Whisper. What about repealing the Hunting Ban?

[whatwasthatagain]

This has been on my mind since the election, so thought I would post, get flamed, and then name change . If the Conservatives had received a majority in the election, I understood they would repeal the hunting ban, or at least have a free vote. Now that they have teamed up with the Lib Dems, is there any chance? I know it is not the most important thing on anyone's agenda, but it is quite an important subject for a large part of the Conservative heartlands. Any takers? Off to put DD to bed. Back later.

Oh yes, I remember now, in order that farmers can continue to intensively farm. And Farmers are very important arent they, so much so they insist on culling the wild life in order capitalise on it.

The reason we need to control foxes is that if there are too many of them they become hungry. Then they are more likely to take lambs and chickens and guinea pigs. If there aren't as many of them they have more food, are healthier, produce healthier offspring and are less likely to be a nuisance.

The foxhound is a more 'natural' killer than a bullet, which is indiscriminate in its ability to kill both young and healthy, and old and diseased foxes.

Hunting also helps preserve habitats, something which is very important for foxes and other creatures.

I don't particularly like the people who hunt around here but I can see the logic of what they do. The one part of the process I disapprove of is unearthing foxes with terriers. I think that once a fox has gone to ground it should be left alone.

One thing I don't believe is appreciated is the unpleasantness of a 'natural' death for a wild animal. They lose teeth. They are weak. They're attacked by other animals. Birds peck their eyes out before they're actually dead.

No old folks' homes for foxes.

And as if THAT is not enough I, as a tax payer am forced to subsidise this behavoir. FFS !

You've got the argument the wrong way round. Hunting encourages farmers NOT to destroy habitats for intensive farming. Round here we still have hedges and copses. The hunt likes them and so does the wildlife.

What a load of crap, so we are doing them a FAVOUR i seeeeeee oh the kind people. How does hunting preserve habitats then?

It is the fox`s habitat also, and if farmers go and place their lambs chickens and guinea pigs within that habitat why are they so upset when they are killed? What do you expect? I have lost chickens to a fox, I did not blame the fox, I blamed myself for not protecting them enough.

And as for the unpleasant natural death, why choose the lucky lucky foxes for this "humane" kind act, why don`t then hunt other poor animals that are sadly dying natural deaths?

I think in order to increase the tolerance of the mainly city based population of the country to fox hunting, we should introduce 'Urban Fox Hunting'.

Come on, it would be great! You could have pit bulls, and the 'huntsmen' could leap over peoples garden's etc parkour style.

Wait, stop, where are you going...

When my mates are getting ready for hunting they are definately definately NOT discussing the environment, the kindness of a "humane" non discriminant kill. They are pumped full of adrnalin and looking forward to a bloody good day out.

Thinker - "And Farmers are very important arent they, so much so they insist on culling the wild life in order capitalise on it."

Where would you like your food to come from? You think farmers and food production are NOT important?

Try to live up to your name.

Farmers are business men, they dont provide me with food out of kindness. Why are their business more important than anyone elses. I have a business, but it doesnt get subsidised by the government. If things don`t go my way its tough, work harder.

"Try to live up to your name"

Is that the best you can do?

has to get persaonal aye ? Because I dont agree with you, are you that insecure?

There not very good business men if they are making profits that amount to the minimum wage as is often claimed.

"How does hunting preserve habitats then? "

Um... in lots of ways. Local hunts are hugely involved in keeping bridleways and footpaths accessible (to dog walkers, and ramblers, and mountain bikers, and lots of people who pop out from the cities to 'use' the countryside - as is there right - before going home).

Hunting - along with shooting, and game fishing etc - encourages farmers and landowners to maintain traditional, environmentally friendly methods - maintaining established hedgerows, coppicing woodland, planting slow maturing rather than rapid-growth trees etc etc... all of which protects other bird, mammal, flora and insect populations.

The other point is that foxes are top of the UK rural food chain. Together farming (bringing lambs and chickens into the fox's habitat) and things like home bins being put out/road kill etc, mean that foxes have a lot of food, and no natural check. If the fox population is not controlled, then other small mammal species/nesting birds etc suffer. If you use poison to control the fox population, you risk bringing it into the food chain and accidentally poisoining other wild or tame species (pet dogs for example).

I'm not un-ambigously pro-hunting, but I do wish people wouldn't assume that just because they can't see what good the hunts and the hunting tradition does, that there isn't any.

I am AMAZED that the Tories are bringing this up again, and even more amazed that they almost won the election despite coming out with nonsense like this. The hunts are flourishing post-ban without the gruesome ritual of actually killing the fox. So why on earth dredge up this tiresome argument yet again?

(In any case the ban makes no material difference to the welfare of foxes, whether or not the hunts have stopped killing them. The vast majority of foxes that die agonising deaths do so under the wheels of cars, not in the teeth of hounds. If we really cared about wildlife we'd implement a drastic reduction in speed limits on all roads, which is obviously never going to happen.)

I don't hunt and, personally, I don't want to hunt. I wouldn't say I'm particularly pro-hunting. But I can see the arguments that hunting discriminates (it will only catch the old and/or sick), it can target a problem fox (which will often BE old and/or sick) and it has a binary outcome (at the end of the day any fox involved is either dead or has got away pretty unscathed).

I don't see an argument for extending the "privilege" of being hunted to other animals as all other animals in the UK have a natural predator (often a healthy young fox) which will do exactly the same thing.

I doubt a hunt is the end a fox would chose, but if the other options were being snared, or from gangrene after getting hit by a shot gun - well that's when hunting seems to have benefits to me.

I do hope that those people stating hunts are acting illegally have evidence to that effect!

I am interested as to how tax payers are subsidising hunting, though, as this is the first time I've seen that suggested. Or have I misunderstood a previous point?

Can't country folk just enjoy riding - or join a gym or summat. Do they really need to chase a fox all over the gaff? No, I think not.

'Can't country folk just join a gym....'

I take it you don't live anywhere particularly rural!

It was ever so slightly tongue-in-cheek m'dear, though my point about it not being necessary was not.

I know it was tongue-in-cheek, I'm not sure whether hunting is necessary myself.

But the idea of my life-long farming grand-dad saying 'Right, the hunt's cancelled this weekend so I'm going to have to drive 3 hours in and 3 hours back from town to use the cross-trainer at Fitness First instead' has had me rolling in the aisles!

Should keep em out of mischief then

Hope not.

Can't believe there are still people arguing that fox hunting is a good way to control fox numbers. How on earth can a whole load of people on horseback and dogs chasing one fox be efficient?

Likewise, the idea that it's good exercise, traditional pastime, etc. Drag hunting would be just as good exercise and follow much the same format - minus the dead animal at the end.

As may be obvious, I am anti fox hunting but it is way down my list of priorities. The subject has been done to death already, the fact is it's been banned and yet people carry on hunting. Why waste any more parliamentary time on it.

I think is hunting is quite beautiful and as part of our heritage would like to see the tradition preserved. I would not want to stop anyone doing it. I just get sick of these arguments that they offer to justify them doing it. Hundreds of years ago it was vital to protect the communities food source, people would have starved. But now the fundamental reason for fox hunting no longer exists. So I think they grasp at straws of arguments to justify it. Just be honest and dont try it on.

The band on fox hunting has not stopped them at all, well not round here anyway.

The reason the farmers round here tolerate the hunt tearing across their feilds and knackering the hedges is the backhanders that the hunt bung em.

I would just like to say that I don't give a fuck about fox hunting.

well im blaming mn for disturbing my sleep with daft dreams.
last night i dreamt i found a fox with an injured paw in my back garden and had a massive argument with a man in full huntsman riding outfit when i wouldnt let him kill it. i put it in my dog pen and got the vet.

thats all yous lot fault!