Interested in this years 'reason I can't have a home birth'

[Babieseverywhere]

For my second pregnancy it was...you will bleed out and die.

For this year third pregnancy it is....you will have a rupture and a big baby and die.

Well at least we won't be bleeding to death this year or is that part of a rupture ?

Onwards and upwards.

Offical permission for midwife led unit and homebirth refused. I have asked them to add to my notes that I have heard their objects and will be continuing to plan my homebirth unless my pregnancy deems otherwise. I will remain positive.

You are entitled to one unless there's a (genuine) reason not to, so just keep insisting.

If you go into labour and tell a midwife, any midwife, they are obliged to come and care for you. Unless you have concerns for your health then just stay ay home! That's what I've been told by midwives and others.

Good luck!

That is shocking! I really find it amazing how different the care is that people get - my first midwife was sniffy about my plans for a homebirth, then the second was more than fine about it, didn't blink an eye. It does seem to differ depending on their own opinions - could you ask for a new midwife, or try a local homebirth group and see if they can offer any support?

Used to that kind of response from friends and aquaintances by now, but aren't midwives meant to be well informed and helpful?

Good luck with it all, stick to what you want.

Oh for godsake! Unless there is a medical reason why you would be better off in hospital, homebirths have been for the majority, and have been for many years as safe as hospital. All 3 of mine have been homebirths, and I do feel very lucky. Quick change of sheets and snuggle down with your brood; great especially when you have other kids. I do understand that there is a massive shortage of midwives, which is an added pressure for them when someone requests a homebirth. What I always say, and stand by, is that I would very much like a homebirth, and am planning for one, but obviously if things are looking like they aren't going according to plan, I would consider a hospital birth. I cannot believe you are unfortunate enough to have a midwife with such a lack of anything encouraging to say. Good luck and hoping you can go with what you ultimately want; your body, your birth.

Just to add, all of the midwives I have had at the births all have said how lovely they find homebirths, and indeed some get very jealous when one has done a homebirth and the other has been stuck in hospital!

My planned HB with DS1 started with MW turning up and telling me that I'd have to go in as there weren't enough MWs to cover and come to my house. Ex-husband (obv not ex at the time!) told her, "don't worry love, you go off back to the hospital, we'll handle things on our own". Worked a treat - miraculously another was found.

My GP had sent me a threatening letter with DS1 saying she wouldn't help if I was half dead in my hippy homebirthing tree and crap like that. I wrote back to say that we had hot and cold running water and electricity in our house, and plenty of towels, so we would be fine.

Sadly in the end I was dragged in literally kicking and screaming an hour later when waters went with meconium staining. IME it was ANY excuse they could think of.

This time I planned to get an independant MW but when I went to the NHS MW to book in (different region) she was totally the opposite to how I'd expected - absolutely pro HB and really, really keen to do it - so I'm saving the £3k on the indie which would have been a real stretch.

You ARE entitled to one, a rupture or bleed is the most ridiculous argument ever - what a load of tosh. But if you don't get the support now, IME they will make life tough at the end even if they agree in principle. Is there any way you could afford an indie?

catbus did you have yours while your older kids were at home? I have mixed feelings about this. My DS is 5 and I think he'd get really distressed - and would distract me from concentrating on what I needed to do. Other people have said it's really nice... how did you handle it?

Poor you

I have heard all the excusesand ignored them all

I had twins first, section at 29 weeks.

Dd was planned HB but got stuck at the eleventh hour and i had to transfer in. She was born normally BUT 3rd degree tear.

ds#3 was HB, they tried totransfer me in for high BP and saying i would rupture/bleed as this was 4th baby. 2nd degree tear that needed stitching in hospital.

ds#4 was HB in just 40 minutes, shoulder dystocia. Managed to correct it with a simple positional change. That midwife said "Thank goodness i didn't get a chance to read your notes!"

ds#4 induced in hospital. Ventouse. Hideous experience. He" had been breech till a few days before my due date and he was never in a good position. I just knew it was not right.

So they had previous section, scar rupture would happen, multipara so would bleed out. Shoulder dystocia. 3rd degree tear.

dd2 HB by now you can just imagine" the red pen on my notes. She was born in just a coulple of hours, all normal. In this case i just knew^ it was ok.

You have to trust yourself i think. I have always known when it doesn't feel right.

Good luck

Oh how awful!

There is no such thing as 'official consent' though. You can give birth in the place of your choosing - obviously those involved in your care will and should advise you of the risks (for you personally), so that you can make an informed choice. But ultimately it is your choice.

Interesting - when I went for my booking in appointment, they said:

they wanted me to have consultant care for my underactive thyroid (I refused as happy for GP to manage it),

and then they said:

oh you should have home birth!!!!
They saw that was my DC3 and both DD and DS born in birth centre (at same hospital) with no medical intervention, DS (2nd child) born in pool and no tears.

So am still thinking about it!

To the OP - are there are factors which make you high risk - how were your last 2 births?

I had two straight forward hospital births and now pregnant with dc3, the maternity unit where I had my boys is closing soon so after a lot of consideration We decided to go for a homebirth. When I went to my booking in/12 week scan apt at the hospital and mentioned it to the consultant she basically said that things can go wrong at home and I quote "you can end up with a dead baby", as opposed to a short hospital stay (I was a six hour discharge last birth)! Needless to say, I was shocked but on visiting my community midwife she reassured me and gave me the confidence to go for a homebirth. I also saw a different consultant at the same hospital after my 20 week scan and I could not believe the difference in opinion, he was 100% in favour of homebirths and was brimming with enthusiasm! So I think it really depends on individual attitudes and work loads which should not
be any reason to deny a mother her choice of birth! I would keep pushing (pardon the pun!) for a homebirth unless there is any medical reason not to! Good luck x

The offical concerns are big baby which I WILL definately have and rupture due to CS which I am highly unlikely to have.

The nice midwife also mentioned we are at risk of Shoulder Dismorphia and more likely to have a baby turning in labour as our last baby did move. He was head down for weeks and move transverse during labour, I had been told by other midwifes this is just bad luck and shouldn't reoccur.

To my mind it can not be that serious a risk, else they would have offered the midwife led unit (not that I wanted that option IYSWIM) surely if I was so likely to die, they would rather me in a room in hospital rather than at home.

Joy of joy, I have been assigned to the same unsupportive midwife team I had last pregnancy, with the leader who told me my baby was going to die and she 'was going to transfer me to hospital and didn't care if I hated her for it' This was with the potential bleed concern and two months before I went into labour.

I have no faith that this team will be any more supportive of me this time, than they were last time.

No money for independant midwife, we will hopefully have a doula with us.

C&P'd from another post
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Bear in mind I have two failed births behind me.

1. For my first birth, my community midwife refused to come out to me, she disagreed with first time mothers having homebirths So home birth was shelved and I was forced in hospital. Typically waterfall invention issues and ended up with forcep delivery, third degree tear and a complex about birthing. Baby girl 8lbs 12ozs

1. After crying a river, counselling and moving cross country etc laboured in a planned home birth for baby number two. Who turned sideways during birth and was going nowhere. I decided to transfer to hospital ended up with emergency CS. Had problems with Home Birth team midwives who didn't wish to support me in my home birth due to last birth and likehood of big baby, so SOM attended my labour. Baby boy 10lbs 1ozs

1. Sigh. Enters the fray again. I'm waiting to hear if my consultant will give me the choice of Midwive Led unit or not. If he doesn't I will be trying for a home birth again, I refuse to have a medical laden birth UNLESS my pregnancy dictates it. At the moment I have had two bad luck births, nothing which is going to definately recur. The SOM from last pregnancy has asked me to try again with the Home Birth team which failed to support me last time. I agreed, but to be honest, their issue was 'big baby' and I am bound to have another big 'un so I honestly worry about their ability to support me this time. But I am trying to be positive and see what happens this time around.

Carrots; yes; last birth 2 years ago and kids were 9 and 5. My Mum had them downstairs and they kept popping up to say hi, but didn't seem too fussed. They heard their brother cry as he came out, dragged Grandma upstairs, to be greeted by Mummy's arse in the air and baby brother underneath it!! I didn't want them there when it was literally happening for lots of reasons; mainly due to them putting me off my stroke as it were!

Just wanted to say I'm in the same situation. I'm 34wks into my 2nd pregnancy and being told i "don't meet the criteria" for a home birth because my bump is measuring 1 week too big. I've written to the supervisior of midwives saying thanks for the advice but I intend to go ahead with my home birth blah blah blah, but am really worried that the dispute won't be resolved before i go into labour (DD1 was born at 37 weeks).

As things stand at the moment, if I go into labour I intend to phone the hospital, tell them I'm having a home birth and suggest strongly that they might like to send a midwife. Unless I develop any complications in the meantime of course......I'm not being so stubborn as to put me or baby at risk!

I would love a homebirth but I keep getting high blood pressure in pregnancy and pre eclampsia! so its pretty certainly a no lol (my last two have both been induced a month early). Even if this pregnancy went smoothly with no high blood pressure I think they would advise against it just in case.

Babieseverywhere, hmmm, have to say you're not the perfect candidate for a home birth! However, as stated, midwives do have an obligation to attend you (I speak as a midwife).

Remember, also, that hospital/birth centres have GUIDELINES:they are not written in stone so talk to the midwife in charge (its not the consultant's choice, it's yours as long as you understand the risks).

I have only seen one ruptured uterus myself in many years :a woman having her 2nd spontaneous labour (ie 3rd child)after an LSCS with her first child. She and the baby both nearly died despite being in hospital and delivered within minutes of the rupture.

Like all things there are risks, they are rare but serious and you have to decide what is best for you. Is the Midwife Led unit within a hospital or stand alone?

jo1958, the midwife led unit is very near the consulant rooms in the hospital, apparantly.

I am really interested why I'm seen as not suitable for a home birth ?

So far everyone agreed the first induced hospital birth was typical bad luck being induced in hospital.

My second birth was going very well at home, fully dilated and if he had not turned sideways there was no reason (in theory) that I could not of birthed him, said the midwives at the time. Again I was told it was just bad luck and should not reoccur.

Even this consultant has not mentioned my previous 'bad luck births'. His concerns are big baby and rupture.

I understand many women have home vbacs, are all these women bad home birth bets ?

The main risk is the chance of ruptured uterus because of the pre existing scar: it IS very rare but IF it happens the chance of you and the baby dying is high. I emphasize though, it's rare.

The other risk is of cord prolapse if your baby has enough room to turn sideways again. Your last baby was pretty large to have enough room to do that: was there lots of liquor ?.

I'm an NHS midwife and we do VBAC homebirths (and waterbirth) at home (not supported by the doctors, usually) so, as long as the baby isn't enormous and stays head down you should be ok. (Very large babies may be due to undiagnosed gestational diabetes which can lead to all sorts of other problems).

Obstetricians are rarely positive about home birth however low risk because they tend to see women with problems rather than all the nice normal stuff midwives see.

Remember that we are obliged to point out the risks so that you can make an informed decision- it doesn't mean we don't support you. Midwives should be trying to push home birth more because we have a low rate in this country so its disappointing to see that even very straightforward cases are sometimes being discouraged.

babies everywhere, you might be interested to know that research published in 2004 in the American Journal of obstetric and gynaecology quotes a risk of rupture uterus of 0.4% in VBAC against 0.2% in those having planned repeat LSCS. NICE guidelines in 2004 quote about o.27% to get the risk into perspective.Hope that helps.

Jo,

Thanks for you posts. I guess there was plenty of fluid with DS, so he could turn.

I don't feel that 'undiagnosed gestational diabetes ' was an issue for DS (DC2) for the following reasons :-

1. I was tested for GD in first pregnancy with DD and was completely clear
2. I have no family history or other risk factor for having GD
3. I had no protein in my urine tests, nor displayed any signs of GD in either pregnancy.
4. DS was born perfectly healthy.
5. DS was born long and heavy and has continued on the 99% lines in the red book for both weight and height. At 17 months he is often mistaken for an much older child. I think this shows he was meant to be that birth weight, else he would of displayed catch down growth.

If the above reasons are wrong, please feel free to correct me, you are the expert after all.

0.4% sounds pretty low risk to me, that said if it happened....mmmmmm

Sorry to hear this, it does supprise me. I would love a home birth but live in a flat with VERY thin walls and non supportive neighbours. When I saw my MW and told her I was going for a hospital birth she was possitively disapointed, she told me she used to be a hospial MW and now as a community MW loves the home births. She is quite young though so perhaps is part of the new school, who knows.

babieseverywhere, I don't doubt you about the GD, it was only a thought. Funnily enough my brother and I were both home births at over 10lb each (4th and 5th babies for my mother, who didn't apparently give it a 2nd thought even though HER mother died in childbirth). In those days (I'm pretty old!) EVERYONE was born at home, without too much trouble it seems. The midwife apparently read the paper and smoked her fags!! ah, those were the days........ anyway, hope it goes well whatever you choose.

I really hope things work out. Despite my stated concerns, my local midwife team are touted as being very supportive in the community. Which was why I was so heartbroken when this support was not extended to me.

So I am hoping that maybe last time I just caught the lady on a bad day and I was highly hormonal (late pregnancy) and over sensitive, maybe this time things will be better and my husband and I can relay on this local team.

babieseverywhere, i had the exact same responses to you for my second and third children (both of whom were born at home just fine)

when i saw the community harbinger of doom midwife after ds's birth she expressed her shock at the fact I hadn't haemmorhaged and that "he didn't get stuck???"