“Tax the wealthy” (RR budget) what does this even mean?

[gggddjkki]

I don’t remember anxiously waiting for budgets like we have the last few years earlier on in my adulthood. But when you read statements like this (as I have seen in the headlines today) what do you interpret it to mean? What does taxing the wealthy look like to you? Taxing higher earners more? From what point? Higher taxes on industry?

Not how this website works

Haven't read the full thread but it means taxing assets, not income, surely?

'They've only been in a year' isn't cutting it for me. And I am broadly pro-Labour on a normal day. Maybe this budget will take some decisive action to sow the seed for a turn around (and a seed would be something), but from what we have seen so far I am not holding my breath. I am disappointed to be thinking it let alone saying it out loud.

And then what? Given their majority there won’t be a general election. The leadership will just be replaced by even more incompetent people in the party who will make matters worse, as the Conservatives did repeatedly during their final years in office.

The Conservatives are a shambles. Everybody competent or sensible left under Johnson. Until they have a proper clear out of all the Brexit loons who are also completely economically clueless they are unelectable. Sunak at a different time could have been a decent Prime Minister but had run out of road by the time he took power plus was tainted by his support for Brexit.

Reform are an absolute joke, can’t add up, are funded by nefarious interests, also have a leader who is a proven liar and has deliberately made many of the UK’s current problems worse and has no experience of actually doing anything useful: another lazy public school boy who is a self-interested, economically illiterate moron and an extremely dishonest, dangerous one at that. He has no intention or capability whatsoever of uniting the country behind a coherent roadmap towards a successful future.

There’s no realistic prospect at the moment of any competent Government in the UK even when there is a general election. The Lib Dems are the only ones vaguely talking some sense on some policy areas in comparison to the others (a very low bar) and nobody has a coherent economic policy. It’s beyond a joke and the calibre of people is far, far too low, as is the educational level of a significant proportion of the electorate who are happy to argue like rats in a sack over irrelevancies.

It’s not that simple. Some areas need far more spending. Some need far less. All of it needs to be spent more efficiently. It isn’t a question simply of revenue raised and amount spent but is it being spent on productive areas of the economy that will increase productivity and raise growth and living standards? The answer, as it has been in the UK for decades, is “no”. Due to the failure to reform public institutions over 50% of total public spending is now going on the over 65s, which is unproductive and who - as a cohort - are the wealthiest cohort in society. This is utter madness if the country is to have any future. There needs to be a total overhaul of pensions and the NHS and a huge redirection of public spending to infrastructure, education and an effective industrial and trade policy, alongside overhaul of the tax system to remove pointless cliff-edges which actively harm growth (which can be done in a revenue neutral way!).

Reform are an absolute joke, can’t add up, are funded by nefarious interests, also have a leader who is a proven liar and has deliberately made many of the UK’s current problems worse and has no experience of actually doing anything useful: another lazy public school boy who is a self-interested, economically illiterate moron and an extremely dishonest, dangerous one at that. He has no intention or capability whatsoever of uniting the country behind a coherent roadmap towards a successful future.
I tend to see farage as a version of Jeremy Clarkson, but minus the huge 'bison' head and without the football stuffed up his jumper.

The fact that anybody considers this odious toad as a prospective leader of our country shows have very low things have sunk.

It will mean taxing people with the ‘broadest shoulders’, which is basically anyone not on benefits or who doesn’t work in the public sector. It will be taxing property, vehicles, lowering VAT threshold, more education taxes and removing some of salary sacrifice on pension contributions. By December, Rachel will have found another black hole and the cycle of the threats will begin again.

If they do it’s madness.

Addressing your penultimate paragraph, please.

How do you therefore explain Reform’s popularity?

The problem is that her poor decision making is creating the black holes now

if she spoils the markets and no one wants our gilts then that hole is just going to keep growing

if they punish people who save they are just quickening the death loop

European countries need to accept we’re not rich enough to have the life politicians promised and which ultimately has only been there for a very short period

people talk about the pension age as if it’s been that way for centuries but it’s a comparatively new thing. Same with the NHS.

How do you therefore explain Reform’s popularity?
I know your question wasn't addressed to me but I'd say the answer is 'populism'.

Also that farage has a certain charisma (personally I find him repulsive) and he is a good con man, people identify with him and want to believe what he says.
As per trump, his 'base' comprises mostly those of low educational attainment, ie., people who are easy to fool.

as is the educational level of a significant proportion of the electorate who are happy to argue like rats in a sack over irrelevancies.

@PlanetMa Do you think people should have to take a test before being allowed to vote?

You chipped in on a discussion about pension liability for the public sector. Specifically that costs are coming down. I'm just asking for evidence. No problem if you just chipped in to say something for the sake of it.

I love people who say that about other people. They must have a very sound sense of their own intelligence. Obviously if they vote Labour that intelligence must be called into question...

Labour deal in trite soundbites and bad economic policy, it worked for the last GE but likely won’t again.

I think one could make an argument for this but it would lead to a situation where only the elites were allowed to vote, in other words it would lead us away from democracy which of course is only the least worst option.🤦🏼‍♀️

The problem is according to many on here is that the whole country has suddenly become racist. We were by most international metrics the least racist country in the world. But as soon as Labour got into power we suddenly (according to our Glorious Leader) all became far right racists. Goodness knows how Labour achieved that in only a year so so!

Anyway, that means that we now all have to vote Reform as they are the party that most corresponds with the ideals of most of the people, according to Keir Starmer. It's not the people's fault. It's Labour's.

what they need to do - excuse me pointing out the obvious - is hit everyone.
A bit on pensioners, a bit on unemployed, a bit on supermarkets and similar, a bigger bit on rich home owners, billionaire social media companies and tighten rules on benefits, and cash in hand. Help HAs to police their properties so people aren't subletting but getting housing allowance etc Police landlords and prosecute if need be

Ok there would be no immediate benefits as it would cost a lot to implement but you would end up with fewer cash in hand workers because they might get caught, a disadvantage to hoarding huge properties by foreign investors, landlords actually doing their job etc etc

Be embarrassing if you were knocked off the voting list for being too stupid, eh! @MO0N

Precisely.

This is my concern too. Most people would have absolutely no clue we earn over 115K. We don't have a fancy car or huge savings of a fancy house (to be fair it's a relatively recent thing) and we live in a fairly expensive area - but I think people on 30k think anyone earning this amount must be living the dream, have no financial worries and deserve to be taxed even more than we already are while we currently have absolutely no entitlement to benefits. It's too much of a burden for a small proportion of people to pay. I'm not saying we don't have a reasonable standard of living, we do, but equally we don't have tons of spare cash at the end of the month. I think I probably used to think 100k+ was very wealthy. Maybe it was 15-20 years ago, it isn't now.

It’s not just the financially illiterate policies themselves, but the constant kite flying of various taxes, legislation and rhetoric against net tax payers that begins almost immediately after one budget has ended and a new black hole has been found. It’s pretty much relentless. Companies aren’t investing in people or recruitment and SMEs are scaling back - the job market is a disaster particularly skilled positions, people aren’t moving house - the property market is a disaster, landlords won’t rent properties out without incredibly stringent background checks and high rents and are leaving the sector - the rental sector is a disaster, people are not working when they reach various tax thresholds, 90bn in assets has left the UK in the last 10 months and many high net worth people who can reasonably easily leave the UK have done so or plan to do so. I don’t see how this due to incompetence, I think it’s deliberate.

Yet you will see time and time again on threads like this somebody paying £3k tax a year telling someone paying £36k a year tax that they are the selfish ones and need to pay their ‘fair’ share. It makes absolutely no sense, is a self defeating broken mindset and at the root of a lot of problems.