new bottle feeding guidelines

[kri5ty]

Hey girls :-)

Ok I don't want to start a debate on different ways (right or wrong) on making up bottles. I plan to stick to the new guidelines and make them fresh ( following the government guidelines), but I just wanted to know if this would still be ok-

Allow some boiled water to cool, and keep this in a flask once cooled.

then when its time to make up a feed, boil the kettle, and pour a little less water than needed into the bottle

Then pour a little of the cooled boiled water into the bottle (to make it up to the correct level, and making sure its above 70 degrees)

Add powder, shake and cool in water to drinking temp

Would this work? I'm thinking so, as the water will still be above 70 degrees, and it will be quicker than waiting 30 minutes for the kettle to cool each time?

Thank you

There are guidelines on these things? Crikey. I had DD1 in Africa and we often went off into the bush, I'd have to bring the water with me for the weekend. She is a perfectly healthy 4 year old. I'm not planning on getting that technical for the next one. I think they can turn you mad and paranoid if you're not careful and stops you using your common sense and maternal instinct.

Sorry if that sounded a bit rude, what I was trying to say was it sounds fine and I shouldn't overly worry about it too much (unless of course you have a sickly child/allergies etc. and have been told to be particularly careful). For the record I bottle fed from 4 months so DD was quite little...

That would work. Equally keeping water in a vacuum flask above 70 would work too, thereby eliminating the need for boiling the kettle each time.

I believe the advice about adding the powder at 70 degrees is to do with killing bacteria that can exist in the milk powder. Here

And personally I would worry. The likelihood of catching a nasty bug is small but it can be life threatening/limiting. There are many things to not be paranoid over but bottle making isn't one of them

That's what I'd do.

But then, the min reason I breastfed my older DD until 15 months was becauae I couldn't fathom all the rules! Little DD might have to switch though, as going back to work seems quite likely in January. I hope you get a definitive answer, then I'll know!

Yes Fraktious, I wasn't saying throw the rule book out at all (bottle feeding was a while ago) but also that it can send you into an utter blind panic and that generally things will be OK. I certainly boiled all the water and was as careful as I could be but sometimes you have to do the best that you can given the circumstances.

I don't think it is the water that is the problem. It's the powder. The powder is the thing that requires the heat.

I essentially did the same - I had two kettles. I boiled a fresh kettle every morning (only once!) and made the bottles from that (DH learnt after my tantrum to never go near that said kettle again!!) and then would top the bottle up with boiled water from the other kettle to bring them to temperature when I needed them.

Common sense yes, but common sense tells you that the powder itself is not sterile and needs to be decontaminated. Mamy people, however, seem to lack that common sense. That's why those guidelines exist.

One does the best one can under the circumstances but in most places it's not the water which needs to be boiled to cleanse it (although the wilds of Africa are a special case ).

Thanks girls

And fraktious my next plan is to see how long our flask will keep the water above 70 degrees :)

Very glad I saw this, think in the 4 yrs I have forgotten lots, best I revise and up my game (again)!

Kri5ty can you come back with the results of flask water.

Senorita I was about to launch but I see you realise you need to brush up :)

It is understandable in some ways that people don't realise it is the powder, rather than the water that is the problem. You would think, that manufacturers wouldn't be allowed to sell something that was potentially harmful to be given to babies...

I never knew that it was the powder!!!! I used to keep bottles of pre-boiled water in the fridge and add the powder as and when needed. Luckily dd is 7 now and survived without incident......

So, I'm also going to bottle feed DC2 for the first time when she finally arrives, DS was breastfed.

Say if I needed to go out, can I not put some boiled water into a bottle, put the powder in one of those containers (like the ones that come with the tommww tipee bottles) and then tip it in and make it when I'm out?

Okay, I need to get my head around this too![hconfused]

DS is now 7 and was bottlefed. I used to sterilise the bottles every night, make up fresh bottles, let them cool, keep them in the fridge, and then heat them to drinking temp in some hot water. Can I not do this now? (DC2 due in Feb) Do I have to sterilise a bottle and make it up fresh for EVERY feed?? If so, that will be a lot of faffing about every day and in the middle of the night. Can't understand how it could have been fine 7 years ago but not now.

I've just had a look at the guidelines from the FSA and it says

'If you are out and cannot boil water how do you make up a feed?
Mothers should be advised to fill a vacuum flask with boiling water. If the flask is full
and sealed the water will stay above 70° C for several hours. This flask can be
safely transported and used to make up a feed when necessary.'

It also says that feeds should be disgarded within 2 hrs however can be kept up to 24 hours they just say 24 hours is not ideal the longer you keep it the more the bacteria will multiply

It also says under storing formula for later use eg going to nursery you can make up the feed and store it in a fridge under 5d

So if you keep it under 5 or over 65 you should be fine

tbh i'm sure if it was that dangerous to not make up feeds in advance they would say not to do it at all so i wouldn't worry to much about making them in advance.

Basically powder must hit hot water.

In general a baby bottle won't keep water hot enough but a vacuum flask will for about 6 hours (depends on the flask).

If you make in advance you do hot water, plus powder, rapid cool to fridge temp and then reheat rather than rapid cool to drinking temp.

It's best to make as needed as bacteria will still multiply in the fridge, but by using hot water rather than 1000 multiplying (giving, say 2000 after an hour) you get 10 multiplying and giving you 20.

Its a bloody nightmare, ive had a dd in each of the bottle feeding guidelines. There all fine but i seen a real difference with dd's 2 and 3 not making up milk feeds and storing. I would store water in fridge or flask but not make milk up. Its the milk thats not sterile so the water has to hit the milk at 70 deg+ to kill bacteria. You can reheat the water to 70 add milk cool again..

BamBam21 ... Blame the breastfeeders... Nice!

OP i think you should be ok as long as the feed is immediately consumed. The stomach will destroy small amounts of bacteria. If the feed has been stored the bacteria will have multiplied enough to make a baby I'll (if water was not sufficiently hot enough to kill bacteria when feed was made)

Not blaming breastfeeders fanta. Blaming the government and NHS etc, who go out of their way to make bottlefeeders feel they are doing the wrong thing. I realise that I may be in the minority for thinking this. When I had DS, I felt bullied into breastfeeding, I tried it, hated it, and I felt immense relief when I finally called for a bottle, but got huge cat's bum faces from the midwives for it. I just think that they tap into the paranoia of new mums. So, FWIW, despite the fact that DS is now a strapping boy and was never sick in his bottlefeeding years, I will try to follow these new guidelines, because I will once again be a paranoid new mum.[hsmile]

But why reheat the water?

It's not the BFers, it's actually the formula companies making it complicated. It would be do much simpler if they wrote 'non-sterile product, treat as raw chicken ' and included simple guidance.

Really the zillion step process can be reduced to 2 or 3.

Mix powder with hot water. Cool rapidly.
A) drink
B) put in fridge and reheat within x hours

I personally wouldn't rely on the stomach acid to kill the bacteria in case you happened to be very unlucky and get a tin contaminated with salmonella or e./c. Sakazakii. Even then an older baby might fight off a gastro bug but a tiny newborn probably wouldn't.

The risk also increases over time as you remove and replace the lid of the tin.

You're supposed to use the made up bottle within 2 hours. When DD was very small I was very strict about that, which did mean lots of wasted milk but that's not the end of the world.

I know this isn't recommended, but I don't see it's any different to have boiled water that's been cooled for a lot longer. Then to heat it in the microwave before mixing with powder. If you're mixing enough to get the powder dissolved then you'll definitely be removing hot spots too. That's also a lot easier when you're out and about as a cafe will usually be happy to microwave it for you, or many have a bottle warmer too, but it just takes ages.

Next time, I'm definitely going to try a lot harder with the bf. It's so much easier. My sister gets a lot of oohs and ahhs about still bfing at 13 months but she admits to her it's the easy option, like co sleeping!

If out, use pre made formula cartons and heat using cup of hot water at friends house/coffee shop whatever! Sterile and faff free (although realise this is more expensive...but in the grand scheme of things!?!?). Not however a suitable option for ds2 who was on prescription formula but hey-ho!