Can someone explain to me in simple terms. USA elections

[ihatethecold]

What are the main differences between Obama and romney?
Is Obama like labour and Romney like very right conservative?

Why does Romney say he will get rid of the healthcare bill that Obama brought in.

Did it not work?
why wouldn't you want people without insurance to access healthcare ?
Thanks

20 year fixes, as in interest rate fixed for 20 years? My goodness. Is that still common or when you say 'old style' does that mean they are not issued any longer?

I remember my old granny talking about such things.

I was wrong - 30 years is still available
www.usbank.com/cgi_w/cfm/personal/products_and_services/mortgage/interest_rates.cfm

should be a good deal, what with dollar devaluation and inflation going up.

The crazy thing is that before the Bush presidency, the US actually had a budget surplus.

Can you imagine? It seems unbelievable and yet it wasn't even that long ago.

Btw I love when the right refers to 'tax and spend liberals'. As if Republicans don't also tax you and spend your money on stuff.

Yes they did but Bush never did anything to stop the unreguated balloon from building and busting despite being close to his father during the Reagan/Bush Bush era when they deregulated the savings and loans that then lead onto the decade the savings and loans crisis.

Of course what he did learn from his dad during that time was that if you know there is a banking problem then keep quiet for as long as possible as you may get through the next election before having to release the figures that allow the full depth of the the scandal to be known.

It's troubling to many of us Brits that the republicans seem fanatical in their right wing ideals.

Thank you for telling me why Romney gets ticks - way back in thread!

I feel afraid of Tea party types just like Americans were afraid of communists - although I wouldn't lock you up, I feel you need to be closely watched! I'm really not anything but middle of the road liberal Brit type and I am sure lots of other Mnetters feel like me.

The Christian far right are scary. I remember Clinton saying they were his only enemy.

30 year fixed rate mortgages are very much alive and kicking, and 15 and 30 year terms are the most common though there are longer terms available, and shorter.

The adjustable rate mortgages that are more the norm in Britain and Ireland (and Canada iirc) became popular during the boom that preceded the bust. Some blamed them for the bust, especially those that required no down payment and thus left homeowners with no equity or very little.

Right now, 30 year fixed rate mortgages are offered at an all time low rate.

Dreamingbohemian -- yes, the rhetoric about curbing spending is designed to appeal to emotions and in no way reflects what happens no matter who is in power.

@several people paraphrased "I'm not surprised most of us on here are liberal Brits": neither am I, this being a British website. That is why it needs a counterbalance because there are millions of UK citizens who agree with Republican type ideas. A minority yes, still a lot of people. MN does not need to be a cosy leftist echo chamber.

As for 100M Republican voters, I was aware there were never that many in one election but if the country is split fairly down the middle there are over 100 million adults who would have sympathy for those principles. So a thread on here intended to be a "simple explanation of the 2012 Presidential race" deserves to have some perspectives of centrist and GOP fans. This is not the Barack Obama Appreciation Thread.

I even said upthread that I'd prefer someone who had what I consider the best elements from the GOP and Dem platforms, and would be behind him/her whichever party they belonged to. I am definitely leaning moderate in American terms, and my philosophical position is traditionalist conservative.

FWIW- I don't vote as none of the parties give me what I'd be looking for, and possibly lean to Miliband over Cameron for '15, for the sake of the sick and poor cuts victims as building a genuine Big Society culture based more on American-style private philanthropy and less statutory services that would be suitable to protect the interests of the vulnerable would take years, this requiring major change.

Against Ed, he could be an anti-wealth fanatic ("Red Ed" for a reason) though to be honest the disadvantaged attract more of my empathy than people with fat bank balances, he could go too far with Europe while the coalition is pursuing a moderate EU policy and the big thing I'd worry about is him messing up education by pandering to the anti-traditionalist fanatics. I think education policy should become less partisan anyway and decisions based on sound research about what works, children deserve better than to be used as footballs.

MN can lean whatever way it wants.

As it is not a mainly US site it is not to be expected to reflect US attitudes.

It is interesting to hear from US citizens and residents who are immersed in variations of their own culture. Naturally there are many parts which are different from our own and some that some of us will not like.

Extrospektiv

So your still throwing that liberal word around as if it's an insult yet not once have you answered the specific questions put to you. Try rereading the thread and then give some answers.

The only thing the right in america seem to be good at is following Mein Kampf and the big lie theory which they used in the 1950's to brainwash you all into hating the USSR. Doublethink at it's best from the GOP

are millions of UK citizens who agree with Republican type ideas

Really? Honestly? Cos last time I checked the NHS was pretty popular... I don't think there are millions calling for it to be taken down. Far from it, because they at least have some level of love of socialism running through the overwhelming majority.

but if the country is split fairly down the middle there are over 100 million adults who would have sympathy for those principles

Going to take a while stab in the dark at why voter turnout is low and ask is it possibility because so many people feel unrepresented by both parties...?

Extrospektiv is not an American.

But I am - which is why I take issue with much of what they say

He's had some trips there

For what happens when partisan politics hits education hard see the US "anti-phonics" movement where liberals tried to enforce Look and Say/ Whole Word over phonics, despite studies showing either that both were equal or that phonics was superior - just because phonics was the traditional method and the one preferred by right-wing groups who added "back to basics" education to their roster along with fighting values clarification, exercises teaching children there was no right and wrong or absolute truth and they should think for themselves (=postmodernism and contrary to faith teachings) and stopping secretive school based health clinics which they saw as counter-parent.

mathanxiety: refuting your denials that A=A and therefore liberal lobby groups are indeed liberal;
School-based clinics which, by the way, the Children's Defense Fund under Hillary Clinton supported- thus earning them the "liberal" tag along with their endorsing of 99.9% Dems over their votes for more government spending on health and education, their DREAM Act support which is obvious given as it grew out of the civil-rights movement, fervent belief in gun control and other issues. The thing I really dislike about CDF, despite the excellent work they have done on many issues, is that they use the word "protect" in their Republican-trashing: putting out lists of Democrats with 80-100% scorecards and Republicans at or barely above zero, accompanied by "How well does your senator/representative protect children...?" which has horrific implications for those who are just ideologically opposed to higher government spending or see better use of money than the particular votes, don't want immigration amnesty and believe in gun rights.

Sierra Club advocates environmentalist policies which override Republican policy on numerous issues while dovetailing with Democratic ones. I have not studied this issue closely enough to decide where I stand on it.

Denying PP, Center for Repro. Rights or NARAL are liberal is like denying the earth is round. That abortion/BC is currently legal makes no odds in this. The fact is, their fight to keep it legal is a liberal political cause, in the same way fighting to keep guns legal is a conservative one. "I'm just trying to keep the law the way it is" does not exempt you from an ideological label.

People for the American Way run an anti-conservative specialist site called "Right Wing Watch" with links to the likes of Talk LEFT, Open LEFT, Daily Kos, Religion Dispatches, Talkingpointsmemo, ThinkProgress and just hardcore leftism in general. I am not talking middle of the road liberal here. The stuff on these websites is simply as far as you can go without being an outright socialist.

They call judges who disagree with Roe v Wade and an expansive "privacy" ideology which is nowhere in the text of the Fourteenth Amendment and strict constructionists "REACTIONARIES". They are already abortion-baiting over SCOTUS appointments should Romney win and have set up another site to do this- romneycourt.com They oppose parental rights legislation full-throttle. Extreme liberal, extreme liberal, extreme fucking liberal. Be honest and accept that is what you are. As I said, I don't find it an insult. Just a political view I don't sympathise with and which I wish no-one would take to these extremes, in the same way I don't like the right-wing extremes of racism, heavy nationalism, anti-woman views and a completely free market/Austrian school "sink or swim on your own, we don't care" system.

A dishonourable mention to one of PFAW's buddies, Pandagon: this site now features the sickening Amanda Marcotte known for absolute hatred of pro-lifers and the religious of any type, her hard-core defenses of the sexual revolution, open promotion of European extreme-liberal sex ed and even saying that high schoolers should have an "experienced" adult to explain to porn-watching boys how to please their girlfriends. As if all the monks and nuns who have done school sex ed in Catholic establishments are not capable of delivering a morally sensitive and respectable message on human reproduction. If you want to talk about your own adolescent sexual shenanigans in explicit detail, find a doctor or someone else appropriate for that. Your "sophisticated & approachable" 53 year old principal with her 36 years' experience starting in the post-Roe hookup generation is there to run that school, NOT to listen to your sexual confidences. Better still, wait for marriage.

The NEA I was referring to is the National EDUCATION ASSOCIATION, and everyone knows that a teachers' union is not the natural home of conservatism. There are plenty of conservatives in the teaching profession- a survey I saw in a large number of public schools across the 50 states said that 40% were Dem, 30% GOP and 30% independent or minor party. At the top of the NEA however, is the very same narrow-minded elite that run most of the academy, and the teacher training colleges of Europe. NEA's official position statements on an enormous series of issues social, fiscal and in-between are basically the Dem platform or to the left of even that. They are super high rolling Democratic donors.

Novackngood: Nazi reference out of order! Wow, the ignorance of comparing the slaughter of millions in the greatest war and one of the greatest genocides humanity has ever seen to... conservative politics.

Big Lies are told by people on both sides of politics. In America, in this country, and probably everywhere else in the world. It's part of the programme. Not saying it's right, but it's not just rightwing.

have we got some actual American voters who'd like to chip in?

Oh the strawman argument extrospektiv.

No one said anything about comparing the holocaust to the republicans.

I said they are using the same philosphy known as the big lie philosophy used in mein kampf and then also used in 1951 in the film of the same name which was released by the US Army to turn the US folks against communism to turn their backs on their ally USSR.

Again you didn't answer any question except your own strawman nonsense.

Sarah Palin (nutjob right) cost John McCain (Republican centre) the election.

Romney has gone for the same tactic - appeal to the hard right with your running mate. He will meet the same fate as McCain.

"the VP is only one bullet away from the Oval office"

So don't bring up Hitler then, just call them liars. And again, 1951? If we're talking 1951 I will say the Democrats are racists and GOP are civil rights people, because that was true then... not so any more. You and math are both projecting things which ended decades ago onto the GOP, Romney and his 2012 campaign.

HmmThinking: there are plenty of people who think that a private system could do better than the NHS, just look on the Telegraph forums or other papers whenever something negative about the NHS is reported: certainly a minority but 10% (5 million voters) would not be asking too much.

It's right in the mainstream to want more restrictions on abortion (20-week limit or even lower for abortions without exceptional circumstances; independent counselling; parental notification/consent for under 16s are all popular) and 15-25% depending on poll are actual prolifers like me who want abortion to be made illegal.That is millions of people. It is popular to suggest cutting benefits and government spending, even if driven by exaggerations of what benefits people actually get and how much trouble we're in. Polls show majority in favour of death penalty for some murders, between a third and a half supporting leaving the EU, "tough on crime" sentencing increases get so much popular support even Labour implements them, New Labour had to move right to avoid becoming completely obsolete because people didn't want confiscatory levels of tax on the wealthy or hikes on the middle class. These are all right-wing ideas. This site does not even come close to reflecting the average British citizen from any official ComRes/ YouGov/ British Social Attitudes Survey or other major poll. So it will not represent the average Brits' views on American politics either.

That's why I'm in here to redress the balance. It is a shame but not a surprise no-one's coming to my defence in a rational way.

But you are not here redressing any balance.

You spout off your forced birther views then when asked if you agree with the laws that include a forced vaginal probe for ultrasound, blow the image up to A4 size to emotionally blackmail a raped woman into then having a child she has no means to support, and the states will not support either, you refuse to answer and clam up.

Extro---

'mathanxiety: refuting your denials that A=A and therefore liberal lobby groups are indeed liberal; '

I never said the groups you recited were 'liberal' -- and neither did you. What you said was that they were 'anti-conservative'. From what you posted it seems what you mean by 'anti-conservative' is holding a view that some conservatives disagree with. (A case of projection in some ways but that is neither here nor there).

I don't know what you mean by secretive health clinics in schools. In a society where not all students' families have health insurance and many fall between family not being able to afford it and qualifying for public health coverage, having a nurse in school makes a lot of sense.

The DCs had a nurse's office in their high school. If you were feeling ill you had to go to the nurse's office before being released home. The nurse's office supported students who were pregnant and those who had recently delivered -- students could go there to pump breastmilk and store it in the fridge. Students kept inhalers and antibiotics there. The nurse's office was often the first port of call for students who were depressed and the staff there were skilled at flagging those with issues ranging from experiencing bullying to needing inpatient psych treatment. The nurse's office provided referrals for family support when families needed it if their students' problems were hard to deal with. As a parent I would be very happy to see my student approach the nurse's office instead of letting a problem fester.

The DCs did 'Health' class as a graduation requirement. (Interestingly, if you didn't want to waste a semester doing Health in class you could do it by correspondence, and the chosen provider of the correspondence course was Brigham Young University..). In their US Catholic elementary school they did 'Family Life'. I trust my DCs to make good decisions. I have a good enough relationship with them (I think) that they would feel able to come to me if they had a problem. I am glad they have at least someone to talk with if they feel they can't come to me.

'As if all the monks and nuns who have done school sex ed in Catholic establishments are not capable of delivering a morally sensitive and respectable message on human reproduction.'
You are taking the piss here, surely?
I am a Catholic from a country that has been rocked by a massive and seemingly unending scandal involving extreme sexual dysfunction and abuse of power by members of the clergy both male and female since the state of which I am a citizen was founded. Members of the clergy and religious who tried to deliver any sort of message on sex and sexuality there would be met with raised eyebrows at the least and other reactions from less polite elements.
I go to mass every Sunday and on holy days and my DCs do too. Fwiw, I consider myself pro life, but I tend to express that through practical support for women's refuges and the like and absolutely not by voting for 'pro life' candidates whom I see as a pack of charlatans -- you really can't say you are pro life and support a party that does not support the concept of minimum wage and access to free health care for all, and is all for the death penalty and deportation of immigrants even if it means splitting up of families and leaving children without fathers or mothers.

Whether abortion is legal or illegal it will happen as long as women are unable to support babies financially, are forced to remain in relationships however tenuous where there is an imbalance of power and having a baby with a man means they are tied to that man until the baby turns 18 (thank you, fathers' rights activists), and where women are shamed for expressing their sexuality. Places like Ireland used to be (still is in some respects) and the US, for instance.

'Extreme liberal, extreme liberal, extreme fucking liberal. Be honest and accept that is what you are. '
I like the environment. I like the idea that children should be protected and I think there is plenty they need protection from, though those things are not necessarily the same things I think you might feel are a threat. I don't like the idea that gang members and innocent bystanders can be mowed down in American cities on warm summer nights just because the AK 47 is technically a gun. I like the idea that in a free society all sorts of views can be aired on all sorts of issues and a sensible middle ground can be reached. I don't agree with the opinions of many parties to the debates but people have an absolute right to have them and to expect better in return than stupid labels of 'fucking liberal' by way of reply. I see 150 years since the Civil War of attempts to create and then maintain a civil society 'with liberty and justice for all' a painful process at times at risk of going down the drain because of the shrill and extremist tone that people like you bring to the table. I am a pro life liberal Catholic who values civil debate. Put that in your pipe and for the love of all that is good and holy relax

IdPreferNot -- I agree with your comments upthread on Romney not running on his record and being seen as a flip flopper and also with your take on Sarah Palin costing McCain the election.