Are your children’s vaccines up to date?

Set a reminder

Please or to access all these features

Pregnancy

Talk about every stage of pregnancy, from early symptoms to preparing for birth.

Sad at having different surname to children

96 replies

iloveberries · 29/03/2016 08:07

I have DS with my EXH. I kept my married name as it felt very much mine. I had established my career with this name and most importantly I like having the same name as DS.

I am pregnant with a much wanted baby with my new partner (not that new!) He wants the baby to have his surname and I can fully understand that but I feel really sad at having a different name to baby. I think one day we may marry but even then I think I would like to keep my current name (ex H name and same as DS as it feels very much mine.)

I know this is a trivial problem and name is just a name and the main point is that we are so delighted to be having a baby after a few troubles long the route to healthy pregnancy but I can't shake that feeling that I feel uncomfortable that the baby will have his last name and not the same as me.

OP posts:
Are your children’s vaccines up to date?
MirandaWest · 01/04/2016 13:37

In Spain my understanding is that you have two surnames. One from your dad and one from your mum. Can be in either order although usually dads first I think.

I can't remember which surname you pass on to your children - possibly your dads surname but there may be a choice. And there's nothing to change when you get married. It would mean that half siblings would have different surnames but they would share the common parents part.

WombatChocolate · 01/04/2016 14:08

It maybe true that anyone can take on any name, but in reality,few women take on the name of the father of their child unless they are married. Even though it maybe possible and legal, I suspect most women would feel a bit odd about doing it....and it would be interesting to know what men feel about it. I suspect they might not be that keen, but I might be wrong.
So the fact it is possible, but not widespread, means that women still often feel a sense of exclusion and discomfort when their children have the fathers name that they are not married to.

I would disagree that this isn't about marriage. I this it is to a degree. We say we are totally happy as a society about people not being married and living together - I think that is largely true about people without children, but in many social groups (and it maybe more the case with the more affluent because evidence suggests marriage is increasingly concentrated amongst the affluent) women with children experience awkwardness at some point when not married and if their children have different names. It is a reality that society isn't as progressive as we might think. I am not making a judgement t about what is right or wrong, but just a comment on the reality in society.
So being free to take on any name you like doesn't in reality remove the awkwardness people continue to feel when their child has a different name - it maybe because they would like to be married, or that there is another woman who already took that name and they do t want to be a second d version of it, or it might be due to children from a previous relationship having different names.....for whatever reason the names are different and I can see why it makes women sad.

kiki22 · 01/04/2016 14:24

Wombat my dp never had any problem with me having his name without being married no one in either family did the only people who find it odd or wrong tend to be the older generation, even then a few have said they got married purely for the name and wish it would have been acceptable to just change their name at the time.

SoupDragon · 01/04/2016 14:45

It maybe true that anyone can take on any name

You stated that it was impossible.

motherinferior · 01/04/2016 14:54

No, I would have felt pissed off - not sad - by the continuing idea that women and children should all be known by the name of the adult male partner.

SpeakNoWords · 01/04/2016 15:08

I've never experienced any awkwardness or anything negative, no exclusion or discomfort, from not having the same surname as my partner and children (I'm not married to my DP). I also don't care that my children have a different surname to me, it was never a factor in the decision making process. We chose to give my children my partner's surname after careful consideration, and not out of any kind of unconscious going-along with norms.

MeredithFrampton · 01/04/2016 16:11

Kiki "even then a few have said they got married purely for the name and wish it would have been acceptable to just change their name at the time"

What a baffling statement

Why would anyone want the superficial bit - the name change - without any of the legal and financial protection that marriage offers to you and your children?

kiki22 · 01/04/2016 16:24

Meredith I don't understand what's so baffling it's pretty easy marriage wasn't important to them but having a family name was, they got married because they wanted the name, I changed my name without getting married at the time these people got married that wasn't seen as an option if it was they would have changed their name.

What's important to one person isn't always important to another.

Blu · 01/04/2016 18:09

Wombat - but every which way causes 'awkwardness' at some stage for women, or for anyone who breaks out of any of the traditional defaults.

I fully understand why some / many women don't want their children to have a different name to them - so give children the mother's name. And then if men want to have the same name as their children and partners, let the man change his name! Or toss a coin to decide who changes their name...

Of course marriage isn't irrelevant if it is all part of the becoming-a-family process, but yes, it is irrelevant in terms of what anyone is at liberty to call themselves legally and in practice.

The problem with double barrelling is what happens to the next generation I honestly think that if my double-barrelled DS finds his name a problem and can't find the gumption to choose a name or a combination of names or new name or a solution that suits him and any partner, then I will disown him.

The next generation will do whatever they like! Pick a name each, maybe men take father's name and women the mother's - or vice versa. What they won't get (hopefully) is a load of pressure and crap and ILs mis-addressing envelopes and getting offended that some outdated patriarchal tradition isn't being upheld.

iloveberries · 02/04/2016 07:29

I've decided I don't want to change my name to his.

I don't want to double barrel mine or the kids. I really don't care about having a different name to DP, indeed if we ever got married I would keep the name I have now.

I do want the baby to have the same name as me. He will want the baby to have the same name as him. I think my reasons make more sense (but I would say that!)

I can't actually think of a way to decide other than a coin toss!

OP posts:
PennyHasNoSurname · 02/04/2016 07:41

I think if you and your baby are to have the same surname then you ought to revert to your maiden name. Otherwise they baby will have the same surname as your exh. You could always ask ds if he wants to change to your maiden name too?

Then if it bothers dp that much he can change to your maiden name on marriage.

BertrandRussell · 02/04/2016 07:48

"As green lizard said, I wouldn't be happy if I was a guy and my child had the ex of my partners surname."

Jesus. And people say there is nothing patriarchal or misogynist about our naming traditions...

SoupDragon · 02/04/2016 07:58

As a woman I don't think I'd be happy about my child having the surname of their fathers ex. Surely that's just human nature.

BertrandRussell · 02/04/2016 08:02

If that was the name the father had gone by for a long time, was happy to use and was known personally and professionally by- if that was his name in other words, why would you object?

SoupDragon · 02/04/2016 08:07

thecreasibs why are irrelevant. The point as that it has nothing to do with "patriarchal or misogynist naming traditions..." and everything to do with personal feelings, regardless of sex.

SoupDragon · 02/04/2016 08:07

Ffs. the reasons why

BertrandRussell · 02/04/2016 08:12

Sure. Of course it is. It's just a coincidence that men tend to make a big deal of their children having their name..................

WombatChocolate · 02/04/2016 09:45

The OP may not 'feel sad' because she is uncomfortable about patriarchal traditions dictating the child has the fathers name, rather than hers......however, patriarchal traditions are still very much at play within this and our society, however progressive we like to think we have become.

So, on one hand women are now free to marry or not, to take the name of the man or not. Indeed, as has been pointed out, they can take the name of their DP if they choose even if not married or he can take her name or they can choose a totally new name if they want . The fact is though,that few people go for the last 2 options and most men DO feel attached to their name and don't want to change it and do feel quite keen for their child to have it too. They have rarely been in a position of being asked to give up or change their name, and historically because of name changing through marriage, their children have had their names.....and losing the 'right' or 'norm' of that unsurprisingly isn't that popular with them. Men are generally not keen to give up their names and like to have their children named after them - even men who very quickly have nothing really to do with the mother and don't have or intend to have much contact with the child. It might be a bit far to go to say that men giving their names to women and children is a sign of possession......but ultimately the historic roots of it, certainly involve this.

Today, we don't see it as this and we like to think we are progressive and have choice. And yes we do have choice, but the fact that so few women give their own name to their child (and even on this thread, for the first 2 pages, it was assumed that the man would give his name - the patriarchal traditions are strongly held to amongst many women as well as men)shows that we are still in the grip of the past values and traditions.

The OP isn't sad that she isn't married to the babies father, nor that she doesn't have his name. She is sad that the baby will have a different name to her,because it makes her feel somehow less connected to that child, perhaps just in the eyes of the world. We know what the world thinks doesn't really matter, but we still do care. I think parents generally want to be seen to be connected strongly to their child. Naming is the key way, the outside world and especially the world who do t know us see that - it is why men want to have their children have their name,and women often want it too and feel uncomfortable without it. In the past when most were married and had the same name, there was no issue, but now that fewer are married, unless going double barrelled, the child can only have the name of one parent, so one isn't connected in the same obvious way,to the outside world. Saying we shouldn't care about this, or it is a patriarchal construct that needs challenging might be true....but it doesn't stop people still feeling sad about it - feelings are feelings.

The complexity of family relationships is clearly shown on this thread - people with names of ex-spouses, previous spouses holding the name of the current partner, people with maiden names and going back to maiden names, step children with all kinds of names. People with 'blended' families want to recognise the blood links to the past often, but to move forward with new families being united. All very tricky, especially when naming is such an emotive issue.

WombatChocolate · 02/04/2016 10:01

FWIW OP, I can totally see why you want to have your child having the same name as you. I can also see why your DP isn't keen to have his child named with the surname of your Ex. Whatever we say, naming is at least linkage and perhaps even a sign of ownership. If you had reverted to your maiden name, perhaps DP whilst still not liking it,wouldn't feel so uncomfortable about the child not having his name....because it wouldn't be the name of another man. We could see this as patriarchal and trying to show ownership, or whatever, but I think it will always be the norm for men to not want their child named after a man from the past.

OP! Seems like you can't have everything here. You might have to sacrifice the name you have used in your career (although can't you just keep that name for work and have a different name socially - lots of people do that) and that will mean your child can have the same name as you - perhaps your maiden name??
So is the most important thing to you, keeping the name because of work, or having the same name as your child? Keeping the old name and giving it to your child is understandably not popular with your DP (and this is not the same as someone simply wanting to give the child their own maiden name - he sees it as the name of another man, not your name).
In your position, I would stick to my guns about the child having the same name as me, but I would be prepared to alter my name,to make it something acceptable for the whole family. You might feel differently of course.

Secondtimeround75 · 02/04/2016 10:02

I think it's very unreasonable & makes no sense to give the baby your ex husbands name.

That name technically only belongs to your ds , son of your husband.
You only like it , it's not your name.
So essentially you are choosing vanity over the feelings of your baby's father,

You could revert to your maiden name , give the kids their dads name( you have already set this precedent) This is the best way imo to blend the family fairly.

MeredithFrampton · 02/04/2016 10:34

While I am someone who thinks that children should always have their mother's surname, barring exceptional circumstances, and am totally opposed to the patriarchal assumption that babies take their dad's name, I do think it's a bit weird to name the baby with your ex's family name.

I understand that it's been your name for a while now, but you've name-changed once and you can do it again. It's not about patriarchy. My husband was previously married, I was in an unmarried LTR, and I would find it very odd indeed if OUR children had the surname of either of our exes. It does imply that the new baby's father is your ex.

In your situation, OP, I would revert to your maiden name and change your son's name to yours, and give the new baby the same name. Either that or choose a new name for all of you. I would not give the new baby your ex's surname.

BertrandRussell · 02/04/2016 10:35

"That name technically only belongs to your ds , son of your husband.
You only like it , it's not your name."

So when a woman changes her name on marriage it does not become her name? Hmm What- is she only borrowing it and she has to give it back if the marriage ends?

Blu · 02/04/2016 11:05

The OP's older DS also has feelings here - and does not want his Mum to change her name away from the one he shares with her....

OP - double barrelling is a compromise, wanting the baby to have your surname and not your DP's is a stand off.

iloveberries · 02/04/2016 11:42

Hang on a minute.... My name is my name. I don't see it as my exH's name. I've had it for years and it's who I am. I feel like and I am the person with my name. I like the name.

I'm not changing DS name against his will. Even if I wanted to change it then I think his father would be hugely opposed to that. The most important thing is that DS doesn't want to change his name.

I do see that we are in a stand off not a compromise.... Need to think some more don't i.

OP posts:
iloveberries · 02/04/2016 11:43

Also - it's not as simple as changing my name at work. I am self employed in a competitive field and often get recommended by name so it is important to have that name (at least professionally.)

OP posts: