Just got a leaflet through my door from david cameron - I didn't realise they are planning to bring back NATIONAL SERVICE for 16 year olds

[serengeti]

I think this is a terrible idea.
Ay thoughts?

"it's a few weeks in the summer holidays between GCSEs and A-Levels."

Which will hardly "change their life" with any disciplinary or other problems, just be something else "not to like" for the section that could most do with a "stort, sharp, shock". If it's voluntary, it's going to only be those who wish to do it (or who care about their parents' views if they don't and will do it to not 'lose face' {or financial support})

Sounds good, but if it was important to them, would have been a manifesto item, so it sounds more like window dressing to me.

Exactamondo longfingernails.
As soon as was 14, I worked to buy my own clothes (not school uniform) and if I didn't have the money I wouldn't go shopping. I enjoyed the hard work in restaurants and loved babysitting for local kids. My cousins on the other hand, are still backpacking aged 28 in Thailand or Australia etc and haven't really done a proper job since leaving school.
As Geraldine says, it would help in lots of ways- socially, new skills, confidence etc. Where's the harm?

NetworkGuy

It is a manifesto item.

The boys who would most benefit from this kind of thing are the ones who won't do it, since it is voluntary anyway.

Presumably for both sexes though?

They are scaling it down in Germany, so few lads were going to the army, most wanted to do social work stuff. It is down to 8mths I think and talking about cutting it altogether.

They're already cutting defense spending anyway - doubt they'd want to increase it through army boot camp type thing when they can't afford to revamp their own equipment etc.

It's not about military service, it's about service to the community.

lucimule - I have a proper job, volunteer and am socially magnificent and am in your cousins age group so I guess that cancels out your point.

I hate the tories but making the lazy yoof help the community is something that should never have stopped.

Their manifesto is very vague about what they mean, and how it will work - "The initial flagship project will provide a programme for 16 year olds to give them a chance to develop the skills needed to be active and responsible citizens, mix with people from different backgrounds, and start getting involved in their communities."

Fair enough to encourage it, but I think there'll be problems either way - if it's voluntary, its not likely to reach those with problems, but if its compulsory then there'll be other problems.

Nope - msval - I meant people with no job, just bumming round Oz for years on end etc.

I ws pretty much doing this off my own back at 16 and don't think it's a bas idea
But makes me go arrrggghhh when they can tell me what absolutely NT no issues kids will be offered and nobody can tell me what my SN duo will be able to get- into work help? Who knows?

traget your policies at those who generally don't actually need them why not

Everything that eddie said We need to do everything we can to instill a sense of community into the yoof. Not just them though, it's also all of our responsibility to do volunteer work/get involved in our communities for the better. Whether that be helping out at dcs schools, to charity work.

So in a nutshell - great idea.

David Cameron said it would be NON military national service, whatever that means. I saw the interview when he said it a couple of weeks back.

Lucie, this plan isn't going to 'help' those people whose career choices you don't agree with, as they are in Oz, bumming around.

And anyway probably a few weeks with David Cameron and co isn't going to make them think, hmmm maybe I wont travel the world, instead, I will stay at home and do unpaid work which the Conservatives would rather that I do because they don't want to pay someone else to do it. Or maybe it will.

IT'S NOT MILITARY SERVICE!!!!!!!

Sorry, didn't meant to shout!

It has already been said quite a few times though .

The kids that will do this will be those who'd have been signed up for venture scouts, St Johns, D of E anyway

Kids like ds2 who is a cub, who officially is a young career (though I minimise that as much as am able- he quite often does things with asd ds3 whilst I calm asd ds1 or whatever though)

The kids with the EBD, young drinkers etc will still be down the part with their cider

The vast majority of kids will eb at home with their homework and a TV guide

there are many volunteering ops avaialbnle; at that age I was a young guider, St Johns cadet and making up beds at the old people's home

It was always tehre for those that wanted, this is just amrketing what was always there anyway

Non-military community service sounds like a great idea.

why the fuck would anyone in their right mind think it's a good idea to put 16 year olds in the military

Private schools with a cadet force, since you ask, but thats for officer-class lads and lasses not wayward teens

I think the problem is that they have decided to call it something which sounds a lot like "National Service" which was military - I don't get why they decided to call it that, except to get a positive knee-jerk reaction from some of their more "traditional" supporters, who do think that military service "would be the making of them". The term has just led to a complete misunderstanding - which makes "liberals" (like me...) unhappy because I feel they are being unfair to the majority of decent teens, and will also make the traditionalists unhappy when they realise that they aren't going to get yobs being sent to boot camp to "buck their ideas up" after all.

I'm not sure what I meant msval about the bumming around in Oz thing - only that so many people in my area could do with a couple of years national service to make them think a bit mroe and take some repsonsibilty in their lives.
A vague generalisation but so many people just want to take all they can and give nothing back.

I agree about the taking thing.

I don't believe in doing everything for a personal gain. I believe in everyone mucking in to help out those who need it.

I also believe in leading by example, all the time, not in assigned 'learning' sessions.

The actions of previous Tory govt (selling council houses for cash, selling national industries for cash, encouraging pursuit of more more more cash - for example) and suggestions of the current party (cutting taxes so some people can have more cash rather than sharing with those who need it for example) I think give a very poor example to young people, old people, everyone.

Sending teenagers off on a 2 week volunteering isn't going to counter this.