear to like to suggest that it may be linked to behaviour rather than it has caused the behaviour/fear.

Are you certain that all the impaction has been cleared? Within a few months of it being properly cleared you will notice a total difference in bladder control both day and night and no more continual damp patches.

She has been disempacted. She's now on one a day, too keep her going. She's still soiling though and wetting at least once a day. We're due to start the bladder training soon. There will be a lot of measuring involved. The nurse said that the wetting usually resolves it's self when the constipation is cleared. It hasn't in this case.

The reason I say it's behavioural is that she can't stand the smell of her own poo. (This is the reason she gives) She never wants to have her bum wiped in the toilet. She'll cry and try to barge past me as soon as she's done it. We use fabreeze air freshener, which makes it better, but she still doesn't like it.
I think there was once a time at school, a little girl said she'd made the toilet stink and it's really effected her.

my dd is on 4 sachets a day since impaction cleared and it took about 3 months for day wetting to stop totally and is now dry at night too after about 5 months. soiling can take even longer than this to stop.

if she is that affected by teasing at school i really would get her sorted before returning to school to avoid any further long term issues.