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Pregnancy

Talk about every stage of pregnancy, from early symptoms to preparing for birth.

Who saw "Life before Birth" last night???

63 replies

dropinthe · 08/04/2005 12:03

I thought it was fantastic and made me extremely broody but OMG what an advert if ever I saw one for the Pro Life lobby. At twelve weeks that baby was something else-at 26,(last point of abortion??Couldnt remember)- well I'm speechless. These bloody laws reagarding abortion were made when we didnt really know what was going on inside a womans body-now with 4D imaging we do and its murder-plain and simple!!
What do you think?

OP posts:
dropinthe · 08/04/2005 13:25

L/m-majority of it was computer technology mixed with a bit of 4d scanning which was real-then you got a full scale intimate insight as to what a vagina does..(of course we were all wondering!!)-this was real and in yer face!

OP posts:
Toothache · 08/04/2005 13:25

The scientific approach was done not so long ago by DR Robert Winston! I LOVED the sentimental poem...and especially the line:

We are as 2,
We will only separate at the end when the one without a soul will die.

(Speaking of the foetus and placenta).

Moved me to tears. Think I'll look for the poem and post it here. But I can't remember the poets name!! I know he's a Scouser.

Blu · 08/04/2005 13:26

It drove me wacky! Great photography etc, but I hated the way the poem and the commentary (which was supposed to be scientific) kept projecting sentimental and innacurate capabilities on to the foetus. Like saying the foetus was 'learning how to use' it's body when what they were explaining was a reflex action. The point of a reflex action is that it is unconscious, isn't it? And implying all sorts of other things about the baby making choices and reactions to outside stimulii, and then revealing that it's senses weren't even formed yet.

They kept skipping back and forth between ages of feotuses as well. Showing a '4D' scan image of a v young image, and then a different bit of film of an older feotus - which gave the idea that development is greater earlier on than it is.

Also, as far as I could see, they were talking about actual weeks growth from conception - they specifically said after x many weeks growing' etc, and weeks in pregnancy terms are done from LMP. So pics of a 12 week feotus in the programme would equate to 14 weeks pregnant.

With regards to the programme's impact on any abortion debate, the information that early on even an expert wouldn't be able to tell the difference between the embryos of a pig, human and (what was the other example they gave?) and that only 1.5% of our genes make us human and we share 50% of our genes with a daffodil bulb, and over 75% with a cat, made me feel that abortion on demand in the v early stages of pregnancy should be made a lot easier - which might then preclude many later ones, anyway.

But I did find the images themselves v moving.

dropinthe · 08/04/2005 13:26

Sorry,from an outside view -no endoscopes involved!!

OP posts:
Blu · 08/04/2005 13:27

Toothache - it was Roger McGough.

Toothache · 08/04/2005 13:29

Er... the whole point of the programme was the poet reading out the poem. I don't see why they should have read out the poem and then said... Eh well the poet isn't strictly scientifically accurate there! He was using metaphors to describe things.

Still think the poem is great.. so nyah!

Lonelymum · 08/04/2005 13:29

I am fascinated about whyat you said about the vagina. I have always felt cheated when giving birth that I didn't have the chance to see the "business end" close up when the baby is born. I knew I should have stayed up until 11:10 and see it through to the end.

GeorginaA · 08/04/2005 13:29

I didn't see the programme but I wouldn't have had a 3d/4d scan either.

Mainly because my last pregnancy was scans (normal ultrasound + dopplers) every 2 weeks from about 28 weeks and I was sick of them by the end! Plus, I got really worried about the exposure my baby was getting to all these scans and I believe the 3d/4d ones are higher intensity, so I would have avoided them.

Great to see the images, but I think unnecessary in the average pregnancy.

mogwai · 08/04/2005 13:31

I agree with much of what you say, Blu. We are a medical family and it was hard not to think "well, actually it's a reflex" which was a little distracting at times.

I thought it was all a pro-life stunt, actually, especially given the timing, with the debate about lowering the limit for abortion. Stuck out like a sore thumb to me, dh not so convinced.

Toothache · 08/04/2005 13:36

Why are people so sceptical about a beautiful programme??? Showing fascinating images!!!?

I studied Biology at Uni, and I'm hoping to go on to study Midwifery next year. I love science and try not to get clouded by sentiment. I didn't psychoanalyse the film, just appreciated the beauty and was touched by the poem. Why can't it just be left at that?? Does there ALWAYS have to be the paranoid attitude that someone is trying to brainwash people? Or has a politcal agenda??? Very sad if thats the way it is.

Harriett · 08/04/2005 13:44

I also could only stay up until 26 weeks- it obviously wasn't being targetted to pregnant women as it was on way past my bedtime! More targetted to those pesky types who might want those wicked abortions. I was very interested in your thoughts on abortions- having been there myself in a terrible situation and now pregant and over the moon about it I know it was absolutely the right choice. I also thought it was flawed in some of the 'scientific' stuff- but as am very hormonal and now cry at RSPCA adverts etc (!) I did find it very moving- and also very scary as will be doing that end bit in 12 weeks. Definitely don't want a camera shoved up there though! sorry for the rant!!!

Toothache · 08/04/2005 13:46

Was it aimed at anyone? Or is that that pesky paranoia creeping in again.

Blu · 08/04/2005 13:54

I thought the point of the programme was to demonstrate the new 4D imagery.
I don't feel at all paranoid or brainwashed and I like poetry. The brilliant thing about science is that it enables us to be ever more accurate and exploratory about things - something which as an arts practitioner, REALLY grabs my imagination. I think the juxtaposition of the poem with what was meant to be increased accurate knowledge of foetal development defeated the point and made it schmaltzy and sentimental.

But doubt that it will bring down society as we know it, so calm yourself, toothache

pooka · 08/04/2005 13:57

Oh Harriett - I'm so glad I'm not the only one crying at RSPCA ads. It's that old dog in the rain that really gets me.

Blu · 08/04/2005 14:01

And, it's fine for a poem to be metaphorical, projecting things imaginatively etc - but not the commentary.

mogwai · 08/04/2005 14:08

yeah, what's with the RSPCA wet dog? It's worse than when grommet leaves home in the wrong trousers.

moschops · 08/04/2005 14:23

highlight for me? when the baby was crowning and dp turned to me and said 'is that what they call crowning?' the look on his face was priceless!!!!

mind you.............i'm having my first baby in sept and was both fascinated and horrified at seeing the baby emerge.............

Harriett · 08/04/2005 14:24

I find the worst ones are those PDSA ads with 'talking dogs'- " my owner abandoned me in a bag in a phone box" sort of thing. I just want to watch a bit of TV without having to cry at poor defenseless creatures. I'm sure that my cat is having a good laugh every time they are on the tv though...

GeorginaA · 08/04/2005 14:24

BTW, anyone know if this is going to be repeated at any point?

mogwai · 08/04/2005 14:27

lol Harriet. That advert has been around for a while now. I think it got me at a point of PMT a few years ago. I now give a monthly contribution by direct debit to the RSPCA. What a sucker!!

Kiwifruit · 08/04/2005 17:26

I fell asleep for about 40 mins and woke up just as the baby started crowning. Bit of a rude awakening, and as this is my first pg, made me want to run away and hide (also made me think that an elective caesarian wasn't such a bad option after all )!

Thought the imaging was quite amazing (especially the twins - dh is a twin, and he found that fascinating), but wasn't so taken with the poetry.

Thank goodness I haven't seen that RSPCA add - sick/injured/sad animals upset me at the best of times, but in my current hormonal state I'd be a blubbering mess!!

Mud · 08/04/2005 17:27

But the poetry was SO BAD

dinosaur · 08/04/2005 17:28

It was really annoying wasn't it

Blu · 08/04/2005 17:33

I used to like Roger McGough when he was a proper MerseyBeat poet - didn't like most of last night's stuff.

What about the fantasy pregnant Mum with a clapboard beach house (was that Camber?) and an open topped retro sports car, and a body that looked gorgeous in a skimpy bikini in advanced pregnancy?

aloha · 08/04/2005 17:37

I found it really irritating. I think they had some great footage from the new kind of scans but didn't know what to do with it so just added loads of irrelevant stuff - awful poetry, cod-science, plastic model babies, computer generated stuff.... and made it feature film length. I had to go to bed about 10pm and couldn't believe there was still an hour to go! I would have loved an inside view of how a baby is created and develops, but not this one. Agree with Blu that it was very confusing - I kept shouting 'how many weeks is it?' at the screen

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