School discipline

[Claygate]

Has anyone any idea how to maintain a high standard of learning for a mixed ability and behaviour class.

If children are disruptive should they be excluded?

If their parents appear to be part of the problem how can the child be helped without other children suffering as a consequence.

Can i be controversial here....should children who disrupt school and whose parents do not support discipline or learning be transfered to a different type of school?

Sometimes i think when i see a high truancy rate i think, good at least the trouble makers wont be disrupting class...do you understand?

I think, like job reviews that childrens' behaviour should be reviewed and agreements made with parents that the children will be placed in another class where they can continue to misbehave with other like minded children without disrupting others...But i know this is not ideal.

Do we have a teachers point of view on this...does poor discipline in primary schools....largely a result of personality or upbringing present a problem for a classes learning as a whole? And what are your considered solutions.

'If children are disruptive should they be excluded?' No - establish why they are being disruptive and address that.

Yeah - it was great when we shipped all those convicts to Australia. Maybe we can find a large, largely uninhabitated island and ship out all those undesirables and their filthy parents.

At least then my kids wouldn't have to mingle with them.

Oooh wooops. I think me and half of mine would be on the boat.

What would you do if some of the kids were well behaved and some weren't? Maybe just expel one parent and let the other cope as a single parent?????

I've always thought that naughty children should be sent to live on the Isle of Wight til they turn 18. That'd sort it.

OP is your post for real? Why have you posted what is your objective?
If it is then:
Exclution should be used as a last resort...
"If their parents appear to be part of the problem how can the child be helped without other children suffering as a consequence."

Parents should have opportunities to go on courses to help with issues they may be having for example the incedible years programme or helping hands to name 2 available. The setting/school should work with the parents to try and come to some middle ground and think of stratergies together which would help the behaviour. The school/setting should have open lines of communication.

"Can i be controversial here....should children who disrupt school and whose parents do not support discipline or learning be transfered to a different type of school?"
what type of school do you enviage? How would that help the child who from what you have said through no folt of their own suffer? The other children in the class learn to deal with problems and that sets them up for life.

A high truency rate would worry me why are they not in school?, where are they?, what are they doing?, how can we get them back into the school system and beliving in themselves?

Children with some sort of behavioural difficulty can occur in any child, of any race, and of any socio economic group...

Yes children with some behvioural difficulties do dissrupt the class but with good support, good class managment and good Personal Social education...then things can and do get better... take for exaple a child I work with in N and R threw chairs, hit, kicked, punched etc but with a very firm boundry, a counsistant approach this child is a compleatly different caractor he is polite, well mannered, has his moments but know the boundry and the concequence. Children can and do change they just need our help.

The trouble is, there isn't some magical school that can take all the children who have behavioural problems. (Unless you are maybe thinking of a borstal?) The reality is that if you exclude them, they just get passed to another school to be a problem there instead...

And if they aren't in school, do you really want them to be on the streets and being a nuisance to society in general?

The only constructive solution is to try to tackle the problem as soon as possible, and work with the child and parents to find a way to help them.

...is the OP writing an essay?

I reckon Matthew Wright or Daily Fail.

Punish the children for the parents' behaviour? Really?

I'd love to remove all the naughty children from the class to give the well behaved ones a better education - but it's never going to happen.

Ha Ha yes ship them off to the colonies. No i was wondering about other peoples opinions. We have disruptive children in my childrens classes and my children generally find it amusing but it obviously distracts from useful teaching time.

And i believe that children who are disruptive usually have simple personality or poor upbringing to blame (blame not a good word) i believe we have a responsibility to help these children so they do as well as they can and do not repeat any cycles promoted by disinterested parents.

But honestly dont be PC about it...my child was made to sit with a disruptive child as a goiod example to that child...This did effect their useful time in class....I know we all went through it but really why should private and wealthy schools benefit from (i know some private schools have problem children) good learning time while everyone else just spends half an hour or hour each day affected by interventions on disruptive children.

My point is if the parents do not care and say couldnt care less if the kids get qualifications why should those who do have to suffer disruption.

What about classes specifically for kids with greater emotional or learning needs.

Dont get all angry and hateful, just give some comments without being nasty or sarcastic....what is wrong with these discussion boards. No one is reasonable.

honeybeetree

I accept your point and i am pleased for that child but how much of that was at the expense of every other child in the class.

IndigoBell

If your kids are the disruptive ones do you care how that affects other peoples time at school.

I dont think kids should be shipped off but if you laugh at disruptive behaviour or dismiss it then you are condoning it.

Teach your kids to respect their teachers, classmates and the need for education.

I am saying if the parents do not care about a childs behaviour or their prospects then the child should be put in another class where their needs are met without disturbing others.

So if one child is disruptive and the other not, and the parents are doing all they can to support the teachers then you have to look at ways to help that child but not at the expense of all other children...

op - i suspect you know nothing not much about what actually does happen in school re: poor behaviour. These mythical parenting courses/ special school places/ behaviour support services/ pastoral support plans etc exist - you won't know of them as your dcs are obviously like little angels all day long

Grumpypants...i know well enough what happens in classes...but yes my school is not a big problem school, my concerns are minor compared to some parents who worry about serious harm happening at schools.

What do you mean by mythical are you saying they dont exist or guessing that i dont know they exist.

These mumsnet discussions are all pointless arent they they are just a chance for people to slag others off or big themselves up...what a load of wasters.

Sorry op, you were asking what we thought should happen - I was suggesting that the things you were mooting were actually already in existence. Didn't realise you were just gathering opinions not information. I don't think you could read my post as 'slagging you off' btw - just telling you what can be done (not in class, in school)

Whats your problem argumentative.

Emailed comments never read properly do they...they usually seem agressive or arrogant....I think if people just offered their observations without being critical of others the message boards would be less confrontational....you should see the football message boards its like roadrage long distance.

ClayGate - My children aren't really badly behaved. Apart from incidents caused by my eldest son's ASD. Which I'm sure other parents think is bad behavior - but it isn't.

But my, bulk average, socially mixed, high EAL, above average free school meals, state school doesn't have a behavior problem because they employ great teachers, teaching assistants and dinner ladies who all follow a good behavior policy.

My last school, which was a much 'better' school, almost no Free School Meals etc. had lots of behavior problems because

• they didn't identify or support SEN
• they employed cheap, pliable teachers who wouldn't question the HT
• they had a rubbish behavior policy.

If you are unhappy with the behavior of students at your childrens' school - move them.

If you want to choose who your children mix with - pay to go private.

Excuse me mrs Eviltwins, we dont want troublemakers here!!! We have enough of our own, thank you. Keep yours there!!!!

I understand where you are coming from. It is valid to ask about protecting the education of the children who are minded to learn as well as devising strategies for those who need "stronger guidance" (for want a better way of putting it!).

I don't know the answer though. Lumping all deviant behaviour together in the naughty class may well help those who arrive at school each day ready to work, but where do you draw the line? And what happens to those children once they have been allocated to a class where there is always someone playing up?

then again my child's education is suffering from what his teacher calls a "boisterous class with several big personalities" but what my son calls "noisy" and I don't think its at all fair on him to be asked to delay his education whilst the school considers whether it can do anything to improve general behaviour.

So agressive and at the same time defensive indigobell...

No i wont do either. I am largely happy with my childrens school and all the people they mix with. I am largely not troubled by other childrens behaviour as my children are well rounded enough to deal with these situations.

I am just questioning classess can be managed in schools for the benefit of those who need help and those who want to learn.

I just question is it right that 20% of a learning day is lost to managing behaviour at the detriment of those who do not need their behaviour managed. Simple question it's not all about me or mine you know.

I want want strategies for ensuring the best is gained for the majority, and if the minority are disruptive then deal with the minority away from the majority so they can get on with it.

Thanks Anice for your understanding and lack of judgement on my question

Sarcasm?