Awful birth ‘options’ meeting

[Padronpeppersplease]

I’ve just had my 28 week birth options meeting with a midwife and wondering if anyone else has had a similarly pushy experience. She asked me about whether I intended to breast or bottle feed and also what I’m planning for the birth. I said I was 99% sure I wanted to exclusively bottle feed and then also that I was considering an elective c section. I’d heard previously that the NHS try and push both breastfeeding & natural births but I was not prepared for how pushy this midwife was! She said to me that bottle feeding was ‘way worse for baby’ and that ‘a c section was a million times harder on my body’ than a natural birth would be. According to her as my body is built for birth I don’t need to worry about the pain of natural labour and tears during labour aren’t anywhere near as bad as the potential complications of a c section, she also said that opting for a c section would limit the number of children I could have. Despite all this I’m still leaning towards a c section, I’m under no impression that it’s easy recovery & without risks but I honestly feel now like I’m doing something totally outlandish by opting for it.

Yes but with third and opposite way - we wanted a second HB for practical reasons and they were insistent it would be hospital and likely c-section though only cited previous babies weight for a reason.

End was we were booked into see a consultant who read my notes wrong again gave misinformation - it was third time we'd had this and frankly it was too much. We complained got told I'd always been booked into HB no medical reason not to have one. I received shockingly poor care from then onwards.

Dsis was pg and they found problems with baby on second scan - and her MW was awful she complained - had similar complaint apparently dealt and accepted MW at fault with but shocking poor care subsequently.

Dsis ff from word go and MW in hospital were fine with that but unlike in Mums day who also FF they don't give tablet out to stop milk so Dsis was very uncomfortable. I bf with little support from hospital MW with first.

I don't think they like to do more than 3 sections - and recovery well I know people who had c-section who recovered faster than those without and vice versa.

My advice it to ignore MW attitude - and see if you can find a way to get the section you want - can you be referred to a consultant to talk though your options focus on how do you get to that point in your area.

It is amazing. I think anything that nourishes your baby and makes them grow is pretty incredible. There's no way in a line of of 20 year olds you could possibly tell how that person has been fed as a child nor could a doctor.

OP I imagine it was all in the delivery of the way it was said, it sounds awful and I'm sorry this was your experience. It was her job to discuss options with you so you are informed.

We weren't there and won't know how the information was delivered but what she has told you is fact and it is her duty to inform you of both. I see nothing wrong here.

Is this your first baby? I have just had my second by ELCS, my first was a vaginal delivery with kiwi and an episiotomy and let me tell you, it’s been 1000 times easier to recover from both mentally and physically.
That said, I had a traumatic time the first time but that isn’t reflective of how most women experience childbirth I think and I was a lot more mobile straight away, could drive etc etc. There is no easy option but you should decide based on what you think you could cope with based on the facts and not other people’s opinions.

As for breastfeeding, I didn’t want to the first time but when DD1 was born I instinctively wanted to which was surprising. My advice would be to prepare for both options and just go with the flow. You absolutely don’t have to decide on feeding now, it’s annoying they ask you then make you feel like they don’t respect your choices.

I do think you should request another meeting with the hospital, but ask to see someone else.

I can confirm my two bottle fed babies have an amazing bond with me - nothing would have made that better. The huge advantage is that they also have that amazing bond with their father and grandparents who also gave numerous bottles.

It's the exact same nutritional content.
The bioactive components like antibodies or leptin for example can't be replicated but in terms of nutrition it's exactly the same..
.Google right back at ya

Tbf whenever the NHS describes something as “uncomfortable” I’ve always taken this to mean “really fucking painful”. Like that time they injected me through the ear drum without any anaesthesia 😒

Yes but that’s not scientific. You don’t have a comparison in the same circumstances to make that conclusion.

it’s purely anecdotal and you’re disagreeing with someone using scientific facts

Well that's the point they don't! Most of the studies (that I've read) find women who want to breast feed then do or don't and then measure the outcomes. So there isn't the evidence about the case that if you don't want to breast feed what happens.

If you have any full papers (not just abstracts as I like to look at the data) that say otherwise, please send them to me as I would be really interested.

Ignore her (and all the other posters presuming to know what's 'best'). My
midwife tried the same with me both pregnancies but I shut her straight down as soon as it turned from presenting the options into pushing for vaginal birth and breastfeeding. I had two elective sections, zero issues recovering (I went skiing 5 weeks after the second one), babies were both healthy and it was absolutely the best choice for me, others can decide what is best/safest for them. FWIW I have a lot of friends and relatives who are doctors and all of them had elective sections. I did breastfeed both times but I still wasn't interested in the midwife telling me it's better than bottle feeding, and in the end I truly believe it doesn't make a difference.

It's not. You're wrong. Go away.

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1186/s12884-019-2264-0

https://news.lincoln.ac.uk/2022/03/29/maternal-bonding-not-linked-to-breastfeeding-new-study-suggests/

Do whatever you think is best. I had two c sections (medical need), it wouldnt have been my first option but in both cases recovery was absolutely fine. My second was a planned c section which was infinitely better than the emergency one.

There are risks with every decision.

Your mid wife doesn’t sound great TBH.

It's not uncommon to find women's experiences (of whatever) were worse than they'll admit publicly and the NHS's definition of "good outcome" wouldn't always be ours.

I firmly believe (and there is some evidence to support this e.g. a FT report) that there's a lot more out of pocket healthcare expenditure going on in this country than anyone will publicly admit.

So a woman ends up paying privately for counselling or physio. Not counted in the statistics. NHS outcome was "successful" as no-one died.

My only advise....make the choices you want and stick to your guns. Ignore the pressure and just carry on. Its hard but you know what is right for you.

With my first I was pressured into breast feeding. Not wanting to is a valid reason and in my case being pushed into it nearly pushed me into a not very nice place. As soon as I voiced my concerns to a midwife after having my baby, they 100% supported my decision to bottle fed. Sometimes you just have to be up front about it and draw the line with them. I wasn't until I was firm in that this was my choice listen to me that they actually listened.
Third baby, I avoided all breast vs bottle chat until after I had my DD. I very firmly told them I was not breastfeeding after having my DD. The midwife was very supportive and basically said thank you for not wasting my time trying to speak to you about breastfeeding etc.

She is right, but also unprofessional. I was keen on bf and natural birth (and did have both) but was told that I'd have to have a labour ward birth/induction/interventions - not consulted, not advised, told. I asked if I had a choice and was told no (by a doctor). I then asked for a meeting with the supervisor, who confirmed that I did have a choice and actually there were other options that would be suitable. The doctors and midwives at my hospital were very keen on telling you that what you wanted was wrong and in very OTT terms, rather than explaining why they were advising X.

I don’t need a comparison as I’m only interested in the outcome for my DC’s and from seeing how they have grown up, am 100% comfortable that we made the right decision.
Am very pleased that DH had the opportunity to bond over giving so many bottles.

Hi OP - I’m sorry that you’ve had a negative experience with your midwife and that this thread is now being derailed by people who would choose differently to you. You asked if the approach your midwife took was the norm and whether it was ok, and the answer is no. It was fine for her to ask you, and fine to have a conversation with you to ensure you understand the options available to you and can make informed decisions. However, the line is crossed when this presents as judgement and vindication through the use of hyperbole rather than balanced evidence and statistics which take into consideration your individual circumstances. Ultimately maternal care is healthcare, so the same principle applies that for as long as you have the capacity to make decisions and give consent, it is entirely up to you how you give birth. How you feed your baby is entirely your decision too so long as it doesn’t stray into being abusive or neglectful (and formula feeding is neither of these things). People will always judge the decisions you make as a parent and I’m sorry that this judgement has come from the very person you need to trust to look after you and listen to you at this time. You can always request another community midwife if you think this would help. I promise this isn’t the norm and I hope that you have other forms of support around you, both personal and professional, who you can discuss birth and feeding with if you’d like to.

Can you post a link to the evidence that a c section is “million times worse for your body”?

Horses for courses, really. I had an elective CS (agreed by my consultant, who’d had two!) Recovery was a piece of piss, despite my geriatric age. Tried to breastfeed, both DS and I pretty much failed at it, so FF DS from 2 weeks. We’re both still here, hale and hearty.

So much bosom hoiking about other women’s choices. If the OP wants ELCS and to FF, as an adult woman capable of understanding risk, then she should get it without the bloody Spanish Inquisition!

Yes that’s all well and good but you’re wading in with opinions on other people while claiming you only care about the outcome for your children. So which is it?

@Miresquire you're right of course. Also see "this might sting a bit"!

I did think practically why not suggest women take painkillers before these procedures? It would be better to be more honest though if you want women to come back.

After witnessing my DSis's experiences in hospital having her second child I made damn sure I had food, drink and painkillers with me!

I did, twice. Never regretted it.

Have been on Mn for years. Am educated and also married to a doctor so easy to get the information needed.

Well both points she made in your OP were ludicrous overstatements. How experienced is your midwife? I found community midwives involved in home births tended to be much better and more pragmatic than hospital midwives with little or no community experience.

My experience in the 90s was endless lectures on breastfeeding but sod all actual support to do it (and for my first in hospital the pressure post natally was to bottle feed). TBH my DC generation report a lot of the same attitudes and experiences in the current system. The only reason my first ended up breast fed (until I went back to work) was a great breast feeding counsellor who had real experience of practical breastfeeding.

If you want to give breastfeeding a go, then try to line up the advisor in advance and just be open minded. If its not doable then don't worry - a well fed and loved baby will thrive. If you can get the supply working - breast fed babies are highly portable and it can be quite convenient when travelling or going out.

There is a big difference between planned and unplanned caesarians in terms of outcomes. Irrespective of the scaremongering nonsense think hard about your concerns and maybe talk them through with the obstetrician or a more constructive and experienced midwife before making a final decision.