Expecting better & alcohol reassurance

[aimee1001]

I have been reading the other recent thread about drinking in pregnancy and now I am feeling really anxious.

Based on the info I read in the Expecting Better book saying it was ok, I have been having between 1-3 small glasses of wine per week most of the way through my pregnancy, mostly with food.

I'm 32 weeks now. All my scans have looked ok and baby is a fine size but after reading some of the responses on the other thread I am really panicking that I have damaged my baby's brain. And that even this amount could have caused FAS.

I am going to stop drinking altogether from now on so PLEASE no one post telling me I am an awful person and I shouldn't have done it etc. I can't turn back the clock. I also know nobody can tell me for sure my baby will be ok.

I just feel so wretched. It's too late for me to have a termination obviously. I was hoping for some stories of people in similar situations whose babies have been ok.

You're not an awful person. I don't think 1-3 small glasses of wine would be responsible for causing any problems. I think the no alchohol at all advice is given with an overabundance of caution, which is smart because there's always the people who will push the limits. I had a couple glasses of wine, a couple times in my pregnancies with no adverse effects. My girls are 16 and 17 and top students. Don't beat yourself up.

Your baby will be fine. I had a conversation with my mother about this a few weeks ago, she offered me wine, I took a small glass, she went to top me up & I refused. She went on to say that when her generation were expecting there was no guidelines about alcohol and they all drank & smoked as normal and very little wrong with their babies. My mother had 4 perfectly healthy kids and she had us later in life.

I drank one of those mini 175ml bottles of wine most weeks (not all in one go). All of my children are healthy and doing well at school.

Expecting Better is sensible researched advice. Do not panic because you've read some ill founded things on the internet. You're smarter than that

I haven’t read the other thread but I understood that the change in guidance from one or two small glasses once or twice a week wasn’t actually based on any scientific evidence that this would be harmful but because they felt women couldn’t be trusted to follow these guidelines so changed the recommendation to nil. There are women who are alcoholics whose babies don’t have FAS. I’m sure your baby will be fine

Expecting Better is correct, the NHS advice is designed to patronise women because they don't trust us to interpreting guidelines. You have to drink very, very heavily to cause FAS.

I drank at the same level as you. Kids are obviously completely fine. Ignore the misogynistic twats that tell you otherwise

I read that exact thread and it made me massively roll my eyes at Mumsnet. I've been doing exactly the same as you, my sisters and friends all did exactly the same as you - everyone is fine. My consultant even drank the same as you do in her pregnancy. It's obviously a personal choice and there's no harm in NOT drinking but I resent the sanctimonious posters suggesting that any woman who doesn't remain completely teetotal is a full blown alcoholic.

Another eye-roller here. Those arguments against any alcohol at all seemed to be, "Make up your own mind of course, but don't take any kind of risk even if it isn't actually a risk and don't even think about actually looking at the data, best to go with NHS guidance even though it may in fact be patronising and over-cautious, what sort of person would need to drink anyway?!" Equally, it's best to salute every lone magpie you see, just in case.

You're not a terrible person, moderate drinking wouldn't be a reason to terminate and I suspect most of my mother's generation drank during pregnancy. Congratulations and please don't worry if you can help it.

Oh and I'm pregnant and enjoying the odd glass of wine too.

I have been doing the same, OP. Oster's arguments seemed well-researched and made a lot of sense to me. I'm also being slightly more relaxed with caffeine following what she says.

I am trying to think of this as the very first instance of mum guilt/mum shaming I am going to experience, and try to reassure myself that my choices are my choices. It's tough!

That other thread had some misleading information on it. Some people were really hating on the book. I've read it and it put my mind at ease. To actually see the stats and risks etc I am happy with my choices to drink limited amounts in pregnancy.

It also gave me the final shove to kick my single cigarette per day habit because that's the one thing she said absoultely not to do. I found this enlightening because close friends of mine, only 5-7 years ago were given advice by GP's that giving up smoking can stress you out so much it's okay to smoke "a little bit". I always thought that sounded odd so when it was in big bold letters I stopped immediately. Fortunately I read that book when I was about 7-10 weeks so quite early.

I'm happy with my caffeine intake (two coffees in the morning and a couple of teas in the afternoon) and alcohol intake (half a cider probably 2-3 times a week).

Thank you so much everyone. This is exactly the kind of thing I needed to hear. I was happy with my intake until yestetday. Then I read some of the stuff on the thread with links to another professor in the US and thought what if I'm the one person who only needs one drink to badly damage my baby. I am reassured to hear there are obviously other people drinking about the same amount. We can't all have damaged babies I guess. I will try to calm down. There's not much I can do about the past now anyway.

Don't let one thread make you feel like that - you're going to get people at both ends of the scale. You're an adult who can make your own informed decisions. I read that book and thought it made a lot of sense.

I'm drinking once, maybe twice a week but was in Spain for a week last month and had a glass of wine most nights and no one batted an eyelid - when a waiter tried to top me up one night and I said no and pointed to the bump he actually seemed bemused as to why that would be an issue.

Generations before us drank whilst pregnant and managed an abundance of healthy babies.

Don't stress!!

You’ll find the information you want to hear anywhere on the internet.. you want to drink, you’ll find plenty to back you up who had healthy children. Equally you’ll find those who disagree.

I fall on the side of why risk it.. but I don’t really drink when I’m not pregnant so I don’t miss it. I missed soft cheese, cured meets & pate last pregnancy but it’s 9 months. I survived.

I take risks elsewhere. I have HG & take anti-sickness. It’s that or basically vomit to death. You do what you have too in pregnancy.. if a small drink helps you through then 🤷🏼‍♀️

My SIL is a Doctor, her husband is a paediatrician. She drank the odd glass of wine in both her pregnancies and neither baby was affected,

Personally I haven't (third pregnancy here) but I don't drink a lot anyway. I have eaten rare steak, soft cheese and other stuff you're not supposed to though. I think a lot of the the advice is over cautious and you get some right drama llamas on here.

It's all about your own level of comfort with risk. I wouldn't have been comfortable with drinking at all during pregnancy but then I made some food choices that others might not have. Choices like this when pregnant are just a precursor to the many choices and risk assessments you'll have to make when baby is here.

I was the one who posted the links to rebuttals of that book, mainly to show how important it is to properly research. I do have concerns that people will accept a book writing for commercial reasons but not healthcare advice from actual experts in that field (such as the expert in FAS who responded to the claims) but if you've done your own research and are happy with it then that's all that matters.

And you don't have to 'drink heavily' to cause FAS. Experts in FAS are discovering that some women don't actually have to drink very much to cause varying degrees of FAS, and there's research into why some women can drink heavily with no ill effects on their child and others can drink nowhere near as heavily and have a child with FAS. That's why the advice is 0 - they simply don't yet know why and how it works.

depts.washington.edu/fasdpn/pdfs/astley-oster2013.pdf

This is the link I posted, if anyone is interested. It's by Susan Astley Ph.D. a professor of Epidemiology and Pediatrics at the University of Washington and director of the Washington State FAS Diagnostic & Prevention Network of clinics (fasdpn.org). It's quite interesting.

(But I'm sure she's just infantilising women or being misogynistic...)

All that said, the article refers to daily drinking, not 1-3 drinks a week, so there's no need to be so anxious. But if it worries you, just stop until you feel comfortable.

Expecting Better is correct, the NHS advice is designed to patronise women because they don't trust us to interpreting guidelines. You have to drink very, very heavily to cause FAS

There's so much wrong with this statement my unborn is rolling his eyes!

It's not hard to understand - not drinking equals the least amount of risk to your baby. Why wouldn't you want to avoid as much unnecessary risk as possible? (And by unnecessary risk I mean cutting out alcohol, smoking, extreme sports etc - not advocating wrapping yourself in cotton wool and hibernating for 40 weeks, ffs.)

Well, I'm sitting here resting my weekly alcoholic treat (a nice cold beer tonight) on my pregnant belly. Shock horror. There's no evidence that an occasional small drink is going to do your baby any harm. I had a weekly glass of wine or similar throughout my first pregnancy and my son is absolutely fine, a very bright and happy 2 year old. Try to relax. For what it's worth, I'd happily eat salami, a medium steak and a slice of good runny Brie too. I'm a terrible mother, aaaargh!!

@aimee1001

Please don't worry so much. I'm sure your baby is absolutely fine. I haven't read all the posts, but I remember my grandma said drinking a little red wine in pregnancy is good for the baby and was even recommended back then.

I just wanted to tell you that. I think back in the day people would have the odd glass and it was no big deal. I think now the advice is to avoid completely, as it's hard to draw the line and say how much each person can drink, as everyone's tolerance is different - so the advice is just to avoid it all together.

I reckon there is only an issue if you drink a lot in pregnancy - the odd glass won't cause a problem.

The thing is, 3 glasses a week isn’t the odd glass. It means you’ve had alcohol on 43% of all the days you’ve been pregnant. That’s not occasional.

Some of these comments are unhelpful for someone who is already worried. At 32 weeks baby will soon be here and op can enjoy worrying about sleep deprivation and whether her baby needs more cute outfits

God that article by Astley is dreadful. If she wants to be taken seriously as an academic why isn't she writing peer reviewed papers in medical journals?

The OP hasn't been drinking every day. She's had 1-3 (not 3 for the hard of reading) glasses a week.

OP MN is absolutely hysterical about alcohol. Many women on here still believe you can't drink when you're breastfeeding (you can) and that one parent should stay sober at all times until your children turn 18 in case you ever need to take them to hospital.

If I were you, I'd hide notifications for this thread and go and enjoy the last few weeks of your pregnancy

God that article by Astley is dreadful. If she wants to be taken seriously as an academic why isn't she writing peer reviewed papers in medical journals

You mean like these?
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.researchgate.net/scientific-contributions/38601707SusannJAstley/amp

But never mind. I'm sure she'll be horrified that some random poster on Mumsnet doesn't take her seriously as an academic