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Primary education

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Original poster

Sexual stereotyping of boys

82 replies

greymatter · 15/01/2011 09:28

Hi,

At my son's school's sharing assembly, which I attended yesterday, the headteacher commenting on 3 year 5 boys who had just read out some beautifully descriptive prose. She annoumced that it was amazing to see them reading their work "as we all know that boys don't like writing". She then repeated this statement. I am beside myself. My son is just learnign to write and has been told by his headteacher that it;s not for him anyway, The school h as a satisfactory status which hasn't change din 2 ofsteds. HELP!!!! I talked to my little boy afterwards and we agreed that boys doen't like writing because they LOVE IT!!

Advice please. This head is a disaster area on many levels.

OP posts:

mrz · 16/01/2011 13:20

so depending on how he said it, it could have come across in a number of ways, from factual to positive and encouraging.

exactly!

ISNT · 16/01/2011 13:22

Yes because your head said "girls don't normally do maths". That can be taken in a number of ways, depending on how it's said.

Quite different from saying "girls don't like maths" to you when you were 5. There aren't two ways to take that. You can't say that the two statements are in any way comparable.

Please tell me about why the business with the secretarial course was positive, as all the elements in that story seem to tie in with your preferred approach.

ISNT · 16/01/2011 13:23

Are you a teacher mrz?

chibi · 16/01/2011 13:24

well ok, if we were going to speculate, maybe what the head said was

she fancied a curry
she thought we were in for an early spring
she didn't think much of man united's chances this season
nick clegg was rather disappointing

shall we discuss her comment as if she had said any of these instead?

mrz, do you pop up on other threads to suggest alternates when people report what 3rd parties have said?

DisparityCausesInstability · 16/01/2011 13:28

It would worry me if my child chose to take a certain subject at A level just to prove a teacher wrong - that is a pretty poor reason and in my opinion and good arguement against telling kids they can't do things. I'd be worried about my child thinking that a teacher's negative opinion was so significant. It's not like the teacher would even care.

I did A level maths applied and pure the class was full of girls - I hadn't realised that maths was seen as a boys subject when I was at school - I chose it because I enjoyed it, I was good at it and I needed it for my university course, clearly my school was good at limiting our view of what we could do.

mrz · 16/01/2011 13:29

I didn't say it was my preferred approach simply that without being there and being privy to exactly what was said and how it was said and in the context it was said none of us are in a position to judge the head just as you can't judge the head who said "normally girls don't do maths" (incidentally the message was very clear that he thought it was a very bad idea - but you had to be there)

DisparityCausesInstability · 16/01/2011 13:31

mrz · 16/01/2011 13:37

DisparityCausesInstability I did not say I chose the A level purely to prove the head wrong. I had already made my choices and when formalising my choices I stated I wanted to do Maths English and History to which the head replied (after a sharp intake of breath) "girl's don't normally take Maths"

ISNT · 16/01/2011 13:39

In that case mrz he shouldn't have said it to you. Do you think that the fact your head went around saying to girls "girls don't normally do maths a-level" will have overall had a positive or negative effect on the numbers of girls taking maths. My preferred approach is that no-one tells boys or girls what they can/can't do based on gender, but imagine this was a few years back and was giving him the benefit of the doubt.

In a statement to a whole school "everyone knows that boys don't like writing" there is no benefit of the doubt to be given because there is no way that statement can be taken any other way.

It's a "boot camp" approach that I see recommended by people of one personality type - the "I'll show you" type - but which has an extremely negative impact on everyone else. The idea that the majority must have their spirits crushed so that a minority can get the "I'll show you" motivation that they need is pretty selfish TBH.

mrz · 16/01/2011 13:39

Incidentally I chose Maths because I was good at it (found it very very easy) whereas I chose history because I enjoyed it

ISNT · 16/01/2011 13:42

Why do you think it was a good thing that the head said that to you?

I don't think this type of thing is positive in any way. A person with a different personality to you might have changed their choices based on his reaction, and missed out on a subject they really enjoyed.

Also remember that the OP is talking about a whole school primary school assembly, so boys from reception up will have heard the message that boys don't like maths. You were much older - an adult - when the head said that to you. And I won;t be persuaded that is was a positive comment for him to make.

ISNT · 16/01/2011 13:43

Hmm not an adult, 14 or 15 - a different kettle of fish to 5 or 6 whichever way you look at it.

mrz · 16/01/2011 13:54

I don't think it was a good thing or a bad thing, positive or negative. It was simply a statement of fact.

Yes boys in assembly will have heard the message ...look at how good these three boys are at writing

chibi · 16/01/2011 13:55

they will also hear

'boys don't write'

mrz · 16/01/2011 13:59

actually most reception boys and girls don't hear much in assemblies ask them as they leave the hall and they can't recall much

chibi · 16/01/2011 14:00

let's not bother sending them to school at all then, if they are incapable of taking anything in, and you can tell them any old rubbish

chibi · 16/01/2011 14:01

why is defending sexist assumptions so important to you mrz?

ISNT · 16/01/2011 14:02

So now your argument is that it's OK to tell very young children that they won't enjoy doing stuff because they are male/female - because none of them will be listening?

mrz your headmaster either made a statement of fact or was negative. Your previous posts have indicated he was negative, hence you wanted to "prove him wrong". Now you're saying he was neutral. You can't have it both ways.

Bottom line is, is it OK to tell very young children that they won't enjoy something because they are a boy/girl? I say no. I don't understand the arguments for this approach at all TBH.

mrz · 16/01/2011 14:03

well it sometimes seems that anything schools say or do has to be dissected and examined for imagined slights so someone can be blamed...

chibi · 16/01/2011 14:05

fwiw i am a teacher and i have never felt the need to tell my students that certain subjects were beyond them because of their gender

i wonder why you have so much sympathy with that position, to the point where you think people who don't are complaining for the sake of it

ISNT · 16/01/2011 14:08

Should we be distributing to all little girls on the basis that it will spur them on to take up maths?

mrz · 16/01/2011 14:17

Perhaps schools shouldn't tell pupils anything in case we upset someone or put them off

ISNT · 16/01/2011 14:19

Or perhaps schools should refrain from saying things like "everyone knows boys don't like writing" to young children?

Just a crazy crazy thought

mrz · 16/01/2011 14:23

I'm pleased you agree

chibi · 16/01/2011 14:29

never mind

everyone knows mrz is incapable of constructing a logical argument free of internal inconsistencies

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