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why is there so much pressure to breast feed??

587 replies

blondebaby111 · 30/06/2013 18:34

Just that really??!!! At my first midwife app it was thrown In my face abit when I said I wasn't sure yet if I would but I'd feel more comftable doing both. Why are you made to feel like its such a crime. I'm only 12 weeks so have alot more appointments where this will be brought up.

I have friends who have breastfed and have had miserable babies that rarely settle, they are completely flustered with it and some verge on pnt because of all the pressure. Yet the friends that haven't breastfed or done both seem to have happy babies, they are a lot more happier in themselves and generally just so relaxed. So my views are mixed on this.

I don't want to start a debate but I just wish we could all make our minds up without midwives frowning or thinking its bad if we choose not too....just saying!!!

OP posts:
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lurcherlover · 04/07/2013 17:36

Champagne, you must see that if you choose to ff you are choosing to feed a nutritionally inferior product. That's the truth which is why it's not an equal choice. It's not like deciding what pram to get (and yet worryingly, some people spend more time on that decision than on thinking about the food that will be their baby's sole source of nutrition for 6 months).

It is also true that choosing to ff offers perceived advantages to the mother, but not the baby. For the baby, if breastmilk is available (clearly if you can't bf, this isn't the case, I'm talking about people who choose not to) it is the best choice in terms of nutrition (which must surely be the main factor to consider).

Regarding feminism, manufacturers of formula have done a pretty good job over the years of making women doubt their own bodies' ability to feed their babies. The normalisation of formula in our culture has made women feel embarrassed to feed their baby naturally in public. In the face of all that, I think bfing is a feminist act, actually.

I feel very sorry for women who cannot bf. I know some personally. But it doesn't change the fact that formula is not as good as breastmilk, however much we wish it was.

Hullygully · 04/07/2013 17:44

Would you like a wall to bang your head on, lurcher?

Writerwannabe83 · 04/07/2013 17:47

I agree with everything you said Lurcherlover - the formula feeding industry is a business and all companies just want to make money - by trying to make mother's doubt their own abilities in feeding their child they're getting exactly the result they want.

When it comes to deciding to FF I think the question needs to be asked:

Is it for the baby's sake or for your sake?

rallytog1 · 04/07/2013 18:05

Wowzers DuelingFanjo, could you be any more offensive?

"Many women don't choose to go onto formula, they are booby trapped into it or they really can't medically breastfeed which is sad."

Are you honestly sad that my DD is ff because I was medically unable to feed her? Perhaps you'd rather I'd just starved her instead?

I am thrilled DD is ff as it means she is alive and healthy. At 10 weeks she's racing through milestones and is on a par development-wise with many 4 month old babies. Perhaps if she was bf she'd be superhuman - or perhaps ff along with a loving and nurturing upbringing is the very best option for her in our particular set of circumstances.

Feeling sad for people like us is just patronising.

Hullygully · 04/07/2013 18:07

I thought we were supposed to feel sad? People keep saying we are shouting on soapboxes instead of being sensitive and sad for those that can't

which is it?

skintandfedup · 04/07/2013 18:21

OP That's like asking why do women have mammary glands? It's a no trainer really.
Why should you rely on the dairy, formula & plastics industries to feed your baby when more than likely your boobies work just fine & breastfeeding is much much healthier, essentially free & on tap?

Feed your baby whichever way you choose but ffs make a fully informed decision. There's currently more pressure to ff IME. I could type out all the reasons you should bf but ultimately it's up to you to research. Pre dc I had odd, immature preconceptions about bf but that has all changed. Admittedly some preconceptions I have recently held about ff have changed too. Ie. A ff mum is not a bad mum because she ff, social conditioning is because it discourages instinctive mothering, etc...
Both my dc have been bf(still bfing my toddler) we have a happy household all round. They Both settle just fine, they are both big healthy bright boys, my figure is the best it's ever been (I'm v tall&slinky) & I have huge norks & I JUST LOVE BREASTFEEDING! IT'S AWESOME! ;) X

MumnGran · 04/07/2013 18:22

This thread is driving me crackers! am not sure whether to Grin Wine or shoot myself, but have tried walking away and its not working Sad

Trying really hard not to be argumentative, can I suggest that no-one here is "wrong". Or "right".
There is even a consensus - namely that breast milk is nutritionally superior to formula and offers some additional benefits
All those who have said repeatedly that this is the case, are correct in everyone's view ( with apology if I missed a poster who said it wasn't )

However it is not correct to then state that because there is a nutritional benefit breast is always the best thing to do.
It is best nutritionally.

It may not be best if the choice is between a relaxed mother with a fully fed contented baby or the same woman as an exhausted, pain ridden, miserable wreck who is hating every second of breast feeding because it hurts. A relaxed and happy mother is definitely best for baby. but it is best nutritionally
It may not be best if baby has a cleft palate (1 in 700 babies born in the UK source ) or one of umpteen other medical reasons pertaining to mother or baby but it is best nutritionally
It may not be best if baby is failing to thrive because feeding is not going well. but it is best nutritionally
It may not be "best" for multiple reasons....all of which are valid for the person choosing the way to feed their baby but it is best nutritionally

It is best nutritionally; but given that formula is not poison, and has long been fully accepted as a perfectly viable alternative to breast milk, that doesn't necessarily mean that nutritional value is the only factor to be considered in defining "best".

Which is why both options are perfectly valid. Neither is wrong or right or 'best' when the whole picture is considered.

Champagnebubble · 04/07/2013 18:23

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

skintandfedup · 04/07/2013 18:28
  • no brainer!
Writerwannabe83 · 04/07/2013 18:34

At work today we had the Breast Feeding Co-Ordinator in to talk to us all about new audits being done and she asked us what we all thought we could do to increase the rates of women breast feeding.

I said what I have always thought to be true - that there needs to be more antenatal education. We have to help women see the benefits before the baby is born and get their partners on board too.

So I'm interested as to ways we can do this without it being seen as 'pressure'??

We were thinking of holding sessions at our local children's centre and inviting pregnant women and their partners along for an hour's talk about the benefits of breastfeeding for both the mother and baby.

TBH though, I worry that trying to encourage anything will always be seen as pressure.

skintandfedup · 04/07/2013 18:37

MumGran. I agree with you somewhat. Breastfeeding should not hurt though! With my first dc it was excruciating. Luckily I had my mum, sister & v lovely mw on hand to guide be re latch, feeding positions & patterns, etc. I appreciate most women don't have this kind of support or breastfeeding expertise from their nearest & dearest & thus are encouraged to give formula. Formula is not the answer to everything & breastfeeding for at least a year can give your child lifelong health benefits, formula can not.

lemonmuffin · 04/07/2013 18:40

I'm new to this thread, read it all the way through, so how about this for some sort of conclusion:

Breast milk is best for a young baby, as agreed by almost every healthcare professional (as long as the mother is healthy and well and able to provide it)

Mixed feeding is fine as long as mother is healthy and well and able to provide it.

Formula feeding is fine when it is provided by a loving/responsible parent or caregiver.

Thoughts?

skintandfedup · 04/07/2013 18:41

Writer, breastfeeding should be taught in secondary. But not militantly, just encouraged with the facts laid bare.

MumnGran · 04/07/2013 18:41

I think there is much to be said for addressing the problems and issues people may encounter so that there is some preparation for bf not being plain sailing. If the issues are acknowledged not glossed over, and solutions & workarounds looked at ahead of time, then many women would handle the difficulties with more confidence.

Having watched my DD (now successfully bf'ing after horrendous problems) I can honestly say that HCP's were a very mixed bag of help. Its a fine line between encouraging, and being supportive ...and being disapproving of alternatives. And disapproval is never any help to a new mum.

scissy · 04/07/2013 18:49

tbh I've found some of these posts very offensive. I'm disabled, and was given undue pressure to ebf by mws during pregnancy as they couldn't get it into their heads that ebf was likely to make my condition worse. (consultants were fine, but didn't have the time to discuss in detail) They would give me NO advice or support for mix feeding (despite asking multiple times). once DD arrived she was high as a kite, my condition got worse and rather than given support to get bf going they just wanted me to put formula down her throat Sad (I was too out of it to argue) - needless to say bf never got off the ground and I had a eff baby very quickly. however according to some people this is a lifestyle choice! cheers. I'd like hcps to have proper conversations with women, to support them with whatever feeding method they choose to go with. to add, I don't mind them telling you about the benefits of breastfeeding, as I think it's important, and I'd love to be able to do it exclusively, unfortunately the evangelical hard sell can have the opposite effect.

Writerwannabe83 · 04/07/2013 18:51

I'm a big believer that however we target pregnant women to talk to them about breast feeding we need to be very honest with them about how difficult it may be. They need to know the potential problems they will come across and how exhausted they may be but help them understand that it is normal and that if they can find the strength to push through it then the benefits will be huge for both her and baby.

I think some women commence breast feeding without really knowing how difficult it can be and so when they face hurdles it can overwhelm them and they are the ones that we typically see switching to formula feeding.

The reality is that BF can be very hard to establish and can be very emotionally draining whereas FF is easy.
And unfortunately that is why some women take the FF option.

Thinkingof4 · 04/07/2013 19:00

I have read most of this thread but not all of it so apologies for that. Re education it is clear this is a huge problem as there are so many mis-truths and misunderstandings expressed on this thread. Eg my ff child has never been unwell but my bf one has therefore maybe bf not beneficial etc.
I think we need to be educating school age children about breastfeeding in order to re-establish it as a cultural norm. At the moment it is not, and that applies especially to 'extended' feeding which some people would say was more than 6 months, when WHO recommends every child be bf until they are 2.
I just don't get why some people won't even try to bf their babies. I do understand why so many try and then give up (lack of support from family, HCPs and society generally) and that is a real shame for everyone involved. But I admire the fact that at least they tried- why wouldn't you. Now of course I know there are reasons why some women cannot breastfeed (surgery, medication, v early baby) and there can be no criticism of that, they can't feed and that is just a fact.
But that is a small number of women. A lot of women could feed but choose not to.

To me as mentioned above breastfeeding is a feminist issue to an extent as it means we are taking back control of our breasts (so to speak) instead of them being merely a symbol of sexuality to entertain men. Reclaim our boobs and feed our babies!!

It's not always easy but what things in life are? Surely the enjoyment you get from something is even greater when you've had to put put yourself second and work hard to get there? The apparently easier option of ff can never touch the emotional benefits you get from feeding that tiny wee scrap of a baby to a strapping 6/12/whatever monther

I'm sure I'll get flamed for this, I just wish more mums would try it. They might even find they really enjoy bf their baby.

skintandfedup · 04/07/2013 19:01

lemon for the most part the parents I know of who ff from the outset wean v early, give rice mixed with formula in bottle, give cow's milk v early, smoke over their babies, feed baby handsfree all the time so no eye contact & closeness/cuddles, etc. Perhaps my observations are limited...

Anyway, I know loads of mums that started out ebf & went on to mix feed responsibly & wean responsibly & even a couple ff mums.

On the whole humans are reckless beings who harm each other & the planet therefore I'd have to say breastfeeding mothers are generally more responsible

Most babies prefer boob surely anyway. (I have 2 dc that absolutely refused the bottle at 6 months & I believe if all babies were bf that long they'd also prefer boob).

Writerwannabe83 · 04/07/2013 19:06

Brilliant post Thinkingof4.

I'm in 100% agreement Smile

Thinkingof4 · 04/07/2013 19:08

Oh forgot to say has anyone mentioned the fact that breasfed babies are less likely to be overweight and less likely to become obese in later life. Given the obesity epidemic and subsequent associated health problem this is a huge benefit, possibly greater than any of the other health benefits. Type 2 Diabetes has been in the news recently as it's now a bigger killer in Scotland than heart disease. The government needs to spend money now on educating children and society that breasfeeding is normal, free and has huge health benefits.

MumnGran · 04/07/2013 19:12

writer .... I would agree absolutely, but think that those emotionally draining effects cannot be minimised in their 24/7 impact. Particularly where professional support is iffy ( I know a mother with lactational thrush ignored by visiting HCP, eventually doctor diagnosed and prescribed but only for mum - resulting in a continuing cycle) or milk supplies which take overly long to reach levels sufficient for demand.

I rarely think things were better "in the old days", but having seen maternity care recently, to be honest I was horrified at how little support was on offer compared to levels thirty years ago and just wished that new mums were still looked after for several days in hospital ....where they had professional support on hand to assist with early problems.

Writerwannabe83 · 04/07/2013 19:22

MumnGran,

In the last job I had (working on an acute ward for babies aged 0-2) we would get new born babies coming in to us when they were only 10 hours old - the story was always the same, the mother had had the baby and been sent home with only one breast feed being witnessed (regardless of how well it went or how long it lasted) for the mom to then get home, not be able to get the baby to attach. It was shocking. The poor mothers were absolutely shattered, upset, felt like a failure etc all because they hadn't received the support they should have had in the Midwifery Department and Labour Ward.

We are thinking of trialling an approach at the moment where the hospitals let us know when a woman is discharged home who is breastfeeding and then I will make contact after about 2 days to see how things are going and either offer support/advice over the phone or visit them at home if requested.

Something has to be done to help breast feeding mothers who are struggling- choosing to breast feed is a selfless act and they need all the support they can get to encourage them to continue and make them see what a wonderful thing they are doing for their baby. When women reach that breaking point they need lots of TLC and reassurance that things will get better and unless they have that support in place then it is very likely they will switch to FF.

Phineyj · 04/07/2013 19:25

Writerwannabe83 if you held an info session for pregnant women & partners about breastfeeding then by definition only ones who had an interest would come along, so I don't think anyone could see that as undue pressure.

My experience: I tried to breastfeed but found it too painful to continue. I am sure some would say I should have tried harder. I would have benefitted from honesty about how painful and difficult it can be, and knowing that problems can be of some duration, however, I think that by explaining that you'd likely put some women off, while encouraging others to persevere, so it probably wouldn't help with numbers overall.

I did look at the research on bf before I had my baby. However, I think it is counterproductive to overstate the benefits of bf in an attempt to get more women to do it, because in a western country those benefits are somewhat marginal; once women realise that, they may discount much of what the more dogmatic advocates of bf have to say.

I think the 'it's free!' argument will commend itself to some people (personally, I didn't realise how many bits and bobs you need to ff until I started doing it) and 'it's convenient' to others, although it's not actually that convenient, given that it's still not totally acceptable to feed in public in the UK.

"It's natural" doesn't really work for me as an argument. Lots of really very unpleasant things (labour pain, for example) are "natural".

But most of all I would like women to be treated as competent adults who can make up their own minds, given the evidence available and their own circumstances and for there to be less value put on suffering pain. Discussion of bf seems to take a distinctly masochistic turn at times!

Phineyj · 04/07/2013 19:28

Writer you sound very helpful, by the way.

MumnGran · 04/07/2013 19:30

writer it is so good to hear a professional express those views. And so very sad to know how many new mums are struggling without backup when they most need it. Not happy to out myself, but happy to PM with a story from this year which horrified me past all belief.... if it will help you at all in formulating a proposal.

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