London folk- baby on board badges rant

[GirlFromMars1]

Is it just me or do you find most people will pretend not to see your badge? Seriously I wish I could time my morning sickness so I could do a fabulous projectile vomit over all the buggers who see it and then quickly look away to avoid giving up their seat! I'm sure people are much more gracious elsewhere. I've always offered up my seat in the past when I've seen pregnant women. It just makes me really angry.

I always asked. Commuters (including me) aren't always the most switched-on in the mornings and are often reading a phone, kindle or newspaper as well as listening to music. Looking closely at other people is bordering on bad manners if you're a London commuter. It certainly isn't the done thing.

I used to open my coat as the tube pulled in to expose the bump (also saved me getting too hot) and if it was crowded or I got stuck by the doors and I wasn't already in the line of sight of people sitting down, I'd say loudly "excuse me, but I'm not feeling very well. Could I sit down?" I rarely had to get past "excuse me, but..." and people would jump up.

Admittedly early in my pregnancy I got quite dizzy and fell over, and that was such a horrible experience I had no shame about speaking up after that. I considered it far less rude to ask for a seat than to fall on or be sick on someone!

As far as travelling outside of busy times goes I do this as much as possible but I'm a Dr in central London so my shifts sometimes coincide with rush hour and it's unavoidable.

As I said previously, if you ask for a seat and the person in the seat says they need it, that's fair enough, ask someone else. I'm not suggesting pregnant women start turfing out disabled passengers.
Look, it's never happened to me so I'm happy to be told different, but it's surely just a short but civil exchange with another human being, is it not?
Yes I totally agree with PPs, it would be great if everyone who needs a seat was offered one, but sometimes when you're tired or in that weird commuter trance, you forget to look around, and you might need to be asked.

As a non-Londoner who commutes in fortnightly I had no idea what the badges were. Thanks for the info.

The issue really isn't the asking anyway. If you don't like the badges then fine,don't wear one, but don't bash those who do. And please don't say it's always because people just "can't see you" as that is bollocks. I have had people look right at it and then steadfastly look at their phones the whole journey to avoid catching my eye again.

The debate about whether you should or shouldn't ask is irrelevant. If you see someone wearing one and you don't need the seat yourself, you should offer it up irrespective of them asking. Which not all of us are physically able to do, it's not always a question of confidence.

surely just a short but civil exchange with another human being, is it not?

Civil? Ha!

Thing is, you get it. But not everyone does. The problem is that society doesn't respect pregnant women. So asking for a seat will get you the stink-eye because you're only up the duff, self-inflicted, innit, you whore, close your legs, why should I give up my seat, I'm tired, it's nothing to do with me that you decided to get pregnant, is it? (All things that have been said to women I know.)

I'm not against asking for a seat, absolutely not, but I hate the mentality that a pregnant woman asking for a seat is cheeky because someone else might have a disability. Or that people see the badge and ignore it. If they don't see it, fine, but if they see it and look away, that's rude. Unless they need the seat more. And who knows?

I once saw a letter in the metro from a disgruntled commuter saying why should he have to give up his seat due to someone else's "lifestyle choice"

Well I really meant the disabled person is a civil human being, not necessarily everyone else!
Honestly, I knew people could be a bit arsey about giving up seats, but I didn't realise people are actually getting verbals to that degree, so I can now understand why pregnant women would rather someone just offered.

Its such a myth that badges are only worn in order for people to offer you a seat!!I wear my badge as have a daily battle, yes battle, through the scary commuter mass that is Waterloo train station during rush hour. 20 platforms, 1000s of people running for trains from all directions, shoving, bumping, pushing anyone in their way so they make their precious train.

My belly is not eye view through the crowds. So I will do anything possible in order to be seen and not have people shoving into me. My badge is far higher and more noticeable than my belly.

I was last pregnant 2 years ago and found people much more observant, kind and willing to give up their seat. This time I am regularly ignored. I barely even get to near the seats some mornings such is the crush so dont even have the chance to ask anyone if they are willing to give up their seats as would have to scream across the silent carriage, no thanks. But people seated often glance up and clock me/my bade and do nothing. If I was ever one of the lucky few to bag a seat on train, Id always glance up at stations ( only 2 during my 20 minute journey, not really too much effort is it?!) to see if there was a disabled/elderly or pregnant person who needed a seat. Anyone else should do the same. Not bothering to ever look up from their self absorbed worlds and see who is stood around you, is no excuse.

Oh I would always offer a seat to anyone I thought might need it if I saw them and frequently do. If I'm with dd I will make dd stand for elderly people or pregnant people or someone with a baby/toddler. If dd has already stood for someone then I will stand.

If I'm on my own though I'm probably reading and wouldn't notice them. Sorry but don't think its my responsibility at all to check at every tube stop if a pregnant/elderly person has got on.

Someone offered me a seat on a train last Thursday. I said thank you. He then asked for his seat back because I wasn't polish and he would only give seats for his kind. (His exact words)

Pretty disgusting.

civil & train do not go together

Whothefuckissimon I agree - of course if I noticed I would offer (if I weren't 39 wks!), but 9 times out of 10 I'm trying to get a few more minutes snooze or escape in a good book before the daily grind begins. If people expect others to be permanently on the look-out, this does then make pregnant people out to be a special class of citizen (or indeed forces passengers to make judgments about other's potential seat needs).

Of course, in an ideal world there will be a spare seat or you will catch the eye of someone who will offer you their seat as soon as you get on. That's how the system was designed and how it should be.

But sometimes trains are too crowded, other passengers are sleepy/distracted, or need the seat, or the carriage is populated entirely by horrible people who seek to take down the human race by making pregnant women stand up on tubes.

Either way, if you don't get a seat and you don't ask, the only person who suffers is you. Just standing there in a silent rage doesn't achieve anything.

I've commuted in London for 16 years. I've also been a pregnant commuter.

In my experience, for every one ignorant person who remains seated while a pregnant woman stands, there are twenty people who offer their seat without asking.

On the whole I've found London commuters to be a fairly considerate bunch. I'm always surprised when I read stories like the ones on this thread of people burying their heads in their iPhones.

If you really do genuinely need the seat, then the slight awkwardness of asking for it will far outweigh the discomfort of having to stand. I've never, ever seen someone refuse to give up their seat when asked, and if they did, I'm 99% sure someone else in the carriage who is more able to stand would offer their seat instead.

Lucky you.

I agree that young working class blokes are the most likely to stand. Middle aged women followed by middle aged city-type men are the least likely.

Two pregnancies that made me ill and commuting by train and tube. Lots of lovely people, but a fair few cunts. I've seen situations where the only person offering a seat to a pregnant woman or someone on crutches was another pregnant woman. And no one subsequently stood up.

If I'm sitting in a priority seat, I make sure I look up at every stop to see if there is anyone who looks like they need a seat - elderly, pregnant, on crutches, any obvious injury. That's part and parcel of being in the priority seat to me, it's basic courtesy.

Yes, I'd wager that TheOne is fairly easy on the eye.

Olive, I do agree with you on this "it's other women who are saying these things, not some faceless representatives of the patriarchy - just look at this thread."

However, just because in this case it's predominantly women who are commenting on other women's behaviour doesn't change the root cause of the issue. I guess another example would be that very often women are critical of other women's appearance, however sexism is the underlying reason for women being judged on our appearance in a way that men are not. The same with women being judged for returning to work or not returning work after having children - very often it's other women who are the most critical of women's decisions, but that doesn't change the fact that the underlying problem is sexist assumptions and expectations about women's role in society.

You don't need a BoB badge, you just need to sing very loudly and talk to yourself in a slightly frantic manner and seats and space will be yours.

Or pick an individual and start an awkward conversation so that they immediately think about getting off at the next stop [but don't get off and just linger at the doors]

Just saw your latest post. You need a "Pregnant AND a Junior Doctor" sign and seats shall be yours

Haha! Thanks Tread. Maybe that's the next step! I do wonder if it varies a bit depending on what lines people travel on. I have to use a lot of southeastern overground trains and people can be quite rude, and jubilee line is also one where I notice people see the badge and then quickly look away. I hear what people are saying about how it's not their responsibility to look at every stop if a pregnant woman gets on but certainly on the overground when I get on there's not many stops before getting into town, and I definitely am not imagining that some people are purposefully looking away when they don't want to offer up their seat... Whereas when I've gone on the district and circle lines I've always been offered a seat straight away so maybe it does just depend a lot on the clientele. Maybe we need to do a geographical survey on this! Agree that (from what I've seen anyway) it's often women of a certain age who are the worst offenders for not offering up seats, but I suppose they could have hidden disabilities as opposed to just being rude sods!

Not excusing the people who look away, but there are far fewer seats on Jubilee Line carriages than, say, the District Line (it has lots of those funny leany bum pad things where there would be seats on other lines).

You say you come in on a Southeastern train - does your train go through either Brixton or Elephant and Castle? Get off early at either of those stops and you'll get on the tube at the start of the line and you're practically guaranteed a seat!

Anyone else also had someone (who doesn't actually have a seat themselves) offer to get you a seat? I find that a bit more embarrassing than it would be to ask myself tbh....

I'm 20 weeks and commute on the central line every day and so far have only had to 'ask' once and that was that me and another girl went for the same empty seat and I just said 'oh sorry do you mind if I take it?' and when she saw badge she was like 'oh of course, sorry I didn't see' - which is fair enough, I said thanks and that was dandy.

Much with most elements of commuting, just take the offers or lack there of with a pinch of salt otherwise you just end up grumpy!

I was properly asleep in the pregnant and disabled seat on my way into work the other day. Having a dream and everything. A pregnant woman woke me up to ask to sit down. Of course I gave up my seat immediately but I was annoyed at having to do it.

Mainly because she WOKE ME UP to take my seat when there was a man, who was awake, in the opposite 'pregnant/disabled' seat.

But also, it got me thinking that there should be special 'parents of young children who work full time and are knackered on four hours' sleep' seats on public transport too.

She'll be me one day. Commuting and shattered by working dull time with a toddler. Then she'd think twice about waking a sleeping mum on the train!!

YY to bastard SouthEastern and the Jubilee Line. Also to the Central Line. Horrible lot.

I didn't ever ask when pg with DD1. But then was able to organise myself to travel outside real rush hour. With DD2 I did ask as a) I wasn't able to do the same and b) it was either sit down or faint as it was the summer of 2013 and was baking. I did get a lot of "who does she think she is" looks and tuts but in fairness, they were from the people who didn't stand up!

Oh and I do look up when people get onto the train to see if someone needs a seat. And offer mine to anyone if they look like they're feeling unwell if we're stopped for a long time. But I'm a fainter and know how horrific that feeling is. And in fairness to SouthEastern, the last time I did that, there was a scrum of men getting up to offer the woman their seats instead. So I got to sit where I was an watch Netflix for the rest of the delayed journey. Did miss Pilates though.....