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Politics

Right-wingers think Churchill is a villain?

38 replies

MsAmerica · 27/12/2025 00:42

Is this widespread? This was news to me. I'm no historian, but I've always considered him heroic. He was a well-experienced politician when he became Prime Minister, and apart from the specifics of the war, he did wonders marshaling the spirit of the British people.

Why the Far Right Hates Churchill
The accepted historical narrative of the past 80 years—that it was morally right for the U.S. and the U.K. to fight and destroy the Third Reich—is now under assault.
WSJ
By Andrew Roberts

The American podcaster Darryl Cooper—who has never written a history book, let alone one about World War II, but whom Tucker Carlson calls “America’s most honest historian”—has claimed that it was Churchill’s fault that the war escalated from the limited one that Adolf Hitler apparently wanted when he invaded Poland in September 1939. According to Cooper, Churchill was the “chief villain” of World War II, rather than any of the more obvious suspects.

There are a number of problems with this theory, not least chronological. Churchill did not even enter the British government until two days after the Nazis’ invasion of Poland. Even then he was not in control of British decision-making, as he did not become prime minister until after Hitler had unleashed his blitzkrieg on Western Europe in May 1940.

Nonetheless, tens of millions of people have downloaded Cooper’s ahistoric tripe, and the British neo-Nazi historian David Irving tweeted, “Glad we are in the mainstream narrative, but would be nice to get a credit,” which got over a quarter of a million views and over five thousand “likes.”

Joe Rogan, the world’s most popular podcaster, has similarly opened the door to extreme revisionism, saying that “Darryl [Cooper] has some of the most nuanced, balanced and charitable views on all the figures in history,” which is true only if he means the Nazis....

So why is the ultraright targeting Churchill?

In the simplest terms, it is because his practical aims and principles as a leader of the West were directly opposed to the new strain of isolationism in America and Britain...

“The reason I resent Churchill so much for it,” Cooper told Carlson, “is that he kept this war going when he had no way [of winning]. He had no way to go back and fight this war. All he had was bombers…just rank terrorism.” More than that, once Hitler ripped up yet another treaty and invaded Russia in June of 1941, Churchill immediately made common cause with Stalin against Nazi Germany.

It is worth considering what might have happened had Churchill not urged these fateful choices. If Britain had remained neutral in the West and refrained from bombing Germany, Hitler would have been able to concentrate his entire Luftwaffe against Russia. Instead he had to hold back 30% of it to guard against Churchill’s bombers.

Neutrality in the face of Hitler would have meant that the 5,000 aircraft and 7,000 tanks and 51 million pairs of boots and the rest of the aid that Britain and America sent the U.S.S.R. would not have materialized. Nor would the invasion of Normandy have taken place while the Russians and Germans were fighting in Belarus.

Which leads to the obvious: With either Hitler or Stalin controlling all of Europe between Paris and Minsk, the world—including America—would have been in a vastly worse place than the one that Churchill and Roosevelt helped to fashion in 1945.

In his peroration in the Westminster Abbey speech, Churchill said, “The only guide to a man is his conscience; the only shield to his memory is the rectitude and sincerity of his actions. It is very imprudent to walk through life without this shield, because we are so often mocked by the failure of our hopes and the upsetting of our calculations; but with this shield, however the fates may play, we always march in the ranks of honor.”

Despite the best efforts of his revisionist detractors, Churchill marches there still.

For the complete article:
https://www.wsj.com/politics/why-the-far-right-hates-churchill-20fdc710?msockid=03cbec21bc9a656f2158faedbde56472

OP posts:
Thatonenight · 27/12/2025 00:44

Churchill starved millions of Indian civilians during ww2 this isn’t taught in schools. I only found out not that long ago. He isn’t this great hero that we all thought he was. I still don’t understand why the ultra right would think that though.

MotherJessAndKittens · 27/12/2025 00:47

Churchill died a long time ago. Personally I couldn’t care less. What’s happening now is more relevant to me.

user568795 · 27/12/2025 00:47

The far right in the US is embracing Hitler and revisionist history about the Holocaust and WWII in a big way. Anyone who thinks Farage and his fans aren't aiming for the same result here is very optimistic.

PollyBell · 27/12/2025 00:51

Maybe best keep it quiet in case Churchill hears and gets offended, he has jolly good hearing I have been told

littleburn · 27/12/2025 00:54

I don’t think ‘rightwingers’ do. Far right and ultra right, as quoted in the article, seem to.

Catholica · 27/12/2025 00:55

This is part of the American far right’s support for Nazism- sometimes implied sometimes explicit. It’s incredible me that this is where we are but it is the case.

I’d strongly encourage anyone on the left or centre not to help them along by criticising Churchill from the left. He definitely got a lot of things wrong- that’s the nature of leadership. He got the main thing right though.

user568795 · 27/12/2025 01:07

littleburn · 27/12/2025 00:54

I don’t think ‘rightwingers’ do. Far right and ultra right, as quoted in the article, seem to.

Edited

I think that's right, but it's a school of thought that has moved from the shadows to increasingly publicly acceptable - which is clear if you've looked at X - in recent times. These things do have a way of trickling down into the mainstream, helped along by people like Musk/Tucker Carlson/Joe Rogan (etc) platforming these ideas as legitimate positions to adopt.

knitnerd90 · 27/12/2025 01:14

It's the mainstreaming of neo-nazi thought in the American far right.

Holluschickie · 27/12/2025 01:16

So do many left wingers. Look up the Bengal famine.

HelenaWilson · 27/12/2025 01:29

.....that it was Churchill’s fault that the war escalated from the limited one that Adolf Hitler apparently wanted when he invaded Poland in September 1939. According to Cooper, Churchill was the “chief villain” of World War II, rather than any of the more obvious suspects.

It's an argument with some logic in it. Not that I agree with it, but I can see where it comes from.

At the time of the collapse of France, in May/June 1940, there were suggestions that Hitler might have been willing to reach an agreement with Britain whereby he would have a free hand in Europe and Britain would focus on the Empire, and that a peace might have been concluded on that basis.

Possibly some members of the government (Halifax) might have gone for it, but Churchill's view prevailed and instead we got 'we shall fight on the beaches....'

Whether you think that makes Churchill a villain or not of course depends on your point of view. If you subscribe to the view that Churchill was wrong, you have to believe that Hitler would have kept his word, which on past form was very unlikely. And who knows what might have been the outcome of a war between Germany and the USSR without Britain and later the US involved.

Okiedokie123 · 27/12/2025 01:33

MotherJessAndKittens · 27/12/2025 00:47

Churchill died a long time ago. Personally I couldn’t care less. What’s happening now is more relevant to me.

I do understand what you mean and your right to a certain extent but…… A major reason to care about and to understand history is to help us understand the present, current events. To help us learn from past mistakes and hopefully do better now and in the future.

DrJump · 27/12/2025 01:34

The left don't love him either. www.counterfire.org/article/winston-churchill-he-fought-for-his-class-never-ours/

HelenaWilson · 27/12/2025 02:16

The left don't love him either. www.counterfire.org/article/winston-churchill-he-fought-for-his-class-never-ours/

No mention of his role in Asquith's government before the First World War, when as President of the Board of Trade he was one of Lloyd George's allies in establishing the beginnings of the welfare state and was also responsible for legislation against sweated labour.

It was Churchill back then who first recruited William Beveridge as an advisor on National insurance and unemployment and sickness pay.

What’s happening now is more relevant to me.

Current events in Ukraine didn't come out of nowhere. They have their origins in the events of the 20th century and even earlier.

JoyintheMorning · 28/12/2025 10:13

I am still looking for a history book that puts the 1930s and WW2 in a balanced perspective.
Neville Chamberlin has been written off as an appeaser. Very little credit or praise is given for the house and Hospital building programs that he enabled as Chancellor. He also produced balanced budgets. Did not do it with debt!
Paid Holidays were also introduced by his Government then I believe.
He detested the horrible man Hitler. He knew we did not have a big enough military force to support a war for Czechoslovakia.
Lord Halifax is also unfairly thought to be a lightweight. But as Viceroy of India he had negotiated with Gandhi and he did much to avoid some of the battles between Muslims and Hindus.
I would like a balanced view on the American Isolationism of the 1920s and 30s. Which Trump is reintroducing. Henry Ford was an Isolationist until he realised how much money he could make from supplying engines, trucks and aircraft.

Darryl Cooper is like so many podcasters merely wanting to be famous and willing to say anything to attract attention.

Happilife · 28/12/2025 11:12

Churchill is not much liked by the left either. He was deeply racist who revered colonialism and imperialism. He deeply opposed right to Indian self rule, referred to Indians in rascist terms.
His policies in India during WW2 were reprehensible; wartime grain requisition, shipping being prioritised to Europe and a refusal to advertise Australian grain in India led to the Bengal famine where between 2-3 million people died. He blamed Indians for the famine, echos of Trevelyan during the Irish famine.
In terms of Ireland, during the War of Independence (1919-1921), the recruitment of ex soldiers into the Royal Irish Constabulary (police force), resulted in civilian abuse, state sanctioned violence and coercion of civilians.
The Anglo-Irish Treaty of 1921, Churchill played a key role in the negotiations and implementing the terms of the agreement, many of which were unacceptable to Irish republicans, including an Oath to the crown, partition of the country (present day N. Ireland). The partition was essentially gerrymandering which ensured a unionist majority in the 6 county state. Although he did not personally draw the boundary, he supported and legitimised the distorted border designed to support a unionist majority. He was Colonial Secretary at the time. Once the Treaty was established, Churchill treated the North of Ireland as constitutionally settled, prioritised British strategic stability over nationalist self-determination. He supported Stormont despite evidence of gerrymandering and Catholic/nationalist discrimination.

Tigerbalmshark · 28/12/2025 11:15

If you are a Nazi, you wouldn’t be a big fan of Churchill. Isn’t that obvious?

Elbowpatch · 28/12/2025 11:34

Thatonenight · 27/12/2025 00:44

Churchill starved millions of Indian civilians during ww2 this isn’t taught in schools. I only found out not that long ago. He isn’t this great hero that we all thought he was. I still don’t understand why the ultra right would think that though.

You are presumably referring to the Bengal Famine.

I think you need to do some more research.

bombastix · 29/12/2025 14:34

Tigerbalmshark · 28/12/2025 11:15

If you are a Nazi, you wouldn’t be a big fan of Churchill. Isn’t that obvious?

Edited

This. Hitler would have had Churchill killed.

Churchill was the right leader at the right time. There are right wingers who have never got over the fact that he didn’t make peace with Hitler and let the Nazis raze Europe and indulge in their antisemitism. Well what the world would have looked like if they had succeeded is horrific.

PermanentTemporary · 29/12/2025 14:42

I will be interested to see what the 2026 100 year anniversary programmes about the Great Strike will be like. Churchill’s role as an anti-left leader at that time cast a long shadow, though presumably the far right will see that as a positive about him.

At the moment, his efforts to woo Roosevelt to support the Allies with matèriel (matériel?) and loans clash with the right’s desire to dismantle the post war international settlement.

Historical writing shouldn’t be the same as picking candidates for a sports team or inviting people to a party. It should also take a broader view than ‘action A led to action B’ when just about every historical scenario is multiple levels more complex than that.

slug · 29/12/2025 18:10

Churchill vehemently opposed the vote for women.
As a Kiwi I’m well aware that much of the slaughter of Gallipoli can ultimately be laid at his feet. He was the Lord of the Admiralty at the time.

He’s not a hero to everyone

Needtosoundoffandbreathe · 29/12/2025 18:21

There are obvious parallels with what is going on in Ukraine now and the US not wanting to be drawn in as it was in WWII. Also the US not wanting to poke the Russian bear by declaring Putin its enemy. It makes sense then that those who support Trump would espouse this view of Churchill. I don't know what can be done about the current situation and it's very worrying.

MakeMineStrong · 29/12/2025 18:25

Misogynist

bombastix · 29/12/2025 22:55

slug · 29/12/2025 18:10

Churchill vehemently opposed the vote for women.
As a Kiwi I’m well aware that much of the slaughter of Gallipoli can ultimately be laid at his feet. He was the Lord of the Admiralty at the time.

He’s not a hero to everyone

But Churchill is a hero to the people who he led against a Nazi oppression. He is therefore the man who prevents the oppression of Europe by dint of his leadership. It’s not unreasonable to expect people who be benefited from his decisions to support him and laud his decisions. If you are living in the UK, your life is a result of his decisions and his vision. That doesn’t mean he got everything right. But the debt he’s owed by ordinary Brits is immense. He preserved a system by which they are free to disagree with his views.

MsAmerica · 10/01/2026 22:07

Thatonenight · 27/12/2025 00:44

Churchill starved millions of Indian civilians during ww2 this isn’t taught in schools. I only found out not that long ago. He isn’t this great hero that we all thought he was. I still don’t understand why the ultra right would think that though.

Excuse me, but almost no one is the angel we thought (or we wish) they were.

People are most often heroes for very specific actions, and that doesn't mean that they don't have a host of other failings.

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MsAmerica · 10/01/2026 22:08

MotherJessAndKittens · 27/12/2025 00:47

Churchill died a long time ago. Personally I couldn’t care less. What’s happening now is more relevant to me.

I find more and more that knowing the past helps us clarify and judge the present.

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