Possible miscarriage and I'm so mad at my husband

[Fireflowers]

I'm still waiting for the results but I have a 70% change of miscarriage at 8 weeks. I went to see the doctor for the 1st time last Friday and there was no heartbeat. I wanted to see another doctor that I liked at 5 weeks but ended up having a fight with my husband. For some reason, he didn't like this doctor because it wasn't the one he recommended and he thinks that I don't trust him. I just moved to Rome, Italy and I got the doctor recommendation from a women's network. She spoke English and I was comfortable with her. He asked his family obstetrician who said that I didn't need to go. I wished that I was in my home country so that I could be less impotent and know exactly what to do. I'm usually such a proactive person and it makes me mad that I deferred to him so much on this, especially knowing that might have contributed to losing the pregnancy.

I'm so mad at myself and also at my husband. I wished I had pushed more for seeing the doctor earlier. Maybe the doctor could've identified risks earlier. I understand that most of the miscarriage is because of abnormalities of the chromosomes, but the other reasons maybe we could've prevented.

I've spent the Friday and Saturday crying and grieving. I feel a bit better but every now and then the anger came. I feel like an idiot for not pushing more, especially given my geriatric age of 42.

Im so sorry you're going through this. It's hard enough without being in a new country and feeling unfamiliar with everything. I don't think you should blame yourself or your DH for what's happened though, and I think you know that too and this is more about a target for your pain, feeling like you could've have some control over this sad thing inflicted on you. You should of course see the doctor you like in future and he needs to understand that it's your choice and not about trusting him or protecting his ego. But that's a conversation for a calmer time and if it risks turning into a fight again then there's deeper problems that need addressing and perhaps you need to come back. But honestly for now please take care of yourself and try not to focus on this too much. The truth is we are impotent to stop these things if they're going to happen and that is cause enough for anger and grief without it being someone's fault.

I am so sorry you are going through this, what sadness these experiences bring. It isn’t unusual for mums to blame themselves when miscarriages happen, but please know that it is unlikely that the doctors or you could have done anything to prevent the miscarriage. Often they are the result of genetic abnormalities and the pregnancy would never have been viable to term. Please don’t blame yourself, life is hard enough as it is - to punish yourself is adding hardship you do not deserve. If you feel you can, open up to your husband about how you are feeling so he can (hopefully) support you xx

I am so sorry you’re having to experience this. In a country you’re not familiar with too.

this is noones fault, at 5 weeks you may possible have seen a completely different dr, but they wouldn’t have been able to change this outcome - this is from someone who had an 8+2 mmc and also a TFMR at 14 weeks - this is not your husbands fault, not the drs fault and absolutely not your fault.

I'm sorry you're in this position. At that gestation there isn't really anything that the doctor could do to save the pregnancy, but I appreciate that you'd rather see an English- speaking doctor for this scenario.

Miscarriages are sad and it's frustrating that we don't know more about why they happen but it hasn't happened because you had a different doctor.

Have you had any pregnancies or children before?

@PoppingTomorrow this would've been my first. I don't know if I'd be able to have another since I'm already 42. I feel like I'm running out of time. This pregnancy happened naturally but I was already prepared to have to do IVF.

Thank you for the kind messages @pinkdelight @QforCucumber @FirstTimeMum1608 @PoppingTomorrow . It really helps as I've been going over and over in my head about what I could've done better. We took the pregnancy very easily and now I know, I'd be more insistent next time about the high risk possibility. if there is to be a next time.

I'm now waiting for the hcg results on Monday and another ultrasound to confirm, but I'm terrified that the miscarriage will happen earlier. I'm feeling some slight cramps.

In the vast majority of cases; you (or a doctor) cannot prevent a miscarriage. Unfortunately your age is a factor but you can’t change that. It really wont help to be angry at your husband, you need to be united and handle this together

@Fireflowers I'm sorry you are feeling so torn up. Threatened miscarriage is no joke and so incredibly stressful.

I wonder if I am misunderstanding, but it sounds like you had a scan at 5 weeks and didn't see a heartbeat - that's pretty standard at that stage not to see anything on an ultrasound. How far along are you now and have you had a scan since 5 weeks? Apart from your age, which admittedly makes a loss more likely, did the doctor have any specific concerns that about what they saw on the ultrasound?

It's normal and natural to search for answers - unfortunately we just don't get them most of tgd time for 1st trimester MC.

You could choose to have his and hers tests done rule out any obvious obstacles. But meanwhile it's good news that you were able to conceive naturally.

There are lots of us on here who've been in a similar position. I'm feeding my Newborn- before him i had 2 MCs at 41 and 42.

@Rosesanddaisies1 is right that you and your partner have to be on the same side, through pregnancy and its ups and downs, and certainly through parenthood!

@LavenderSweetPea I had a scan at 8 weeks and the doctor couldn't find a heartbeat :(

It's not true that there's nothing you can do at that gestation. Progesterone has been shown to be effective at reducing miscarriage risk in women who have had a miscarriage before.

I think you should make the appointment with the Dr that you want to see in future. After I miscarried I didn't want to go back and see the same Dr again as it brought back bad memories.

I don't mean that in a "you should have done this" kind of way btw. Even Drs often don't acknowledge that progesterone can be helpful so it's not likely that it would have been prescribed to you. I really really hope your pregnancy is successful this time but if it's not then you could request a prescription of progesterone as soon as you get a BFP in the future x

please dont direct your anger at your husband - infertility is incredibly stressful for both of you and it can break some couples so please try and understand this is no ones fault and there is no way you could have prevented this loss.

@Fireflowers I'm so sorry you're going through this. I have to agree with others that unfortunately miscarriages in the first trimester are usually unavoidable and much as we chase answers and things to blame, it's often completely random. I unfortunately had 3 losses last year and I don't believe anything could have been done at 5wks that would have changed the outcome. On that note, in the UK it wouldn't be standard to be seen until around 8-10wks for the first time - largely I think to allow for those early and unpreventable losses happening.

Your frustration at your husband is an easy outlet for some very complicated feelings but I think you know in your heart that what has happened isn't either of your faults. In the mix, there is lots of complex stuff around being in a new country - one which is his home where he is comfortable and you are not yet. Aside from the pregnancy, there will be some stuff for you to consider here about your own autonomy and finding your feet and living in a way that makes you happy. There is nothing wrong with deferring to his knowledge, but trust yourself too. I actually lived in Rome for several years in my early twenties. Unlike you, I was single, and my first few months were spent in wandering round, getting gloriously lost and making my own networks etc. It was extremely daunting at times - especially one occasion when I had a medical issue and had to work out how to navigate the system on my own. I'm sure there will be wonderful benefits to you of being with someone who knows it all, but also treat yourself to finding your own way where you can and building your own wonderful relationship with La Cittá Eterna 🥰

Be gentle with yourself. If this is a loss, it's a very unique pain. Allow yourself time to grieve. Then see the doctor you hear about so you can have a proper consultation in English to discuss your approach going forwards. She can maybe advise some supplements that might support egg quality (are you on CoQ10?) and, there may be an argument for starting progesterone or something in a next pregnancy given you would have had a loss (again, this would have been unlikely to be given for a first pregnancy).

Once more, so sorry you are going through this. Try to keep hope. To end on a positive note, after my 3 losses last year (MMC at 11+4, CP at 4+5, MC at 7wks), I am currently almost 15wks with what will hopefully be our rainbow baby. You never know what is around the corner. 💕

There’s very little a doctor can do if you present to them at 5 or 6 weeks. No heartbeat can be detected, no health “risks” can be identified.

Even at 7 weeks (?) it’s not usually possible to pick up a heartbeat (sometimes possible if a vaginal scan)

I would advise waiting for your hcg results and next ultrasound which will give you a more definitive result.

What ifs?/pointing blame is a natural reaction but not rational or helpful really x

@PenguinBall I get that, thank you. I will ask about the progesterone next time, as well as other things that I could've gotten tested for since I'm older.

For some reason, he didn't like this doctor because it wasn't the one he recommended and he thinks that I don't trust him. I just moved to Rome, Italy and I got the doctor recommendation from a women's network. She spoke English and I was comfortable with her. He asked his family obstetrician who said that I didn't need to go.

He is a controlling arsehole. Who is carrying this child? How dare he tell you which medical professional to consult with?

I'd personally be reconsidering my marriage.

That is outside of whether the pregnancy was viable or not.

All the best, OP.

I do think there is a wider problem in your marriage around control.

Your husband expects you to defer to him and he (his family) makes all decisions on your behalf. You were “punished” by him when you didn’t do this (he was angry/accusatory)

Now living in his home country, you must feel completely powerless.

Concentrate on what’s happening now and take the support dh will hopefully give- The dynamic in your marriage is certainly something to give thought to when you’re feeling stronger x

@SmileyClare @YetAnotherSpartacus Definitely issues around control, which I'm finding out now. It's been complicated trying to navigate this. We've been having arguments about doctors since we started talking about having a baby (we married late in life 2 years ago), and I just didn't understand it. I wanted to find an English speaking doctor so I could be independent with the visits, but we'd end up arguing everytime I bring it up. Maybe this pregnancy was not meant to be and we have to solve this issue first.

I’m sorry for your loss, I’ve had several losses, it’s tough, be kind to yourself. Even if you had seen a medic at 5 weeks the outcome would likely be the same, also at 5 weeks it’s unlikely that a scan would have shown anything useful.

speak to a clinic locally, they may be able to do some tests, prescribe supplements. The fact that you got pregnant naturally is a positive sign.

Is he normally quite controlling? Him deciding on your medical care and arguing about your trust in him if you make your own decision is a bit much. What about his trust in you?
I’d be a bit worried about being so vulnerable in another country and potentially stuck there if you ever split up (unless that’s where you would want to be without him anyway)
How is your Italian? Presumably not perfectly fluent, if you want an English speaking OB. Could there be a reason he wants to gatekeep info, and be your translator or have you reliant on him?
I’m sorry you’re experiencing this.

I think firstly you need to be aware that it’s incredibly difficult to detect a heartbeat at 7/8 weeks gestation. What type of ultra sound did you have? This is why you’ve been booked into a second scan. Your pregnancy may still be viable?

There are some steps you can take to maximise a successful pregnancy in the future. Taking low dose aspirin can be beneficial.

Its important that you feel listened to and respected by your dh. I completely understand your wish to be under the care of English speaking HCPs.
However, you must accept that being examined by a doctor at 5 weeks pregnant instead of 8 weeks would make no difference to your treatment.
Progesterone would not have been prescribed in your situation.

12 weeks gestation is the usual date (UK) to confirm a viable pregnancy with ultra scan. Before that, a scan cannot be conclusive or give any useful information on the health or viability of your embryo.

.Some NHS advice on maximising your chances of a healthy pregnancy, including information about using low dose aspirin below.

@SmileyClare thank you for the information. I had a transvaginal ultrasound and it was showing a 5 mm embryo which is small for 8 weeks. The doctor gave us 30% chances just in case my dates are off, but he was not optimistic. I didn't get a chance to do any tests before i got pregnant to identify any possible issues, like the immune system one which could've necessitated the aspirin. I'm only learning this now. Maybe I wouldn't learn this either if I had gone to the 5 weeks visit. I suppose I wish that I had been better informed and I take responsibility for this too.