My boyfriend of 4 years reacted badly to pregnancy

[micapainter]

Hi,
I'm new to Mumsnet but have lurked on the forums for years finding titbits of useful info for all sorts :) Now I just found out I'm pregnant with my first and have been in a relationship for almost 4 years. We aren't living together but have been recently looking at places to buy. I am feeling very angry and hurt by my boyfriends reaction to the news. He is freaking out right now about whether we can afford it. I was shocked as he has been saying for months how we need to 'get on with it' as he is 42 and I am 36 and he really wants to have kids. We have been having unprotected sex for ages and he said that if it happens it happens and we'd deal with it. Now he is contradicting himself and says we can't just have it and worry about it later.
He seems to really want it to be perfect and have them privately educated but I argued with him that they don't need to go to a private school when there are good state schools, plus I believe if kids have parents who push them a bit more at home to do homework then they'd grow up to be successful ( apologies for my laid back attitude, my head's a mess right now). He seems hell bent on this and I tell him my friends who have kids all manage and you work it out as you go etc etc. He also mentioned he had a ton of debt and that's a red flag as he's never mentioned it before now. I didn't want to push him on it at the time.
He also doesn't get that I'm 36 and I can't wait another 5 years, I'm not saying women shouldn't have kids past 40 but personally I'd rather not. We are in a stable relationship and we could find a place to live in the next 6 moths I'm sure but all I get are excuses such as wanting to wait until we're settled into a house first. He also told me I need to earn more money as he is on a low wage but mine is lower and we should be on equal money? I said how is it equal if I am the one carrying the baby and giving birth to it? What is he going to sacrifice in this?! I don't think we are particularly low money, combined it must be about £45k a year?
All this though has made me question whether I want to even be with this man? He told me I'd have to give up my art practice that I do alongside my full time day job, but that is my passion! Plus I do ok out of it and I feel like I'm getting more success.
I think his issue is he doesn't want to be the sole bread winner and have me sponging off him and not working. I actually feel like he's deceived me as he was asking to see my monthly cycle chart to see when is the best time to try to conceive. It's like he was playing pretend happy families but now it's real he's scared and wants to run back into his cave.
I actually don't feel scared having this on my own as I know I would regret it if I got rid of it.
I'm hoping he is just in shock and scared but I'm worried his words have damaged our relationship. He's saying he didn't realise until after we had sex that it was a dangerous time. I'm angry that he's trying to blame me for it and he's not taking responsibility for his actions.He's acting like a teenager! He also says though that he is also equally thinking how much he wants to have it

Has anybody else been through something similar? Feeling very lost and confused right now :( I was hoping this would be a happy event in our lives but it might cause us to break up.

Is he getting upset because he's not getting his own way though? It's easy to be upset and twist the reasons for it. I'm sure he loves you and you love him, but sometimes that's not enough.

I agree with the others, under no circumstances is it ok for him to pressure you into a termination when you don't want it. The repercussions to your state of mind, let alone your relationship, as result are not worth thinking about.

You need to tell him that the keeping of the baby is not up for debate, it's the rest that needs deciding. You're right in thinking that waiting another year to try again is not as easy as that. Just because you've fallen pregnant this time, it doesn't mean it will be the same next time. It's taken me 2 years to get pregnant and I'm 31!

Good luck, do what's best for you and your baby!

Thanks for the reassurance in my sanity!
I know he was upset for me and not because he wasn't getting his own way, he hates seeing me so upset and hugs me and just wants to talk it out. He just wants to discuss his point of view but not tell me what to do. But I think being firm would help.
I'm not sure if he was gaslighting, he said he got confused and meant I was the one with tons of debt. Now I'm questioning whether I'm making the right decision financially :/

He is entitled to tell you hos opinion. But until he is pregnant he does not get to choose a termination.

End of.

I think saying something so hurtful that you make another person cry, then getting upset yourself and hugging it out, but then to keep on re-iterating the same point is the actual dictionary definition of being a manipulative shit.

He is trying to manipulate you. He doesn't want to discuss your pov, he wants you to come round to his pov.

I'm not sure this is a very nice man, tbh OP. And yes, he will have a lovely side, no doubt, but I'd bet the house his lovely side is reserved for when he is getting his own way.

Actually, I've just re-read your OP - the checking of your cycle, consistent unprotected sex - WTAF did he think was going to happen? His actions led you to believe he wanted a baby as much as you did and now he's trying to make you have a termination?

Around a third of domestic abuse starts when the woman is pregnant or has recently given birth. Not a very nice stat to read. But I'm putting it out there anyway.

^ and he has now told you his opinion. He doesn't keep getting to go on about it.

Tbh I would back off from him.

He can get back in touch if he changes his mind.

Been thinking about it a bit more.
When says he thinks you are being usolated if you have space what he actually means is when you are on your own you are free to think and make up your own mind.
He isn't trying to support you he is trying to influence you. For whatever reason he has got himself in a massive panic about this. That is his problem not yours. And ibdeed he might deal with it better away from you where he will ha e to accept he cannot influence your decision all he can do is decide how he is going to respond to it.

I suspect part of his panic is he is worried about not being centre of attention and not being able to control everything.

'I actually feel sick to my stomach now thinking about the fact that he is trying to make me do something I clearly do not want to do.'

You should do, and keep hold of that feeling. Because this person is not 'lovely'. No one who is 'lovely' has unprotected sex over and over with his girlfriend and then tries to manipulate her into having an abortion she does not want.

I'm glad you are not living with him. It makes it easier to say, 'There will be no abortion. You have said your piece, but the time to prevent all this was before. Now the horse has bolted. You are trying to pressure me into a termination I don't want and won't have, so I need some space away from you and this relationship to figure out if I want to continue with someone who does this to me.'

I think in your position id have a week of no contacting him. Decide how you want to do it. I would tell him you're having this baby and you'll raise it on your own.

I agree he does not sound lovely. He wants to keep you where he can try to influence you and does not want you to have space so that you cannot make a decision he doesn't like

He said he doesn't like us having space as he worries I'm becoming isolated and it's making it worse for me. It was really nice to hear him put me first for once.

Oh, and this, this is classic bullshit. He doesn't like you having space because then you can form your own opinions and stick to them. Being in your face all the time, hugging you better, etc etc gives him space to manipulating you into doing what he wants. He's not putting you first, he's putting himself first under the pretext of its being for you.

So is the 'we can try properly in (next year, when we're more settled, when things are more stable, insert excuse)'. He's strung you along for 4 years already, you don't even live with him, much less married, have a family and all that. It's no skin off his nose to string you along further until it's too late.

The 'sponging' comment would fuck me off, too. He'll have to pay to support his kid. Tough shit.

You are being very sensible, and he is being a twat.

If he can't commit at 42 he will never be able to commit. Even if you did get a termination, he would never want to commit to having children.

I would try to imagine life with out him (obviously this is unlikely as hes the babys father) and think how you will get on with just you and a baby/child. If you know you can do it by yourself, then you can do it. Then think about how you can accommodate this commitment-phobe into the situation. I think you need to make it clear you are calling the shots. This is your baby/body you will decide about the birth (if there is one), school's etc. You get to decide if you continue the pregnancy or not. This really isn't about him. You are not married, and and he has decided he doesn't want to/ isn't able to support a child. This means you get to call the shots.

He's not putting you first. At all. He's gaslighting and pressuring you.

Red flags are waving all over the place -which is something I never normally say.

And babies are surprisingly hard to make - it took me 3 years and I started trying at 27!

Sorry red flags for me too, my ex tried to pressure me into having an abortion. He was very manipulative, and used a lot of indirect ways of trying to make me believe I would be an inadequate parent. Yet he was happy to have unprotected sex with me on several occasions. He tried very hard to convince me, he said he cared about how I felt and loved me - he said we could have a family in the future and perhaps he might end up having a family with someone else one day, it wasn't the right time etc. It was unrealistic as he was in his 40s. We split up when I was pregnant and years later he still has never had this 'family'. ... Now he's not that interested in his DS. I now realise he would have said anything to get me to terminate.

OP just look after yourself and don't let him convince you to have an abortion. Having a termination unless your are absolutely certain will be detrimental to you. I never regret having my beautiful DS, he's the best thing that ever happened to me!

Take care xx

Wow this is the second post I've seen today about someone ttc with their partner only to have him try to force them to abort when they got pregnant! The time for him to tell you he wasn't ready has passed, ready or not he now has a child! So sorry to hear you have been put in this horrible position.

For me personally anyone who even mentioned aborting my child would be out of my life! You obviosly want this baby, and as you say you may not get another chance. I have a friend who had an abortion in her late teens, now in her mid 20s she is having fertility treatment and has been told that her chances of success are low!

You need to do the right thing for you and your baby, maybe he will come round and realise what a massive dick hes being, maybe he wont. I think I would be planning life without him and if he can show you he deserves to be in your and the baby's life then consider it.

Hi

Firstly, none of us know you or him or your relationship so I think it's really important you also talk this over with people close to you just in case we're misreading or missing something. This may be just a short term panic he's having. My partner also reacted badly to an unplanned pregnancy for about a week because he hadn't decided whether it was for him or not. And honestly he is bloody brilliant & it was a completely out of character episode & probably the only time he's been in the wrong, so I am absolutely not wanting to suggest that this is unsumountable. All that said I just became concerned about a couple of things you said & I wanted to urge you to just consider some of his behaviours. For about 1/3 of women who experience abuse by their partners, it starts in pregnancy with the warning signs being attempts to control & isolate. By this I mean manipulating situations so you spend less time perusing your own interests & friensdships, putting a strain on your relationships with others, twisting situations to guilt trip you or make you feel things are your fault unfairly, putting you in a financially vulnerable position by leaving you without an income etc. no one knows why but it's possible some men feel threatened by your attention being redirected to the baby. I think it's important you retain some independence as at the moment there's a lot of expectation of you sacrificing your interests. Clearly you really want this baby & I think because of that, you'd regret it forever if he pushes you to terminate. It's not that easy conceiving, you don't know that it would happen easily a second time. You'll be fine if you have to do this alone but it might not come to that anyway. Just remember that you've not done thus to him, he's not a victim in all this. He made adult choices. & now he has to be adult about dealing with them. Wishing you lots of luck.

Firstly, I want to thank every single one of you for your messages and for the support in this. I wish I had the headspace to reply to each of you. I'm overwhelmed by how many of you care.
Had another talk with him this morning but it's just made me even more stressed and upset. I'm actually feeling shaken up.
He's saying lots of things that are insane and makes me think he is massively panicking about this and throwing everything at it. But he keeps saying he does want to have it but the issue for him is that I haven't given much thought as to how we would cope, as I have debt how could we afford it?
My head is so messed up right now I'm finding it such a struggle to think. I just called my best friend who said she thinks he's panicking and he would have it with me but just needs more time and maybe i should try to reassure him that I have money sorted. We both have our own property and even though mine is only a small share of a flat if I sell I would have about £20k, he would have £100k, surely some of that could go into a fund?
He seems to have so many excuses. I got so upset when.. brace yourselves... he said I should get rid of my cat as they cause allergies?? wtf?!! I've grown up with pets and have no allergies, he hasn't had pets and has allergies!! It really upset me, it felt like he is trying to scare me. And he said I'm the one being selfish using my age as a reason to keep it??! Do you think this stuff is just his panicked brain not really processing it all? And he's saying stuff without really thinking?

My friend said he clearly does love me and he doesn't want to lose me. But the way he is acting is making me scared of any future with him, if we disagree on such important issues and they're so black and white how are we ever going to have a happy family life? He has a very warped view, his argument is that he would sacrifice his life for a child even if it means working weekends in a bar!? I said I disagree totally as bringing up a kid in a stable, happy home that isn't stressed about money is better. It would be damaging if the parents are never around and busy working all the time - just like his mum was. He wants everything to be perfect. I just don't know if I can be with him if he thinks so differently to me. I'm actually thinking now if I want to bring up his kid on my own of it means he will still be there controlling its life.
I hadn't thought about the thing a few of you suggested that he dislikes me being isolated as it means he doesn't like me having more space to think. I think I will say to him I need some space.
I feel so confused and stressed. So much is going through my mind. I think I need to speak to my mum even though I didn't want to get family involved but he has told his mum already and apparently she is worried about the money side. I don't believe him, but then maybe she is the one influencing his worries about money? My mum's away for 2 weeks now though so its going to be tough not being able to talk to her. I spoke to my sister who was supportive and said he was being selfish but then she turned on me after a discussion about something else and now she's been upsetting me too even though she said I need to not get stressed!

I don't feel like he is pressuring me into having a termination now though, maybe I was getting upset and thinking the worst and probably because I've stood my ground in telling him I'm having it he is trying to work out a way of having it. I think we both need more time, it's only been a week after all. Feels like bloody years!
You're right in that no one can know how he really is and I'm probably painting the worst picture of him right now as I'm upset. Maybe let's see how he is behaving in a couple of weeks.
Right now I need to take care of myself and then when I'm able to try to come up with a plan or research what help we could get (but even then he's anti receiving benefits cos he's proud). Any suggestions welcome as to how I can reassure him.

You seem to have decided what you want. Now all you need is to work out how.

But you know what, having kids is quite hard work but lots of people do it. Lots and lots of them.

You'll manage. One way or the other.

Really happy to hear you are working through it.

Regarding money, we don't have much money and still manage very well with kids. It's good to be organised of course but money isn't everything with children, a loving home is the main thing.

Sending hugs OP. X

Glad that you are staying strong, you are absolutely right, you need to focus on looking after yourself. Money is not everything, as long as you have a roof over your head and food on the table you will be ok and so will the baby. Babies don't care if they are in designer outfits or second hand ones. Lets face it they grow so quickly even second hand will not have been worn that much. The only things you really need new are the matress and car seat (if you are having one) My Mum said to me "babies are like weddings they are expensive, but they don't have to be as expensive as everone tells you they are." All your baby really needs is to be loved you have 5 years till you need to worry about schooling anyway and I remember reading somewhere that state school children do better at uni as they are used to having to learn stuff without being spoon fed!

You can lookinto benefits entitlements on the government website for different scenarios eg living together not living together.

I can't comment on the whole topic but as for your OH I think he is being really inconsiderate. For him to want a baby but then completely change his mind whilst your pregnant is not right. And as for private schooling, I am very fortunate to be have the lifestyle me and my OH have, my dd could have gone private but we chose to send her to a public school as both my and oh went public and have become successful. Do what you thinks right and communicate with your partner. Good luck and congratulations

He's an arse. You're better off without him.

It's clear what he's doing. He's desperate not to have this baby.

So his tactic is: scare tactics. He knows there's still weeks to have an abortion.

So he comes out with every reason he can think of.

Problem is, you're eminently sensible and are batting them away as the nonsense they are.

So the list of reasons is getting longer and more desperate as he falls over himself to find one that will scare you sufficiently.

The "afraid you were getting isolated" thing is a baaaaad one, I'm afraid. That's a real red flag one.

But the others are just amateurish manipulative tactics.

I do think he has debt. Undoubtedly. I do think he is trying to gaslight you that you are in a worse financial position than you actually are. Babies actually do not cost much as you can get everything second hand these days, and that doesn't increase till you have to get a childminder.

You are quite right that terminating a much wanted pregnancy at 36 just because of the father is utter madness. From now on you simply have to not even entertain that conversation.

From now on you have to start talking this way
A) An abortion is not going to be forthcoming so we are not having a conversation about it now or in the future.
B) If you do not wish to be a part of this child's life, that is your choice and I wish you well in the future.
C) I am not going to spend the next 9 months listening to this. Shit or get off the pot. My mind is made up.
D) Should you decide parenthood is not for you at this time, I will be making all the decisions about this baby on my own, without hesitation.

God, he's really grinding you down isn't he?

Tell him you need some space. Because you really do need some space.

If you put your plans for moving in together on hold, could you manage with the baby in the housing you currently have?

Gosh he sounds hard work! Just now you need to prioritise yourself as the pregnant lady. Relax and get a massage and give yourself some space. Keep the cat and don't worry about the money so much-it will be fine.

I brought my DD up on my own and it's been fine. You can do it if you need to. Just now, you need less stress, give him time to come round (hopefully) but if he doesn't then so be it. You will be fine. We're all fine. Everything will be fine.

Let's give this guy his due - the reality of the responsibility of parenthood has hit him between the eyes. He is having a bit of a meltdown and trying to plan the future in minute detail and everywhere he looks there seem to be problems: money, education, change of lifestyle. It is (and I hate to sound like the grandma that I am) part and parcel of the change in attitude in the last 40 or so years, where people are used to having control over their lives in ways that we did not - we just took uncertainty for granted. The unpredictability of the future with a child is obviously something that he is finding hard. And I would guess that he feels bad about his reaction and what it is doing to you.

But the truth is there is absolutely no good time to have a baby - if you sat down and did a cost benefit analysis, no-one would ever reproduce! At some point you have to choose to take the plunge - you have plunged and at the moment he is struggling for a lifebelt!

It is very important that you own the decision about what to do with your body and no-one should ever feel pressured into a termination - which you clearly do not want.

So - the future is that, assuming your pregnancy proceeds well, there will be a baby and time will tell as to whether you bring this child up as a partnership or separately. The priority would be for the child to feel loved.

Maybe you could tell him that you understand what a big step this is and how it has shaken his foundations - unless he is some kind of monster from whom you need to part pdq, you need to face up to his fears and uncertainties as a couple, supporting each other rather than two people who have locked horns.

When I was first pregnant we both panicked a bit - we had put in an offer on a house and had to cancel the whole thing as we would not have been able to afford the mortgage. But as the pregnancy progressed we calmed down and in fact bought another smaller place before the birth - but the idea of taking on a mortgage when we were about to halve our income felt pretty bloody scary I can tell you!

Take a deep breath - what will be will be and this too will pass.