December 2006 - The sun has got his hat on, hip hip hip hooray, tshghho now let's keep these bugs at bay

[LenniEd]

I got all brave and made us a new bug free thread...

Oh Jabber. Rotten news So sorry.

Sorry to hear that Jabber.

Yes and no Indith there are good things and bad things to be said for it. I think the good ones outweigh the bad, but I'll not pretend it's been easy. I often get asked by other Mums about doing a Masters and generally say it has been inspirational and really has given me lots of direction in my child rearing years, but has also been bloody hard work, has deprived me of plenty of sleep and has caused the occasional argument around deadline time. You know anyway what it is like to parent and study simultaneously so aren't walking into it blind, but often many Mums think back to their lazy student days and don't realise that working on essays until 3am is not all that easy when your children wake at 5. That said, if I had the decision again from the start I'd go for it. You'll be fine, you've managed with DS around, and although it's harder to study with two, it isn't all that much harder.

So sorry Jabber .

LenniEd, are you tap, tap, tapping away as we speak?

How's that for a cross post. The answer is, obviously, 'yes' .

Yep, but on here Oli back to it...

And another...

Thanks all. It's one of those situations where you really just don't know quite what to say iykwim.

LenniEd, I finished a master's just before ds1 was born. Hats off to anyone doing one with children!

Indith, I am a veteran of two bad sleepers. It's horrible, no two ways about it. At some point they do sleep but you think you're not going to live that long when you are in the midst of it.

Have had a few, "just f*ing sleep!" moments myself

Oh yes, 'Go to f'king sleep' features quite frequently in our house too. Never worked though .

Awww, jabber, that's awful for them. Tis so hard to know what to say. A friend I visited a few weeks ago had just had 3rd m/c and I feel so unable to help. She's got two dd's but desperate for another baby and now 42 so giving up hope
Lennied, Indith, ANY studying with dc's around is a herculean task in my book. Can cope with twins, 4 under 5, but not that!
It does make you feel a bit better when you tell them to f'ing sleep I feel, even if it makes no diff. Sleep clinic lady full of good ideas yesterday, trouble is after following them dd had worst night in weeks arrggggh. Shall persevere...
Friend has 6mo ds with troublesome eczema, she's just using steroids and oilatum I think but I think there's more she could try and she's nervous about weaning too (I'm pushing BLW at her and even loaned the book!). He's waking up at night with it, she thinks, itching. I suggested oatmeal baths but really know nothing. Does clothing help here, like organic cotton? Oli? Anyone else?

Shall let you know more about the snip in due course, Lennied . He doesn't get the all clear for about 4 months so I suppose I'd better (sigh) go and get the pill rats. If he's up for sexual marathons, he'll be doing them with someone else!

AQ, itching at night definitely eczema related, ime. Also ime, gp's tend to be a bit rubbish at finding creams that work. They start with the cheapest and work their way up but I never found the prescribed stuff to be very effective. I can tell you what works to some degree for ds2 though.

Bath in plain water but cover them from head to toe in emollient before they get in the bath, then afterwards, pat dry v gently and cover again with thick layer of emollient. All the bath additives inflamed ds2's eczema, plain water is much better.

Hairwash right at the end, just before they get out and rinse whole child with shower head/cup of clean water to get rid of shampoo residue. I only use Simple Baby shampoo because it's unscented.

Bath once or twice a week maximum.

Moisturise dry bits at least twice day. Use steroid creams while it's red and inflamed, if you apply it really thinly it won't be harmful. Best emollient I've found is Pure Potions. It's not on the NHS and it's relatively expensive but it does last a long time (3-4 months). There's something chemically in all the GP creams that ds2 reacts to, the PP is just olive oil, hemp oil and a few other bits.

Grobags are good but keep them in the lowest tog possible and with the fewest layers under as possible. Ds2 always itches more when he's hot in bed.

We found switching to liquid rather than washing powder (Ecover, but he's also ok with Daz) made a bit of difference. Definitely use non bio though.

That's what helps ds2. I've stepped up the moisturising over the last couple of days and his skin's much better again. I don't think there's anything that will completely get rid of it but all those things certainly ease it.

Jabber, how did your mephew's wife get on today? Any news?

My friend blasted her DS's chronic eczema (kept him awake every night until he was 3) with really strong steroid stuff (having tried everything else) and he now appears to be completely free of it age 4. Doing it intensely for a short period doesn't do as much skin damage.

Thanks, both of you, gosh that was a detailed reply Oli! I'll pass it on to her, think she's getting a bit frustrated & his face is all covered in it poor lamb. Her older ds also has it I think. I'm sure she's already used steroids, but not sure how strong?

I have fixtures and fittnigs lists and draft contract. I'm turning into a grown up.

I had to slap ds this afternoon. He was having a really bad terror He is down to roughly one a week, had a couple of mini ones last night, was really not expecting one during his nap

We are doing pupd with dd this weekend. Dh doing tonight and tomorrow and then I'm taking over for the week. Dd shall sleep more than 45mins at a time. Thankfully the lost mouse has been replaced by a green lion so hopefully having a doudou will mean dummy chucking won't be too bad.

Jabber I'm sorry. Been there too many times, and wish it never happened to anyone. How are they doing?

Glad lost Doudou is replaced, Indith, and good luck on the PUPD - worked with dd1, failed miserably with dd2 but think thats my fault for worrying about her breathing too much! Hope you, and everyone else with sleep difficulties atm, gets some kip - with or without colourful language

Sorry to be a bit awol, got overwhelmed this week with house sale stress and dh being unwell - hopefully things looking up a bit on both fronts.

dd1 is v v tired, and occasionally horrible, anyone else's older LOs getting end of term fatigue, or should I be concerned?

dd2 had her 2.5 yr HV check-up, which told me what I know: bit slow on the gross motor stuff (ie potties, stairs, scooters) but dead flash at language (ie gobby). 2 yr olds are such comics, I do love them (during the day).

hi all.

eli - dd1 is tired. not too bad. some of her friends are in quite a state though tbh.

dd2 is similar to your dd2 (parallel lives again?). She is ace at speaking but sooooo clumsy and falls over a lot. She cant get the hang of the loo either. She's being very 'two' at the moment.

Hope sleep gets better for dd, and terrors for ds, indith - not a great combo is it? But yay for house
ds1 has been largely horrible for a couple of weeks and shattered. He slept in until 8 this morning because ds2 was at gm and seems brighter. I'm exhausted with school, not surprised the kids are!
haven't had check for ds2 yet, but coming to the conclusion that he has an all round delay really. His gross motor skills are improving but still not great, language quite behind etc. Will see what dad says when he comes in august. He's lovely and happy and smiley and may catch up but we'll see.

Hi everyone, I've just gotten back from a workshop and so behind on the thread yet again

Nephew and wife are still traumatized over the m/c I feel at a loss as to what to say. My other nephew and his wife went through the same thing (missed m/c) at almost exactly same number of weeks last year so I think they have been talking to each other and that has been supportive.

Ds1 has been out of school for 3 weeks and just finished first week of science camp. He was very ready to start doing something. Had gotten quite bored esp as he was homebound with ds2 being so ill the week before.

Indith, good luck with the sleeping and house buying. Both can be quite stressful.

AQ, any sensory issues with ds2?

Da lady on da CD said trump

2 year olds are very cute when not being horrible

Ds keeps getting constipated. He didn't go for 3 days when at my parents and hasn't got back to being regular since then, been 3 days again now I think. I'm giving him lactulose and trying to get some orange juice down him as that usually moves him along. Any other tips?

The sleep was horrible and ended in me snatching dd off dh after 2.5 hours of pupd when she was just screaming her head off. There was lots of shouting, crying and screaming and not all of it was dd I'm at a complete and utter loss and have no idea why she wakes so much. She goes off to sleep so happily with no fuss with a dummy but then she wakes every half hour to an hour and I don't know if she wakes because she loses the dummy or if it is something else and then I don't know if she is crying for the dummy or a feed. Argh! I have passed breaking point and just want someone to take control and sort it out for me. Oli how on earth are you still alive let alone coherent and making beautiful cakes etc? My house is a shit tip, I am so behind on guiding stuff it is really, really bad and my spare room and dining room are still full of unsorted junk and paper work and I really need to sort them out because we should be exchanging very soon and then the vendors (and us really) want to complete in August which meand that soon we will have to give notice to our landlady so there will be people viewing this house and frankly it looks like a hovel.

awww, indith, it does only take a couple of nights of decent sleep to feel like you can tackle it again. That kind of thing really gets on my wick too (living in hovel etc) but I always forget how good I feel after having sleep. Any chance of a daytime nap, are dd & ds sleeping together?
Sleep clinic here take babies at 6 months,I don't think dd is yet is she? Maybe if sleep expert at local centre you could get some phone advice or just speak to someone at toddler group etc. My sleep guru is a community nurse, not HV. She's v.v.sensible, looks at the whole picture and never pushed me to do CC. Ask around to see if anyone in your neck of the woods? In the meantime, it's easy to go hard on yourself and expect the same regardless of lack of sleep - I do it all the time. But try to take it easy. Surely DH can take them both out tomorrow and you could nap?
Re: constipation, lactulose will make it softer if it's hard, won't push it out iyswim. I can only offer advice for chronic constipation which is LOTS of fluids (although milk can be constipating, well all dairy), big meals rather than lots of small snacks and plenty of fibre - prunes (prune juice a lot easier on ds's tummy too than orange which is v.acidic), other dried fruit etc.
jabber, I feel everytime about m/c's have never had one luckily but think the same as Eli which is that no-one ever should. Not sure what you mean by sensory issues? Just read him a few books if you can call it reading. God he's frustrating. I get none of the joy with it I had with ds1 and I don't buy him books either. He is delightful in every other way of course, the lack of language just really hinders things now.
dd is my most advanced baby, it's so weird as she's still quite tiny and cruising round the furniture. God help me if she starts walking soon.

Jabber - is good that they have someone to talk to. I had a m/c at 6wks pg the month before I fell pregnant with DD. I am certain that had a big part in the AN depression I had during DD's pregnancy.

Indith - Does DD feed in a predictable pattern? I've stopped offering DS a feed if it is less than 2 hours since his last one (day and night) as I was getting in a bit of a muddle over what he wanted and he was crying from overtiredness rather than hunger but I was offering him a feed and then he ended up feeding ridiculously often. Once I could work out when he was hungry it made recognising the sleep cues easier and now he is getting more daytime sleep he seems to be better at night again - after 4 weeks of waking every 1-1.5hours I really think you should forget the housework as no idea how you are managing on 45mins for months.

In case of any use a few things that helped with the terrible sleeper that was DD - swaddling, co-sleeping (she didn't sleep any longer though, but helped us get more sleep), music played at bedtime and when she woke in the night, strict daytime naps (I found it a lot easier to do sleep training at naptime when not as emotional - we never did CC but did PUPD and various other things)... no magic answers but AQ's suggestion of sleep clinic worth following up. We went on AQ's recommendation with DD and was really helpful.

Will DD take a bottle of EBM? Could you leave her overnight and leave bottles for her? When my DD was about 6/7mo we left her with GPs for one night, it did us so much good to have that one uninterrupted night. And she was no worse for it.

Wow to your DD AQ - sounds like you are going to have an early walker on your hands. They are fun you know - no sense though!

DD is potty trained it seems - no accidents since last Sunday and dry at night too (although I daren't leave her without a pull up on). We've moved DS into his own room night before last but I've brought him back in with us when he wakes at about midnight. I'm going to put him back in his cot tonight though as want to see what happens. Think we are going to start BLW next week (24wks) as DD keeps weaning him on her food when I'm not looking - tonight she was feeding him her yoghurt and pouring juice in the vague direction of his mouth whilst I had my back turned to clear the plates.

Indith have my deepest sympathies and I have absolutely no useful tips as both boys didn't really sleep well until around two years old On the plus side they are both sleeping pretty well now.

AQ, sorry for the cryptic question. So other than the language do you notice him being sensitive to certain stimuli? Does he have any little habits that seem unusual to you but soothing to him?

Part of the prob with sleep problems and babies/toddlers is that you can't see what's happening clearly enough because you're so bloody tired (IMO). I need someone external to look at everything and point out the bleeding obvious. But that's me. My head doesn't work too well when I'm tired. I can't even converse with people properly.
anyway, glad you did get some help with dd lennied as I seem to remember she wasn't a great sleeper when you first came on here. I have 2 friends seeing the sleep clinic now here, I recommend it to everyone! Enjoy the BLW with ds, I'm finding the mess hard (god, they're so sodding messy still, ought they to be at nearly 9 months?) but otherwise 100% enjoying it but of course you and indith have done it before. All new to me. I'm still getting the 'won't they take a spoon' from mum and others but trying to ignore the hints about shoving them full of puree so they'll sleep. They're so independent compared to ds2. All 3 on the picnic mat inside (as it was raining cats & dogs all afternoon) today having some breadsticks now that ds3 can sit up as well, very sweet. Am trying really hard now NOT to compare the dt's, I'm just hoping like mad that neither of them have speech issues as well.
Is anyone not potty training as I have vaguely suggested sitting on the potty which is always around but that's as far as I have got. Mum said last week I was leaving it too late. Honestly. He knows what's going on, tells me immediately but doesn't seem to want to lose the nappy.
Anyway, jabber - not that I have noticed. He's v.pedantic and obsessive about order & mess but aren't they all at this age? He's a happy sociable little person, haven't noticed anything odd about him. I am just starting to feel that we could have done more, it's because I was pg and ds1 is so dominant, it's like I hardly noticed ds2 until he started having tantrums and demanding attention. DP dismissed my worries, but I'm still going to worry. I started taking him to a pre-gymnastics class a few months ago (whilst nanny has the dt's) and it's really helped his gross motor skills & confidence. Wondering what I could do that might help with the language?

AQ - We bought a couple of the Usborne Look and Say books for DD just before Christmas as she wasn't talking at all really then. She spent ages just naming objects in the pictures and that seemed to spur her on to talk - you could do it will any books you have, it was just that those ones seemed to hold her interest. Have you thought about baby signing? You could take the DTs and DS1 (if you could cope with that??) so he wouldn't feel out of place with the younger children, he'd just be taking his little brother and sister.

I don't think anything until after 3yo is considered starting late is it? HV told me to try between 2.5 and 3. DD didn't want to lose the nappies either. I just decided to go cold turkey on them when DS had CP since I was stuck in the house anyway. She did absolutely everything in her pants for the first 3 days, then next 3 days was 50/50 pants/toilet (was telling me everytime but sometimes not holding on long enough) and then by day 7 something clicked and now she tells me a good 5-10 mins before she absolutely has to go, sometimes longer. No accidents at all for a week now, am quite proud of her!

thanks, lennied (although... aren't you meant to be writing an essay?? stern look...)
I think I've got a couple of those from the library, he just won't say anything until i've said it or he'll maybe say something unintelligible that's nothing like the object. He does ask me what things are. I guess I'll just keep talking and talking and talking and read him as many books as he wants. Perhaps take him & dt's to library on weds instead of music class.
I looked into signing but they said not until one or both twins sitting up and it will be finished in 4 weeks for the summer. I wanted to take ds as a baby but couldn't work around ds1. The class for the dt's is when ds is at nursery and I don't think I could manage with all 3 really. No reason why I couldn't learn to do it via a book or dvd though. Shall ask my twin friend who is teacher of the deaf tomorrow I think (thanks!).
I've got too much on to panic much about potty training, so I'll wait until August and see what's happening then. How did you feel about potty training ds2, Jabber, after so many issues with ds1?

I feel a bit (well utterly) crap that I can't seem to manage with all 4 of my lovely dc's at once. I've never taken them further than top of the street, never on an outing. I have panic attacks about dealing with them like that. I can't sling the babies so I'd just be stuck if ds2 decided to have a massive tantrum. Nanny leaving in october, I've got to get over this inability to cope with all 4. Everyone around me protects from it too. Yet i know so many mums who do the school run with 4 lo's or even 5.