Kissing babies - do you agree with me ?

[dais23]

Baby is due in a few days, and today I told my mother in law that I do not want her kissing the baby for the first few weeks due to his immune system, and she went off the rails!!

i don’t think I’m being unreasonable for the first few weeks, for reference when I was 3 weeks old my mum & dad had to deal with me having meningitis and sepsis - that must be horrendous for a parent to go through. I feel As if it’s my responsibility to make sure I reduce the risk of my baby catching anything life threatening.

according to her I’m being ‘unreasonable’ because he is part of her. She is not going to come see her first grandchild until she can kiss him 😬
I just can’t believe her main priority is for her to kiss the baby than to keep him safe!

does anyone else agree this is selfish? Or am I being unreasonable 🫠

You're correct and that's great she won't come and visit at the start it doesn't sound like she'll be helpful

Google neonatal herpes

It can give them neonatal herpes and kill them

I’m not fussy with my babies and I’m more than happy to allow them to be passed about for cuddles, etc. from birth (which I can completely understand isn’t comfortable for everyone). However, I was extremely firm on the no kissing rule and ensured that my family knew why they weren’t to kiss the baby. I didn’t even kiss my own baby too close to the mouth and I preferred sticking to the forehead. The cold saw virus is easily passed on to babies and can be lethal- my logic is that the transmission of it isn’t halted by the fact the baby is related to you so why take any risk.

It’s a trend. Give it 5 years and there will be a counter-trend about how they need to be kissed to diversify their microbiome.

*cold sore 😅

https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/neonatal-herpes/

From the NHS website:

“How serious is herpes for a baby?

Sometimes neonatal herpes will only affect the baby's eyes, mouth or skin.

In these cases, most babies will make a complete recovery with antiviral treatment.

But the condition is much more serious if it has spread to the baby's organs.

Many infants with this type of neonatal herpes will die, even after they have been treated.

If widespread herpes is not treated immediately, there's a high chance the baby will die.”
———

The NHS website states that one way the infection can be spread is through kissing babies if you have a cold sore.

———

It’s a personal choice and it depends how much you trust your loved ones to also take precautions if they have a cold sore. However, for me it’s just easier to set a basic boundary of no kissing the baby. That way I’ve put no personal responsibility on anyone else to minimise the risk to my baby.

People who haven’t had a very sick baby will say you’re being unreasonable.

You’re not, they just got lucky.

Absolutely do not back down. Stand firm on this and if that means she sulks then so be it. Your baby, your rules and your dh needs to be setting his mother straight.

I also don’t think you’re being unreasonable. My baby had a blood test at four weeks for prolonged jaundice and it turned out that he has consistently low neutrophils. We would have had no idea his immune system was low otherwise because otherwise he seems like a totally well baby.

I’m sure MIL will change her mind on visiting and if not, it’s her loss. I wouldn’t start parenting with letting a grandparent step over a boundary that was important to me because they think a baby is part of them. She needs to learn that this is your baby and your rules apply, just like her rules did for her children.

Wanting to follow an infant death protection charity’s advice isn’t a trend, even if that advice changes. The Lullaby Trust advise against kissing babies, so it’s not a trend in the way that nature colours are currently fashionable and grey is not. Advice may well change in the future; we only know what we currently know and new things are constantly being discovered on infant safety. The fact that things might change doesn’t mean that parents shouldn’t follow the guidelines at the time for protecting their babies.

Be firm.

Let the mil have her little tantrum. Doesn't bode well for her observing any future boundaries, does it?

I'm not a MIL btw. And I hope that if/when I do have a DIL, I won't disrespect her wishes even if we might disagree.

I do come from a different cultural background though, and it's not usual for mothers to be as highly anxious and isolated as they are in the UK and to have such adversarial relationships with wider families. Similarly, it seems many UK grandparents seem to be more self centred instead of helpful, which is not the cultural norm in the community I was raised in. I find it sad that parenting here has become so much like this, having been raised much more in an extended family/community where the more adults who love and are looking out for children, the better.

I accept the points others have raised about neonatal herpes and if the OP does not wish to take that risk, others should respect it and not throw childish tantrums.

Kissing baby on the forehead is a natural instinct and may allow the adult to check the baby’s temperature and be sure they aren’t ill. Your lips are v sensitive to skin temperature and a forehead kiss can be v accurate in detecting fever.

kissing elsewhere isn’t necessary but isn’t harmful either.

It’s not anxious behaviour to communicate a boundary once and it be adhered to. If the parents have to hover around worrying that MIL will kiss newborn baby anyway, that might very well be… but then whose fault is that?

I’m sure the adult PARENTS can do that if necessary. Although, thermometers exist for a reason and are much more accurate and quantitative…

I think mothers are more anxious and isolate themselves as a result of the grandparents behaviour.

Women used to stay in hospital and be looked after for the first few days or a week, now we're given (poor typically) care for a few hours and kicked out as soon as possible. Some people have no consideration for that and come round as soon as the baby is home uninvited, not even letting the mother have a shower, something to eat, try breastfeeding in her own home, a little nap. Some people even want the mother to run around cooking and cleaning up after them. It's like people don't care about the mother at all, of course she's anxious.

So as a result of this selfishness, and not wanting to have to assert yourself when you feel weak and vulnerable, mothers now are setting boundaries ahead of the birth. It's incredibly important women's feelings are respected at this vulnerable time so they don't get post partum depression.

My main priority when women around me have had babies is to support the mother. I do what I'm asked, and I'm never pushy about visiting etc.

I know right, there is genuine archeological evidence that the human race nearly died out in the 5th century due to a virulent outbreak of baby kissing!
Heaven alone knows how we have survived such dangers!

not kissing babies is the most sensible way of not spreading illness.

there is no need to kiss a baby

especially do not kiss hands or face

your mil needs to learn quickly that she will alienate herself if she has tantrums over her wishes not being allowed.

Whilst I appreciate this is tongue in cheek, the fact remains we experience less baby loss now because we know more. That’s just how science and progress works.

The same can be said for the updated safe sleep advice (or “trend” as some of your here may call it…). As a result, SIDs has decreased by 81% since 1991 when the research-backed guidance was introduced. Of course, we weren’t exactly going extinct before 1991, were we…

It goes without saying that each individual baby is the entire world for those parents, so it’s much less big picture (…maintaining the human race…) and more about simply limiting as many baby illness/deaths as possible.

I am personally just at a loss to understand why, if you are told that not kissing a family baby (who you claim to care about) will pose less risk to them, you would rage against it. It’s quite narcissistic to put your desire to kiss over the potential safety and wellbeing of a newborn baby. MIL need only wait a matter of weeks.

There's always one prat, isn't there?

Your baby. Your choice. ‘Part of her’ 😂😂
It is a fact, kissing babies and young children, face and hands ect is actually super dangerous if you aren’t the parents, particularly if someone carries the cold sore virus alike ect. We’ve also seen a massive increase in things like respiratory virus and bronchitis with complications since Covid in young children, that is easily spread this way.
Simple as this—if people don’t respect your wishes, that’s their issue, not yours.
If she is petty enough not to come and see her grandchild just because she can’t kiss, that reflects more on her attitude and care for the child, you are not in the wrong to want to protect your baby, period, imo. Xx

I think it’s more that older parents are able to see that some of the things that they were advised about (and were perhaps militant about, while the older generation smiled and nodded) have since been shown to be wrong, in some instance reverting back to the previous guidance.

With the benefit of distance it is possible to see that the latest guidance is just that - guidance - and will change again in the near future.

However, it’s natural for each generation to assume that the one before them was full of idiots, that their current experience is the only valid one, and that everything today is correct and static while everything before was wrong.

This is what is meant by “trend” in this context - how things change over time. Not used as a synonym for “currently fashionable”.

It’s not a personal attack on the approach of any previous generations. Though now you say it I do wonder if that is what causes some grandparents to go on the defensive - almost as though new parents are suggesting their way was “wrong.”

Whilst I can actually appreciate how it would make some feel that way, all new parents can do is take the up-to-date medical advice from doctors and experts. To not follow advice based in scientific fact would be foolish, in my opinion.

And ultimately, in any case, to disregard the wishes of parents is out of order. Certainly it’s very unusual behaviour to suggest she won’t visit unless she can kiss the baby. Their baby is not “part of her”. I’m lucky to have a very sensible, reasonable mother and MIL, but I do completely get OP’s frustration.

At the end of the day, there is a chance that a kiss could make a baby unwell. That is a fact.

However, nothing negative, realistically, would come from not kissing said-baby. So to me it’s a no-brainer; simply don’t kiss the baby!

I wouldn't worry - she'll cave and come see the baby as soon as she can. I wouldn't say you're being selfish because of your history I can see why you would feel apprehensive and I hope she follows your wishes.

HAve you told her your reasons? She might understand if you explained it to her.