Changes to immigration rules announced by Starmer

[OneAmberFinch]

Full white paper here is extensive and announces changes to all avenues of migration - basically their approach to resolving the issues of massively increased migration from 2019-2023/4.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/6821aec3f16c0654b19060ac/restoring-control-over-the-immigration-system-white-paper.pdf

And Starmer's commentary on the BBC: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/ce810e3z6dkt

Handful of headline changes: default timeline to get ILR to go to 10 years instead of 5; abolishing new care worker visas; raising skills threshold for Skilled Workers back up to graduate level; increasing minimum grades required for student visas; various bits and pieces around English language requirements among several other policies

I am all for some restrictions on immigration, but the way you have appointed yourself as a "good immigrant and others as " bad immigrants" is grating on me.

What do people think of the proposed policies for students and graduates?

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/6821aec3f16c0654b19060ac/restoring-control-over-the-immigration-system-white-paper.pdf - page 74 here has a summary

Includes adding a graduate tax for international students, shortening the graduate visa period to 18mo, tightening up certification agency requirements for universities. I'm not familiar enough with student visa accreditation to have a strong view on some of these.

Do you think there are any "bad immigrants"?

Yes. Anjem Choudhury.

But I have just seen on another thread- not stalking you honest but I went to the Keir Starmer thread- that you are a new immigrant who likes Reform.

I doubt we will agree on anything. Carry on.

It’s not a bad start. But for all the racists it will never be enough. They want a tardis, not tougher migration rules.

I would also put in age limits for certain visas like other countries.

Automatically deportation for criminals convictions and permanent bar to any return. Our prisons have FNOs who don’t need to be here.

That’s not his mistake.

He has no problem with island of strangers rhetoric.

Why was that a mistake?

I mean I assume he said it deliberately

Honestly doesn’t go far enough given the quality of UK universities.

His mistake isn’t not going far enough as suggested. It’s generally losing trust. The island of strangers is just the icing on top of lacking instinct.

It’ll be interesting to see how Reform does due to his rhetoric. He advisors seem oddly disconnected.

I’m happy with this paper. The figure, not the rhetoric will be the test, I think. Starmer has another four years.

How far did you want them to go?

I’m not surprised. I recall the comment on reaching peak immigration or some such pre GE. Nowhere near the case. Reform polling a FPTP win at ten months. Who would’ve thought it.

His advisors weren’t great on that one.

@InPraiseOfIdleness

"Sadly, for the last 3 or 4 elections at least, there hasn’t been a single political party in the UK which has been capable of producing a viable manifesto that wasn’t pure economic fantasy, so living standards will continue to decline."

Oh there are plenty of policies that would boost productivity and economic growth. The problem is that such policies would be unpopular with the public and that any party having such policies in their manifesto would never get elected.

People have a right to apply for asylum once here. If it's frivolous they should be refused and deported without them running to the bloody ECHR or some liberal judge overturning it.

People overstaying visas aren't always tracked either and get lost to the black economy.

I think we did reach peak migration in 2023, at 905k. 2024 was 728k, this year?

All these intended changes are suggested to bring us back to pre Brexit. Who knows if it will happen? Assuming we conclude trade deals for skills and migration (short term) then yes, it seems possible.

When one comes in as a carer but brings the whole family, including old granny and granddad, it's not economically viable. That was the problem with students.
Well part of the problem, half the time students never took up their course. same as a lot of carers don't but go straight to working in hotels.

If I wanted to retire to New Zealand, they require a lump sum of around £600,000 plus a passive income of £50,000.
We're just bloody mugs.

@OneAmberFinch

"What do people think of the proposed policies for students and graduates?"

In reality it will make minimal difference- maybe 3k less in net immigration (compared to 728k overall immigration in 2024).

People aren't turning to Reform because of care worker visas.

It's the tens of thousands a year breaking into the country in boats and getting kept at our expense.

I meant a comment on the public not caring about immigration.

That was you? I’m not sure who is advising and how much but what a thing to think.

That was my impression as they didn't seem like very radical changes.

The rapid increases in net migration in recent years was for keeping UK HE/social care afloat and an attempt to deal with post Covid labour shortages/supply chain inflation

On universities like care homes they’re finding the economic climate tough. I’d watch for further redundancies and closures.

I think unfortunately it will lead to further abuse of the asylum seeker system.
when almost all legal visa holders need to stay in the UK for 10 years, during which they have no access to public funds, pay yearly IHS fees and NI, on top of paying various taxes...those who come as illegal immigrants will get their first few years sorted, free accommodations on waiting for a deification and access to public funds once refugee status is granted, while working on cash / dirty jobs. For those who are ambitious, the white paper has just opened a door for them to apply for work visa.

to clarify I am talking about those economic migrants who abuse the asylum seeker system, not those real asylum seekers who are in dire situations. I can see how a tighter rules on legal immigration will push some opportunists into illegal route for UK citizenship.

It was me. Immigration at the election was not a top ten issue apparently. The issue was living standards and Tory incompetence. That doesn’t mean I agree with figures or policies like the Conservatives had, I strongly disagree. But it was definitely related to their incompetence!