September 08 - Just ladies with babies

[pacita]

I thought I'd start a new thread before we run out of space...

Hopefully, i really understand your need for routine. i have walked in those shoes before. I also had a physically and emotionally traumatic labour, birth and post natal period. I have no family to help and at 7 wks found out that my aunt in the UK who lived in London and was like a mum to me was dying from cancer. When attemting to use a routine combined with breastfeeding didn?t work out I had to weigh up how important breastfeeding was for me vs keeping to a routine. I even experimented with deliberately dropping feeds but returned to exclusive feeding. I found out that bfing was more important and I stepped out into the scary unknown of feeding my dd on demand.

I should mention that a bunch of things had me in some sort of PND and her crying had me in a dark place where I could envision and understand how some mothers end up harming themselves or their baby and felt I had to step away from there.

it turned out that what works is to fit my baby?s sleep and feeds around my day. I would feed her as long as possible in the morning and then start my breakfast. If I was lucky, I could finish making my bkfast before her grizzling became crying. I have a proper hot bkfast everyday. I would then eat my bkfast with one hand and her perched on my knee and supported with my other.

Likewise, I would do what I normally have to do in my day and treated her need to feed whenever she needed it as an opportunity to have loads of breaks in my normal daily going abouts.

It is my humble belief that we don?t need to structure entertainment for babies. They are learning all the time anyway in ways which we don?t structure. Eg. Repeatedly dropping a spoon from a highchair by a 10 mo old is learning the effects of gravity by repetition. Likewise, they learn about permanency of an object out of sight by a certain age whether or not we structure an activity for that. So for me, taking your precious time to ?entertain? a baby is pointless when will be happily entertained watching and listening to you eating a packet of crisps and learning about the impermanence of food. tour time would be better spent loading the washing machine for example.

I have to go but could go on about the difficulties of bfing and routines. But mumsnet has a lot on that already if you search or could start a thread to enquire about the experiences of others from lots of angles.

where did I find this one? ah, I have my ways.

I am reducing my stash but I haven't had a birthday present yet, plus, dh had a few naughty gadgety buys before he went to abu dhabi and he serviced his Rolex (no problem there) but I found out much later that he changed the wristband and the wristband alone cost more than 2 of those babies.

So I am evening things out.

These carriers are super comfy for me and IMHO are worth the money. This one with silk is my dressy up Mei Tai.

Have you seen the babyhawk I am selling? It is free from flowers and frills.

it will be on its way on loan to Debs75 tomorrow.

hI ladies with babies, have been busy getting things sorted at home, an dhav now got a routine that works for everyone, DS2's reflex is now being properly monitired and may result in a referral to hospital if weight continues to drop but fab GP has given hs given us some new techniques to try that seem to be working so fingers crossed.
How i s everyone

hopefully hang in there as I remember form dd it gets easier to establish a routine from about 12 weeks

I got my new sling in the mail today. It's just lovely but I can tell it will take me some practise to get back into putting a non stretchy wrap on.

I've been wondering if eandz is ok too.

I'm with you foxy on the entertaining babies thing. I tried to entertain ds1 when he was tiny but also spent a lot of time just rabbiting away to him about nothing much while I was doing things like housework. But that was more to keep me sane as I went a bit mad if I didn't talk to anyone all day. (maybe explains why he doesn't ever stop talking now). Now with ds2 I don't spend as much time consciously entertaining him as if ds1 is around I'll be playing with him and ds2 will happily sit for ages in bouncy chair watching what's going on and probably learning loads while quietly observing us. And if ds1 is asleep then to be honest I just want a bit of peace so don't sit there chatting to/singing to/playing with ds2 the whole time. For example at the moment he's upright looking over my shoulder and just happily staring at the room.

starlight your 'routine' during the day is very like mine which is amusing as you're not a routine person and I am! I'm very lucky though in that my dh gets home about 5.15 every day.

Thank you for all your support everyone! Sorry for being so drippy, I know this phase will pass eventually.

Well T got absolutely hysterical after his feed (at around 11am). I wasn't even dressed, so he had to scream while I threw on some clothes (weeping at leaving him to cry, general hysterics!) and shoved him in the pram and went out. He was unconscious by the time we got to the top of the road, slept until 1pm when we got to the NCT group. He then had a quick feed, stayed awake for 10 minutes and zonked out again. He stayed asleep the entire time I was there, the whole way home, and is now feeding again, right on schedule! he's a million times happier, think he really needed a good sleep - he was so heavily asleep I could have dangled him by the ankles I think! Going to give him a bit of awake time then go back out in the pram for his next nap to make sure he takes it as well.
I'm so relieved, as not only is he much happier, but he even woke himself for feeds at the right time, so with a bit of luck won't feed all night as a payoff.

NCT mother and baby group was really nice too - I was so close to not going, but I'm really relieved I did. Was quite funny, every single pram (including mine) was a bugaboo! I BF'd there and the nice NCT lady running it brought me tea while I fed, and I met lots of other nice sleep deprived ladies.

as well as eandz, haven't seen lollipopmother for a while....

I had a nice group meet with the babymammas am glad I went!

But carreion and all - given that she does shout when we put dd down, how should we manage the ragey shouting? She really shouts like she means it!! Is it too late to sleep train do you think? Are all her sleep associations so poor now?!?!

ooh, have just realised i haven't changed t's nappy since 10am! he is supremely unconcerned. i am

you were all right, mother/baby group is definitely good - can see it becoming a lifeline.

Where oh where is my Kari-Me? It was dispatched on Monday! BOO HOO!

Hopefully - well done on getting out to NCT. I truly believe that getting out and about, even tho the baby might just lie in the buggy, knackers them out and entertains them. So even if they sleep in the buggy they'll sleep when they get home too. There is a reason why babies were taken out by 'nanny' every day come rain or shine.

One quick question - when you feed T at night (after which he will not settle), do you just haul him into bed with you, or do you get out and sit in a chair/go into another room. F's refusal to settle has just ended - I stopped taking him into the living room and just feed him in bed. I think he was waking up too much.

LOL at 'impermanence of food' foxy

Despite feeling that foxy and I use different ways, I totally agree with her thoughts on 'entertaining' small babies. When C was 4 weeks old I was worried that she was not having structured playtime. I quickly realised just being with her, making eye contact, talking etc was more than enough.
When I go back to work next yr, she's gonna have loads of stimulation everyday and by people who do not feel like falling asleep half the time!

hopefully glad you got out to the NCT. I meant to post that you don't have to take T for a pram walk to nowhere - simply getting out and doing things (shops, NCT, mum & babies etc) will keep him stimulated and help him sleep. Do not worry if he does not get his sleep in his cot at home, it will help him to tell daytime naps from nighttime sleep (IMO). C and I have a nice routine of baby sensory every wednesday and then we go to Chester zoo for lunch (i'm a member) and have a wander round. We saw red pandas today!
I thought I would be a very routine person but I am being very baby-led during the day as C sleeps in her cot during the night no problem. I thought I'd want her in her own room ASAP but I want her to stay with us.

foxy and starlight your daily structure is helpful to read. I have a question though. You both refer to putting LOs down in bouncy chair or in cot etc etc during the day and cooking/having dinner and feeding on demand. The feeding I get but please tell me how you manage to cook anything! DP is away for 2 nights now, so i have 2 ready meals to bung in the oven. I don't want to but C will not settle for very long at home. If we are out, she seems fine but when at home I have very limited times to cook myself food (or do anything else really) and actually eat it as she will cry. I have eaten dinner with her in the carrier but cannot imagine cooking something while carrying her in the wilkienet.

I guess I could eat dinner at 4.30pm while she sleeps but not very appealing! Any suggestions on how to make daily tasks like cooking and cleanig more realistic?

charity the night feeds are sometimes in bed and sometimes down in the living room. It seems to make little difference, although I prefer the living room because at least I can watch TV on silent. He seems supremely unconcerned - wherever we are it's party time!

our ancestors moved from hillock to hillock in the daytime while 'gathering.' if a baby got put down and fell asleep on its own, it may wake up to find that the tribe had gone to the next hillock.

i suppose at night early man coslept for warmth and security. without either of these stone age baby may not survive the night.

i just cook simple things with dd on my chest. pasta for example. I can easily make bolognese sauce too.

because she is now older and will go longer after a good feed, and I am in tune with that too, then I can put her down long enough to make more complicated things. eg, couple weeks ago I made flour tortillas from scratch at the request of dd1.

it took about 10 mins to make the dough, then I set it aside to feed her and she had a nap on me and an hr later I cooked them.

I put her in the bouncy chair when I have a shower or do a big tidy up but I time it at a time when I feel that she will be happy on her own for say 20 mins.

cook in advance while baby sleeping, then warm up is what i do.

i agree about getting out and about, always a good move. plus the general bqackground noise of groups often helps babies sleep.

and foxy you say you're not a lentil weaver

starlight i like your routine

damn it! just got elli to sleep and he fell out of his tree!, when will he grow out of that jump reflex