November 2012 - They WERE sleeping, what happened?

[StuntNun]

Previous thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/postnatal_clubs/1688444-November-2012-Forget-50-books-in-2013-well-have-50-threads

Well, he then slept another 40 minutes. Fell asleep but woke on transfer. 15 weeks today, is this part of the 4 month hell or am i just truly shit at this?

She is asleep. In her cot and not my bed . It's only taken 6 hours to settle her .

VQ I wish I was talented in the craft department.

panda - wow. (and welcome back!)

pp hugs, of you're shit at this then so am I. And half the other women on this thread. But we are not shit, we are brilliant! Our babies are learning and so are we. I like to kid myself that Tilly loves my company soo much she dodges sleep so she can spend more time with me

Have a safe trip chunky - I can't remember where you were going but enjoy!

Now someone come and dart me with a tranquiliser gun? I am too tired to sleep

detective Surely it's normal for babies to cry! I've not read the link as to be honest I doubt I'll agree with it and it will just make me angry and last thing I need right now is to feel guilty. Do not let it worry you.

I do think this age is too young for cc but at the same time I don't think them crying for 5 minutes (or 10) whilst we attend to another DC, have a shit or whatever is going to do them any long term harm. But that is just my opinion and of course I'm no expert.

pp you're not doing anything wrong. As mm said if you are then pretty much all the mummy's on this thread are too!

panda welcome to the quiche and congrats. We do have another pregnant lady but she's just flown to India so won't be around for a while.

Just given E a quick feed before tube feeds. Am actually glad that she woke as I'm getting worried that my supply will drop even more as she's not feeding quite so much. Am trying to make sure I do every couple of hours but at the same time what with the obs and tube feeds I need time to try and sleep too. Expressing is going particularly poorly. Think i will hire a super dooper double pump when I get out.

vq fucking yay for 5 hours. Hope j gave you another good stint.

5hours is great VQ It seems J is really getting the hang of this.

MM did she not sleep at all in those 6 hours, or is she sleeping on you but not transferring? Either way, sympathies. hopefully a growth spurt and she'll get back to sleeping soon.

Eliza it must be hard, balancing tube feeds, expressing and feeding her yourself. Got my fingers crossed for the weigh-in xxx

N has just dosed of again so I shall try for a transfer in a minute. She has been ok on that front tonight, just not at staying asleep for any length of time - she hasn't gone more than an hour at a time tonight.

She sleeps on me in 10 minute bursts. She managed just over an hour in her cot and is now feeding again. this too shall pass

Giant man child is ill. Dying apparently (

Not sure about that article detective. I don't let LO CIO at all but there are times when I have to see to DD1, make her lunch or whatever and I can't always do that 1 handed, despite trying to! So sometimes LO has to cry for a little bit. I have tried to have her in a sling but she cries at that too! Surely some crying can't be helped? Feel guilty now tho

Congrats panda!

And sorry to anyone who had a crap nights sleep

Congratulations Panda and welcome. We talk a lot, and use rude words liberally.

Detective I'm not even clicking on that link. Do ignore it. I pick and choose as far as attachment parenting is concerned, and generally choose to ignore. It just isn't realistic advice for most of us, like most methods in fact.

I know quite a few people have read it but I really recommend French Cildren Don't Throw Food, not as any kind of bible but just as a different way of looking at things. I don't agree with quite a bit of it, especially when the writer bitches about the French in the peculiar expat way, but it should help relieve guilt about certain things advocated on here.

I hope it's bloody normal!!! He goes from 0-60 in 1 second at nights. I know this because I've been there when he does it. He used to make noises like he does in the day, but not any more at night.

Stupid guilt trips!!!

Well, he woke a few times after his last feed, going to sleep with white noise. He finally wanted a feed at 6.40 which would have been great if we ignore the other wakenings!!!

Hoping for another hour minimum now. Please?!

Morning all! Welcome mummapanda and congrats :)

Hope you have a nice time chunky!

pp you're not shit. If you are pretty much all of us are too and that wouldn't be right now would it?!? I'm pretty sure we all feel like or have felt like we are doing wrong in some aspect of this baby raising business at some point or another! I know I have. They won't be this small forever, this won't last forever and you will come out of the other side of it just fine, we all will :)

Well done on the 5hrs vq

Stunt can you not evict dp somewhere so he gets the sleep he needs?

Waiting for e to wake up. I should probably just wake him up. He keeps shuffling but that's all so far.

Detective that article wasn't great about citing references. For example it makes the assumption that a baby crying would attract predators to a primitive human settlement. Um hang on, so human settlements are completely silent then? There wouldn't be adults calling to each other over a distance and teenagers messing about and older children playing noisy games. Making knives and weaponheads from flint makes an awful lot of noise. Oh and predators such as lions, wolves and bears would make a wide berth around a human settlement. But from this one assumption that a baby cry would draw predators they conclude that therefore babies should never cry. Of course they should cry, it's their only method of communication. So don't take the article as being completely and utterly correct.

It's clear on this thread that a lot of us are getting spectacularly bad sleep at the moment, and in most cases worse than it was before 12 weeks. So I would hazard a guess that this is a normal development. Maybe we could each post tips for helping babies sleep so we can all try different things? This could be sleepy Monday?!

My tips for getting babies (and children and adults) to sleep are fresh air and exercise. You sleep much better if you are physically tired. So put baby in the bouncer or in the bath if they're active in their, or on the playmat for some rolling practice.

11.30 and 3.45. Back to two wake ups thank fuck. He drank 7oz at each of them so must be hungry.

NEW THREAD IS HERE www.mumsnet.com/Talk/postnatal_clubs/1698894-November-2012-BFPs-Already-You-girls-are-going-to-have-some-fun yes I'm looking at you GT and Panda!

Morning ladies . Congrats panda ! Wow can't believe we have another bfp!

Dare I say seems last night we are coming out of the sleep regression nightmare ?! LO went down at 8pm , woke for feed at 2 and then 6.50am . However she did wake twice around 9pm and needed settling which shes never done for a very long time.

Sleep tip, I try to make sure she had enough naps during the day and then try keep her awake after 5.30pm (she sleeps at 8pm).

detective just started reading that article. what vq says. Didn't finish the article. Babes cry. It is part of life.

Well last night we dropped the dream feed. Well, DH did. Not a good idea. Dream feed will be reinstated tonight.

As he chose not to stay up to do it he was the one who had to feed her at 2. She went straight back down again so was't an issue. She was just proving me right. :o

Thinking of you at the weigh in eliza hope all goes well.

Xx

detective i'm not dismissing the attachment parenting theory as there's probably a lot in it for the types of babies left in orphanages to cry it out. But for those looked after and cared for and left to whinge for a little, i'm really not so sure. Especially when the author states that I have only recently realized from extensive reading about the effects of early parenting on body and brain development that I show the signs of undercare--poor memory (cortisol released during distress harms hippocampus development), irritable bowel and other poor vagal tone issues, and high social anxiety as it seems that she's looking for her answer to her own problems.

Good weekend here. I survived taking both boys out on my own tosee thomas the tank engine at a railway centre. One friend cancelled and the other went home early but i stayed out despite no help so proud of myself! Plus i then did bedtime by myself for the first time too. And we had a family trip to see some snowdrops yesterday which was lovely.

Any tips on persuading a nearly 3 year old to let us brush his teeth without a big fight gratefully appreciated. We've tried star charts, the novelty just wore off. Turning into a twice daily battle...

High 5 vq! We got sleep too. bplp must have left more dust behind than she thought. Not in mm's house though (except possibly for the dying manchild . good luck looking after both your babies today mm. May you have patience and coffee in equal measure - and maybe a snooze too. Coffee, patience and snoozes to kirrin, pp, izzy and anyone else that needs it too.

Welcome panda and huge congratulations you brave and crazy lady.

Keep going Eliza, Trying to bf, express and tube feed is the pits. It can only get better. FC for the weigh in today - you are doing brilliantly regardless. Unfortunately if you are dead set on continuing bf you may find you need to try bf and express at every tube feed to keep your supply up. I had to way back when with dd anyway. Bloomin' hard for you though with dd1 to see in the day time too... My hat absolutely goes off to you. I found hiring a hosp grade pump a necessity.

On crying - I hate leaving either of mine crying, but when you have 2 littluns I think it is inevitable that everyone cries a bit sometimes. Parents most definitely included!

Well - wrote the rest of that an hour ago then dd woke up - haven't a clue what else I was going to say. G's ear send better thank goodness. Physio for dd today.

detective I'm taking prs approach and not reading it. Only because there's so many unrealistic thoughts on babies crying. This is surely how they communicate? I tend not to let him cry but this morning, for example, he woke and I had to warm his bottle. He whined for a bit, but it wasn't proper crying. Last night he cried but nothing was calming him.

I agree with stunt on exercise,fresh air, and stimulation helping. I know some people are very anti but we have had a bed time routine since he came home from hospital. So he has naked time (he has a reasonable amount of this all day, then bath, lotion, bottle (in bed) and bed.

I also want to say that yes there is a stormy period too!! We're just coming through it. However I have avoided picking him up and cuddling him. I've cuddled in the basket, used the dummy and shushed a lot. I've not fed him, mainly because he's not hungry, he's just waking. He's eating nearly 50oz a day!! He does have his last feed around 10.30 and wakes between 6.30 and 7.30. But in the peak of the stormy period he woke hourly for 10-15 minutes. We only had one day of that thankfully but others have seen a week or so.

However he's also chilled out like his father, sleeps ok in the day and we go out daily. He also has lots of time to kick about. I try to let him do this two or three times a day! Ideally with no nappy on!!

I only have one child!! And I don't know what I'm doing or why it works. It just works for us. I'm sure if we had another it wouldn't!!!

Right he's just vommed all over me. Time to shower!!

Eliza good luck today, thinking of you.

Mumma congratulations you mad person and welcome.

VQ glad to hear of some sleep.

PP, kirrin, MM we are not doing anything wrong, some babies sleep and some don't. We are being amazing mums and they will all get there.
Big hugs to everyone not getting much sleep.

If we have another 11ish wake up tonight I am going to try a dream feed. Just ordered my jumperoo, thank you for the code stunt. It worked out the same to buy one off eBay as to have one new for the ones round me.

My sleep tip is lots of fresh air again and a long bath with lots of splashing. We have also tried to help him learn to self settle so we never put him down asleep always awake.

Avoided picking him up at night!!! In the day he's often carried!!

Morning!!

panda welcome and congratulations xx

eliza fingers n toes x'd for a good weight gain - fenugreek is excellent I you need to up your supply when LO comes out of hospital.

pp hugs - your are the opposite if shit - your are gold!!! You are doing a brilliant job with LO and helping dh recover - kudos to you in buckets!!!

kyordz where's dh gone? And for how long? Apologies if you're repeating yourself - have you got support around you while he's away?? Little goals each day like getting out for a little walk will help x

detective can't read crap like that - there is always extremists who believe your children a should be attached to you until they're 18 - I did a safeguarding course last week and the things we heard about and scenarios we discussed were heartbreaking and have played on my mind the past week as long as babies are loved, fed, warm and protected from the evils off this world then we are doing a Stirling job - babies cry and we tend to them when we physically can - this reassures them that mummy/daddy/carer will come and see to their needs!! I don't believe in the extreme scales of parenting from attachment parenting to lettin them cry it out - I middle through down the middle and fortunately have 2 confident, smart, polite, gorgeous examples that I'm doing ok!!

sweetpea belated happy birthday flower xx

Think we have the "sleep regression" phase in our house - Dottie goes down a dream at 10.30 on first transfer for past 4 nights but where as she used to go til 6-7 ish she's waking at 4.30 for food - unfortunately she wants a big long old feed so we don't really get back to sleep just on our sides with me desperately trying not to suffocate her with huge norks!!! We've noticed over the past week or so she has become soooooo smiley chatty and in such a pleasant mood with rarely any grumps!!! Yesterday she was making a funny high pitched squeal as if she was going to through a strop but she was chuckling was so cute!!! Her personality is really shining through now and we can tell she's gonna be mischievous and cheeky like her big sister!!!

She's at the cm today so I might grab brekkie after dropping dd1 off at school then have a snooze before starting on the housework!!!

Hope you all have a motivational Monday - eeeekkk 2 weeks today ill be in uni!!!!!

R is developing a beautiful 3 hour afternoon nap, either in his crib at home or in the sling if out. We get out at least once a day and have done since he was three days old, even if it's just a walk round the park to send him to sleep. He doesn't have much floor or bouncy chair time because we live above an empty shop and it's so cold he howls within minutes, but he likes his bumbo in front of the toy arch next to the electric fire. He wakes to feed, i fed him lying down so i could doze last night and he was still going after 2 hours. I've tried to switch the nipple for a dummy but he spits it out and screams with hunger. Feeding more during the day results in a sore arm for me, and a grumpy baby who just wants to play - he won't latch unless hungry.

I have plenty of milk - it sprays everywhere if I'm not careful - so formula isn't an option. I don't want to feed my people baby on cow milk when there's a plentiful supply of people milk available

I really agree on the fresh air thing too. I meant to say when we were chatting about the Swedeish babies being left out in the cold to nap.

I know myself I feel miles better in myself when I have been outside.

My DS1 has an awful cough at the mo. I have been up to him with water and tixilyx twice every night this week as he has really bad attacks of it and sometimes throws up. Anyway, on Saturday I took hi. On a two mile walk in the forest for charity, a children's cancer walk I think. He didn't cough once.

I gave him a homeopathic remedy last night which has made a massive improvement. I didn't have to get up in the night.

pp lucky you having a baby who will bf and a plentiful supply of milk :) some of us didn't get that option! What I will say is bottle feeding isn't always 'easy'. Ds has feeds where he fights the bottle, he's easily distracted and falls on and off.