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Original poster

Raising money

64 replies

newwave · 26/02/2011 23:57

I am looking for posters ideas for raising money in the UK to be used to keep our public services.

I would put "tax the rich more" but that is to obvious although it is a good idea.

My idea is for a job export tax, jet Take for example Dyson, he started his company in the UK but after a few years he transfered production to the Far East so as to take advantage of cheap labour.

So here is my idea, for every job he exported overseas he should pay say £100,000 in a jet a portion is to go to the person losing their job and the rest to the treasury.

This idea may stop the banks for example transfering their call centres to India if transfering 400 jobs cost then £40 million pounds.

The only people who could lose is the shareholders/owners/directors by getting lower dividends or salaries which is not altogether a bad thing.

This could not work within the EU but may stop UK companies exploiting cheap labour elswhere and laying off UK workers in the callous manner just to increase profits.

OP posts:
Original poster
newwave · 28/02/2011 23:19

Taxing the rich more is always tempting but history shows us it is inefficient.

Certainly increasing income tax to 50% and removing the personal allowances of high earners has had a negligble effect upon the current situation.

Maybe yes, maybe no but it is a nice idea to screw the rich until the pips squeak.

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smallwhitecat · 28/02/2011 23:22

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Original poster
newwave · 28/02/2011 23:29

SWC

The purpose of tax policy is to raise money to pay for government expenditure.

A fair tax policy takes the most from those that can afford it, the rich.

A fair tax policy is a good idea, that is unless your a rich tory when fucking the poor seems a far better idea.

The above is in regard to personal taxation.

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TheCoalitionNeedsYou · 28/02/2011 23:35

newwave - if the purpose of taxation is to raise money to pay for government expenditure, then we should tax in the way that raises the most money.

Which isn't taxing the rich until the pips squeak.

smallwhitecat · 28/02/2011 23:35

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Original poster
newwave · 01/03/2011 00:30

No back pedaling at all.

I would squeeze the rich to shown them that the pain being felt/to be felt by the poor applies to them as well and it would be "nice" to see them feel that pain as opposed to being insulated from it by Tory policy which will only affect them on the margins.

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TheCoalitionNeedsYou · 01/03/2011 07:34

So it's more important to make the rich hurt than to provide services to the poor?

scaryteacher · 01/03/2011 09:17

I thought Denis Healy was long gone..evidently not.

The rich will go and live elsewhere, so there will be less money to redistribute, and then the middle earners will be squeezed even more. You said somewhere on another thread NW that you had a joint income of around £90k - you are getting close to being 'rich' in that scenario.

catinthehat2 · 01/03/2011 10:43

I know I keep banging on about the Laffer curve. It's a very simple & easy to understand concept unless you have your fingers in your ears and go "la la la I'm not listening"

catinthehat2 · 01/03/2011 10:43

NEWWAVE CAN YOU HEAR US LOVE???????????

wordfactory · 01/03/2011 11:24

Why is it 'nice' to screw the rich?

What have they done to you?

I am a writer. I make stuff up and write it down. It entertains people.

Why do I need to be made to suffer to make a point? And what is the point anyway?

I'm happy to pay my taxes (well I groan in January like everyone else) as I can see they're necessary to keep the country going and protect the vulnerable.

But why use taxes as a tool to beat me with?

I just don't get that at all.

Niceguy2 · 01/03/2011 13:02

but I have to tell you I think your credibility, such as it was, will not recover.

NW had credibility? When? I thought he was just a socialist troll?

QueenBathsheba · 01/03/2011 17:47

Niceguy2 I'll make no bones about it, I am socialist, am I a troll too?

Is it really so strange and inconceivable that not everyone is happy to accept the cuts and the attacks on public services, is it inconceivable to you that some us of think Georgie Peorgie and chums are driven by idealogy over empathy, democracy and decency.

smallwhitecat · 01/03/2011 17:53

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Original poster
newwave · 01/03/2011 22:29

CITH2

I am aware of the Laffer curve but it is a matter of conjecture at what level of tax it "kicks in". The Scandinavian countries have higher tax rates and i dont see the populations heading for the door.

It is also stated that the wider the gap between the rich and poor leads to an unhappy society.

SWC

It appears your position is to shield the rich from the pain which is to be felt by the poor, fair enough.

Wordfactory

The poor will be hit hard why should the rich escape scot free. If you are one of the rich why do you think it is ok for the Tories to screw the poor and not you.

NG2

Not a socialist at all just someone with a social conscience. Unlike most Tories.

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delurking · 01/03/2011 23:40

Long time lurker but newwave makes me so angry i've actually bothered to sign up!

newwave: why do you hate people who have worked hard to be successful? why do you want to tax such people until their pips squeak? why is it "nice" to see them feel pain?

from a previous threadwww.mumsnet.com/Talk/politics/1140355-Gideons-trust-fund/AllOnOnePage#23578604 you said
"I inherited a very large sum from my paternal Grandparents which allowed me ... to move to a far better property in the home counties without another mortgage"
"My Children will inherit both our home and my Mothers home as she has no other Grandchildren".
"My two sons will inherit two properties mine and their Grand Parents as well as a large amount of cash. The total at today's estimate would be about £900,000 to £1.1 million"

So it's just fine for you to sit in you nice big house with no mortgage due to having wealthy relations in the safe knowledge your children get a nice fat inheritance each.

But exactly how do those of us from poor backgrounds (with no inheritance) achieve the same level of affluence that you were given on a plate? On another thread you implied that anybody earning over £100k was greedy. Exactly would a poor person afford to buy a nice big house in the home countries without a mortgage if they can't earn more than £100k? Or should they only be available to those with wealthly relations like you?

Some of us come from poor backgrounds with no inheritance. We still have our raw ability and we can work just as hard as you. Why can't we be aspire to your standard of living?

You are nothing more than another bloody champagne socialist. You believe that the "unwashed poor" need your guidance, intelligence, morality to achieve a decent lives. Just as long as they can't afford to buy a house next door to you!

Well I don't want your help at all. I just want to stand on my own two feet. If i do better than other people, I want to have a better life and enjoy the fruits of my labour. If i fuck it up then I will have a shit life. That's just fine.

What I don't want is to be successful and then have to pay it all back to a nanny state that like you thinks it knows how to run my life better than me.

delurking · 01/03/2011 23:42

newwave: You are clearly a genuinely nasty piece of work or just very misguided. I hope it's the latter.

QueenBathsheba · 01/03/2011 23:47

Working class people deriding socialism and glorifying Thatcherism, must have read too much of the Sun newpaper.

Original poster
newwave · 02/03/2011 00:07

delurking

May I suggest you read my post rather more carfully OR if you have stop taking parts out of context.

I have NEVER denied I am both quite well off and very lucky.

You will I hope see that I will not make any "dodgy" arrangements to avoid inheritance tax.

I have always said I would be happy to pay more tax as I can well afford to.

I have no problem who my neighbours are, I was born in Londons East End so I come from a working class background.

This sounds like boasting but it is not and I have never posted this before but as I have a good living I have standing orders with two charities for £200 per month (NSPCC & OXFAM) so I try to do my bit.

I hope you do well but some will fall by the wayside and they need societys help and those of us who are in a good position should be willing to pay a bit more into "the pot" to help them and not go in for tax avoidance and offshore trust funds to avoid paying our fair share.

The "nice" is in relation to the fact that the poor and vulnerable are going to be screwed by the Tories and it would be nice to see the rich share the pain, after all we are all in this together.

If that makes me a bad person so be it

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Original poster
newwave · 02/03/2011 00:17

PS, "Squeasing the pips"

Bob Diamond will get an £8 million pound bonus, if he paid £7 million in tax on it then 318 people on £22k would be able to keep their jobs.

Diamond is on £1.2 million basic so with a million bonus he will be on £2.2 million is that not enough for anyone?

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Original poster
newwave · 02/03/2011 00:37

PPS

On another thread you implied that anybody earning over £100k was greedy

Read it again, I called those wanting in excess of one (or was it two) million a year greedy shits and I did add a caveat regarding those who start businesses that employ people.

Some of us come from poor backgrounds with no inheritance. We still have our raw ability and we can work just as hard as you. Why can't we be aspire to your standard of living

Where have I said you cant or should not

newwave: why do you hate people who have worked hard to be successful

I dont but what about those like the Millibands or Gideon or Call me Dave who did nothing to "earn" their money and did everything they could to avoid paying tax on their inheritances.

Sugar, Branson etc good luck to them as long as they pay a fair rate of tax.

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Original poster
newwave · 02/03/2011 00:49

delurker

My apologies for keep on adding to this.

I dont have weathy relations as such but I do have a Mum (82) who owns her own home which she will leave to my two sons. This is the same as happened with my Grandmother who left her home to myself and a cousin.

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wordfactory · 02/03/2011 09:34

newave at no point did I say 'the rich should get away scot free.'

I said quite clearly that I realise I must pay my taxes.

Indeed it has been far from scot free...DH and I now don't have a personal allowance between us and pay 50% on a large part of our income.

That is a huge increase.

If you think this is necessary as part of the defict reduction than I can accept that. But if you think this is the right course of action to punish me for being successful at what I do, then that is beyond me.

How does that make you happy? Seriously. I'm at a loss to understand that mentality.

TheCoalitionNeedsYou · 02/03/2011 14:00

Bob Diamond will already pay about £4 million tax on that £8 million. So if you taxed him 7/8 of his bonus that would be 68 people on 22k you can keep on (it very roughly costs someones salary to employ them, so someone on 22k costs about 44k)

If he gets pissed off with this and goes non-dom you would lose the 4 million losing funding for 91 people.

Niceguy2 · 02/03/2011 14:13

I wouldn't bother. Newwave is just as someone rightly put above, a champagne socialist. He's all for taxing the rich to give to the poor. Just as long as its not him who has to pay.