Just been on a course about new benefit system

[buggyRunner]

Christ it's a big shake up.

I say this as someone who won't be personally affected- it is harsh.

Basically if you claim any benefits other than child benefit you're probably going to have a loss.

Well by people who are qualified for a start!

There's probably a few conditions that shouldn't need reassessing unless there's an additional complication.

OhDo - but people do work with very serious conditions. as we have discussed in the past my dad had a type of brain cancer that resulted in loss of muscle control. he worked until it was not possible.

a friends mum runs her own business. she carried on working with the kidney failure and started work again a few days after the operation to attach the port.

another friend is on sickness benefits due to HIV but is physically well.

so it is not as simple as having a condition.

DLA IS NOT AN OUT OF WORK BENEFIT
Do you understand that?

YOu are on all of these threads. Yet you seem to 'forget' that very important little detail.
MY OH DOES WORK. He had done since he was 16, including fighting in a war and 6 years as a paramedic.

What is your point?

oh & the NHS care for my Dad was nil. State help for all those years of paying taxes didnt exist. so you can pay in and get nothing back & TBh i think thats far from normal.....

my friends mum carried on working because she despriately needed the money.

there isnt enough money to go around.

ohdo - do you mean me?

TBh i think thats far from normal..... = TBh i think thats completely normal.....

Get a job.

Yes.
I do not understand what your point is.
We are talking about DLA yes?
So why are you telling me about disabled people who work?

It is irrelevant.
DLA is going to be reassessed regardless of if people are in work or not.

So why are you talking about the people you know who work despite being disabled?

I do have a job ironman. what's your point?

wires crossed. I was not commenting on your DH not working - i know he works.

(1) i meant taxation a pot you pay into and you benefit from roads, the basic NHS, police force, rubbish collection etc. basic services but thats about it.

i think its normal to contribute and not get anything back (except basic services).

(2) you need to assess someones capability to work, not their condition.

TillyMinto you know perfectly well that DLA is awarded on the level of incapacity, not the name of a condition (and even automatic awards for people in the middle of intravenous chemo are being stopped). So your protest is disingenuous, as it always is.

Further, your father worked "until it was not possible".

Once it was no longer possible, would you like him to have been reassessed at 6 month intervals to see if his brain tumour had gone away? Money for old rope for the private company hauling in taxpayers' cash for the assessment. Not so nice for you having to take time off work to accompany your father as he got worse and worse. Heartbreaking for him. And completely pointless for everyone.

I dont really understand what you are getting at TBH Tilly.
Its not just about my OH.
It is about DLA as a benefit that enables people with disabilities to stay in work.
It isnt normal to pay into the system and not get anything back.
You might go through life with a few ups and downs, the usual medical costs but BAM you get cancer - how much do you think it costs to treat that?

It cost more in few months than some illness take in years and years.

Therefore some people are going to get more out than others.

Taxes are not just for basic NHS and police etc. They are for social care. That is what we pay for.
Social care is the basics.

I dont know what you think the alternative is.

Some people are lucky enough not to need more than the basics, others are not.

So your father never saw an NHS doctor in his life and died before the introduction of National Insurance in 1911, did he? Jolly good.

SK - would you like him to have been reassessed at 6 month intervals to see if his brain tumour had gone away?

we have relatives who are on the fiddle which he hated. so yes.

national insurance is just a name for a type of taxation. its not insurance.

Re balancing the books, I wish the government would make ATOS pay for the appeals system, as currently it's the taxpayer who pay for ESA appeals, not the private company.

The system might suddenly alter if ATOS actually had a financial incentive to get it right first time.

Ha, well I win my bet-with-self about when you would brag about your criminal relatives - in whose crime, by the way, you are colluding by not reporting.

But other than that, you haven't really answered the question.

Why would you want your father reassessed at 6 month intervals to see if his incurable brain cancer had gone away?

If he was lying, he would have been found out at the first assessment. Scans and all that.

And if he wasn't lying, and the cancer was progressive, what was the gain to anyone of repeated assessments?

OhDo - Social care is the basics. i agree this is how it should be but i have not seen anyone friends/family, including people on low incomes, cared for by the state to a signifiant level. so its not my experience of how it works.

i think we have been sold an idea, work, pay tax and the state will look after you. i dont know if it ever really worked like that or if we just thought it did. but i dont think it does work like that now.

another family member has. because it could have gone away. because we need to have systems. because he could have had an improvement.

because diagnosis arent a fixed as you see them.

What on earth can you mean?
Are you saying that your father was denied care by the NHS?

What do you think we pay tax for? Having the rubbish you create with your consumerism removed by the state is less of a luxury than being cared for when you are unable to work?

really? Cant you get your stuff to the dump? My OH is disabled and we manage it when we have to.

You know that your posts dont make any real sense dont you?

You can have an improvement from incurable brain cancer?

Have you informed the BMJ?

Stephrick - I got child benefit and child tax credits mixed up.

Child benefit x 3 would be = £2,455
Child tax credits x 3 would be = £8,617. But the figures would still be the same and all the benefits together do add up to £36,011.

Check on Turn2Us if you don't believe me or I can do a screen grab, no problem.

there wasnt any treatment, except 1 course of steriods.

it was a defused tumor in the brain stem. not like a lump, more like feathery through the brain stem.