Montessori Nursery/Pre-school

[Montessorimumblings]

Hi,
I need to ramble and get my thoughts written down, any advice welcome.
My three year old boy is starting nursery after Christmas. I am a stay at home mum and am finding the nursery decisions difficult. He was supposed to be going to a nursery nearby and I was initially attracted by the outdoors space and lovely building and nice toys. We;ve attended a weekly toddler group there this term and I became a bit concerned with the strictness of the staff. They told me they encourage use of worksheets even though they are not to according to OFSTED. And they said he absolutely had to be potty trained to attend as they have no facilites for nappies. Anyway, I became a bit concerned about all the discipline and worried about the effects on a 3 year old (he still seems so young). Last week I discovered a Montessori nursery a short drive away that accept his vouchers and have the right mornings that I want. I did a bit of research online and went along for a visit and was really impressed. I think the fact that he will be able to choose his own activities will suit him better as he likes to play with one thing for a long time, investigating every possibility before moving on to something else and the more he is asked to do something, the less likely he is to do it. They seem to run quite like I do things at home, his toys are accessible and I just let him potter around or help me with my jobs. So I think i'm happy that it's a good place for him. But I'm concerned about the fact that Montessori is kind of 'alternative'. If it's so great why isn't every nursery Montessori? Will he find it difficult to move to a mainstream primary school? Will it make him play differently from his other friends that go to mainstream nursery, and will he be percieved as 'different'? I want him to think for himself and be individual but I don't want my issues with disciplinarian methods to ostricize him. Then I get really crazy thoughts that he won't respect authority and wind up in jail....I know, I'm being silly, but I just want to get things right for him, and I am finding it hard to hand him over to someone else.
I've also read about Montessori not encouraging fantasy/imagination. I'm all for a bit of daftness and think it's an important part of childhood. I like some of the steiner philosophies but am not entirely convinced. Does anybody know if you can compensate for the montessori lack of silliness or fantasy by adopting a more steiner approach at home?
Please help me. All the other mums i know don't seem to worry about their mainstream nurseries. Am I just being precious about him?
Any thoughts?

Which nursery to you prefer?

They are not allowed to insist on your child being potty trained btw

Sounds like the Montessori option will let your child have more free unstructured and exploration time to me. Can't say I like the sound of the one around the corner from you, either.

Montessori is open to interpretation; DS's Montessori nursery has Brio train tracks and plastic farm animals (plenty of scope for imagination and role play there).

go with your instinct and choose the montessori one is my advice.

he will learn better discipline in an environment where he is respected, and feels so, rather than ordered and pushed about.

discipline comes from within. order imposed from without can only have so much power, if he is truly to learn how to listen to authority and respect it, he needs to feel respected and allowed to learn to listen to himself.

montessori is open to interpretation - personally i love it, but wopuld always check out the individual place - which youve done.

trust your instincts., you know your child and what would suit him.and i seriously doubt that even if he went somewhere where he was bossed about and really unhappy, there is v little which will 'turn him into a rebel/criminal' at this age, and with such a balancing influence at home.

yes, I think you know your child and you can choose a nursery that will suit him.

I've (almost)definitely decided that he should go to the montessori nursery for 3 mornings. The whole philosophy around it was really touching and I found it quite emotional to find a place that felt the same about children as I do. Did anyone else have a surprising emotional reaction to the environment? And why hadn't I heard of it before? Reading about it now it all seems sort of natural, like 'of course that's how nursery should be'.
I think 'Flack' and 'BBGalore' are right about montessori being open to interpretation regarding imaginative/fantasy play. If my son decides that a particular shape or object is in fact his rocket and he's off to the moon, I doubt very much that anybody could convince him otherwise and surely it would go against the principles of free play to try to intervene anyway?
My son is a very physical boy and I think the montessori's sensory approach will really help him but it did seem quite calm, which is a good thing, but do they also get to run around being crazy? Is there a balance? Or am I going to have to take him to the park beforehand to burn off some energy so he doesn't disrupt the atmosphere.
I guess what I'm hoping for is a well-balanced nursery, to help me raise a well-balanced boy, is that your experience of montessori?
Generally, Not many people have bad things to say about montessori, but why then are people in my area not fighting each other for a place? I couldn't believe it when they said they had plenty availability. And I don't have to pay a penny, Feels too good to be true!

Also, what on earth is all this DD1,DS2 stuff, i'm confused.

Hi, both my dds (dear daughters) have gone to a Montessori - my oldest started at age 3, and had been to a more conventional playschool first, and cried every time I left her. It was just too noisy, too chaotic for her. She became a different child at the montessori. She was able to develop at her own pace, yet was encouraged every step of the way. She went from being a very shy clingy child to an extremely confident one. My youngest dd is 3 and has just started, with her cousin, also 3 and they LOVE it.
What is so great is that all the toys and activities are geared to help develop their pencil grip and control, their hand to eye co ordination, and their attention span, in a very calm, natural environment. Their imagination is stretched because they have lost of 'real world' toys, such as polish and a shoe, and mirror, a china tea set, a set of padlocks and keys, lots of pots and jugs to practice pouring water into, tweezers and chick peas, again to help develop pen control. And tons of wooden, tradional toys, puzzles etc. It encourages them to learn to sit nicely, work independently, clear up after themselves and take pride in what they've achieved. I have to say I couldn't believe how quickly my eldest came on with her writing and letters etc. She has just started reception and is doing so well, she can read simple books to herself, and has settled so easily into the school environment because of the calm and orderly nursery she went to. I would go for it !

Dd1=normally eldest DD, DD2=2nd eldest DD, Ds= Darling son, DC=Darling child or children, etc.

DS also attends an ordinary preschool 2 sessions/week, so he does get the balance of running around like a silly thing (and still interacting socially). He does seem full of beans when leaving the Montessori and in fact the supervisor there told me that a lot of parents dislike run-around outside time for their DC because they want the children mostly focused on sit-down learning (pah!)

But Ofsted insists on some run-around gross-motor skill time, learning thru free movement. Need to pass Ofsted inspections also prevents terribly purist interpretations, so the kids do get unorganised run-around and social interaction time even in a Montessori environment.

My only grief with our Montessori is that DS comes out of it famished, I don't think they feed him enough!

Has anyone experienced prejudice/stereotyping from other mothers because they have chosen a montessori nursery for their child? And what's the best way to handle it?
Have decided to tell the first nursery that he will not be attending after christmas because he is not yet potty trained and i don't think the deadline is helping. That way it's their call and i don't have to get into a debate about educational philosophies, and possibly maintain the opportunity to go back to that nursery once he's potty trained and have 1 day mainstream and 3 days montessori?
Advice re: stereotyping please, I'm concerned the mum's i meet up with will be weird with me.

bump

ds is attending a Montessori nursery and like you I fell in love with the atmosphere when we went there. All the children seemed happy and occupied. In some of the other nurseries I notice quite a lot of children wondering around looking quite lost.

I am surprised at some of the comments about oudoor unstructured play as the manager at my nursery emphasied how important it was for all children (and in particular some of the more boisterous ones) to be able to go outside and just play, every day whatever the weather. They also ecourage outdoor learning so whenever appropriate or possible they do some of the 'learning stuff' outside as well as the less structured play time.

Also ds loves fantasy and imaginative play and the nursery seems to actively encourage this.

Most montessori nurseries need to fit in with Ofsted tagrets as well so will tend to have a mixed approach. The ones I have seen though have seeemed quieter and less frenetic than some other 'mainsteam' nurseries.

I've never encounterd any prejudice about the type of nursery it is, though I know some people do take the p*s a bit (I've seen a bit of that on MN ). For me though it is about what I feel is best for ds. The rest is irrelevant really.

Thanks, I guess I'm a bit concerned about it being a bit alternative. My family already think we're alternative because we recycle. I think I might not mention it to them as they are masters of pisstaking (although all very one way). Other people's opinions wouldn't change my mind at this point, but I feel I want to be prepared for it after reading a few mean comments on MN. I'm hoping I might meet likeminded mothers through the nursery, as my relationships with the mums I have met through antenatal classes have kind of run their course. Only so long these things can last if the only thing you have in common is that you all had sex at christmas! Anyway, that's probably not relevant. Think I might change my name to something about going off on a tangent.

hiya
i did Montessori training (4yrs ago). will try to cover a couple of things you've asked:

creative/imaginative play- is not actually frowned upon at all. what MM meant by not encouraging fantasy in under 6yos was that she didn't think they should be fed disney and the like, morning noon and night, as she didn't think they could truly separate reality from fantasy (take everything at face value) and that it was thus confusing for them to be fed loads of, well, bull really .
and the point of not feeding them that stuff, is that that stuff is other peoples imaginations, not the child's own.
she thought, and i agree, that a child is perfectly able to have tons of imaginative play with, say, a a cardboard box, when they use their own imagination, which they are more able to do if you don't crowd their heads with half a ton of other (adult) peoples ideas of what children should like and be interested in.

obviously, you take that as far as you see fit. i tend to agree with her, but i do still read my kids stories with talking animals in etc, which a totally purist Montessori approach wouldn't do, i guess.

tis v rare for anyone to be totally purist about it tho,. and in any case, she advocated adapting and changing to follow the times and suit individual cultures etc. what works in basingstoke might need a little tweaking to work in rural Eritrea for eg.

and re the running about- yep, there is def supposed to be space for running about and expending energies, as well as developing gross motor skills.

is, in reality, a v holistic approach to educating a child, on its individual terms at its own pace and following its own interests while nurturing its own personality and self esteem (you know, the real stuff, not just loud and confident seeming facade)

man, i wish there were a good montessori nursery near me

lol at tangent

i shouldnt think thered be any prejudice, cant imagine meeting any. there is a fair dose of ignorance about what mointessori actually means, and lots of people who think they know based on one place or a paragraph theyve read somewhere.

i have quite a few books on the subject (from when i studied it) which i can lend you if you like. that way, if anyone says theyve heard this or that, you will have informed answers for them.

thanks nappiesgalore, one little niggle....the lady said they teach the easter and christmas bible stories...and although she took on board that I was humanist and did not want to raise DS in any particular religion and was very understanding of that...to me, bible stories are as much fantasy as the gingerbread man or the tiger who came to tea?

tell yr famil;y its a nursery. they wont know the diff between one type and another, will they?

I agree nappies. The key for me was really the holistic approach.

I recently had a meeting with ds's main teacher to discuss how he was settling in and what made me so happy and convinced it was the right place for him was how well they seemed to know him - down to his intense dislike of jigsaw puzzles, his middling like of painting/drawing and his extremse love of playdoh and anything modelling related .

Their description of him fitted so well with what I know about him it was a relief.

This was in the context of having removed him from a childminder who seemed to be taking care of a different child to the one I knew.

Absolutle - just say it is a nursery. My parents wouldn't know one type from another.

oh yes, i agree with that! but ive decided it cant hurt for them to learn about these 'stories' and 'traditions'... so long as they know (and theyll ask you at some point) that you think its nice enough stories, but certainly not fact, they will prob view it that way too.

thats how my parents handled my CofE education (athiests) and i am a definately an athiest now. prob a humanist too, but im not sure what the term means so im not signing up till i know what im signing!

they will, or should, also learn about other cultures/religions major festivals etc. too. just view it all the same way.

Thanks for the offer of the books, but no need as my friends mum who is montessori trained is sending them to me already. nice offer though.
Just finished reading a steiner book called 'you are your childs first teacher' by rahima somebody, was very interesting. But don't you think that when you tell people that you are reading up on steiner or montessori that they think you are incapable of reading something and then making informed opinions on something and not necessarily getting swept away with a philosophy. I never see things black and white, it's all grey and confusing.

oh lazycow that sounds brilliant!

boo hoo, I want a good montessori nursery

other peoples' prejudices about what you can and cant think about for yourself are, frankly, their own problem.

i actually had to literally sign up to humanism...really weird thing to have to do, but we wanted a humanist wedding ceremony in a garden in scotland, and it cost a year's subscription too, totally mental. only for a year though. but happier to be humanist without actually putting my name on a list.
with regards to feedback from the nursery, i'm really keen that they get to know my son, how will i know that they are doing this..do they do a written report or do you meet the staff regularly or is it more informal, like a chat when you pick them up?

but yes, i know exactly what you mean!