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Original poster

vicar says no...

30 replies

HerHonesty · 07/07/2010 14:39

have just had my daughter "turned down" to be baptised by vicar on account of me not being baptised, and husband not attending church regularly.

to give some background, i attend church regularly, consider myself in spirt and in my heart to be a christian. My background is multifaith, but my family has always told me it what your believe and follow in your heart to be more important than the outward badge/manifestation of your faith. it is for this reason i have chosen not to be baptised, but I wanted something different for my daughter.

i am so frustrated! or am i unreasonable, in asking church to "stretch the rules"?

i

OP posts:
SandyBits · 07/07/2010 14:40

Asking the church to stretch the rules??
Err, yes, yabu. You should be able to get yourself baptised at the smae time I would think, which might be a nice thing to do.

Original poster
HerHonesty · 07/07/2010 14:41

sorry should have written my famiy has always taught methat what its what you believe..

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SandyBits · 07/07/2010 14:43

When you say your background is multifaith what do you mean? I have a friend who, in the 6 years I've known her, has decided she is no less than 3 religions , throwing herself into each one completely before moving onto the next.

ZZZenAgain · 07/07/2010 14:54

if you attend church regularly and would like your dd to be baptised,I cannot see why you are so dead against being baptised yourself.

If you are a Christian, why not be baptised? If you are not a Christian or not primarily a Christian, why is the baptism of your dd so important to you? I am trying to see it from the vicar's point of view you see. It seems a bit murky somehow.

I cannot help thinking you cannot really be a practising Christian and, at the same time, say a Hindu. You would need to be one or the other, even if you liked, enjoyed and respected the other traditions IYSWIM. I suppose you could consider yourself both a Christian and a Buddhist but ohterwise I don't really see how that works being multi-faith.

ZZZenAgain · 07/07/2010 14:57

I do think though if you attend church regularly and your dh does not but is a baptised Christian with a bit of good-will, the vicar should be able to help you organise a baptism for your dd.

scurryfunge · 07/07/2010 14:59

Find another church

Original poster
HerHonesty · 07/07/2010 14:59

multi faith - catholic mother, muslim father. complicated. as a child i taught the significant teachings of both faiths, but regularly attended c of e church via school since the age of 9, so i dont practice any other faith. I consider myself a practicing christian, my husband and i were married in the church with full knowledge of my status.

nb i didnt literally ask the church to stretch the rules as such, i just asked for my daughter to be baptised.

OP posts:
Tummum · 07/07/2010 15:00

My understanding of CoE rules is that no-onw can be turned down for Baptism. Might be different for different 'sorts' of Church

ZZZenAgain · 07/07/2010 15:01

call and ask for an appointment to talk it through with the vicar?

ZZZenAgain · 07/07/2010 15:02

seems kind of strange that it was ok to have a church wedding but not ok to have your child baptised

Original poster
HerHonesty · 07/07/2010 15:04

zzzeennn this is after a three meetings...

OP posts:
ZZZenAgain · 07/07/2010 15:06

three meetings

not looking good then. So what did the vicar say, why not?

ZZZenAgain · 07/07/2010 15:06

I mean why is it imp that you are baptised or that dh attends church? What reasoning did he give you - or she?

Original poster
HerHonesty · 07/07/2010 15:12

well we left it and left it until today when he basically started saying things like unprofessional, my reputation, dont understand your heart... so then i said "so would you prefer not to christen her" and he said yes.

so now we are scheduled for a thanksgiving which i am seriously having doubts about as i really dont feel i can be part of this community.

OP posts:
FakePlasticTrees · 07/07/2010 15:19

do you live in the parish for this church? Are you on the church electoral roll? We had to join the electoral roll for our church so DS could be baptised there, and I'm not sure if you can join the church roll if you're not baptised.

I really don't understand why you would want your child baptised but not want it for yourself?

Could you have a service of thanksgiving for your DD? That's quite popular in our church (CofE - quite low church) with people who'd rather welcome their child into the church family but not make the faith decision for them - their DC's then have adult baptisms later if they want to join the church, normally around 16 or so.

Also, is that church attached to a good state faith school? Vicars at such churches tend to be a bit more sensitive if they think you're just going through the motions to get a place in a good school...

ZZZenAgain · 07/07/2010 15:22

ok that he doesn't understand your heart - I follow. Unprofessional, his reputation - not so keen on this.

Do you feel that being baptised is in some way a rejection of your father since he was Muslim. Is it that whi ch makes it difficult for you?

FakePlasticTrees · 07/07/2010 15:24

oh, x post re thanksgiving service.

They are really lovely and do give your DD the chance to make up her own mind.

And they can turn you down if you don't meet the criteria - main one being on the church electoral roll, most people who had a CofE or associated church christening and live in the parish can just fill out a form and join, but if you don't meet the requirements to be on the roll, it's hard for the vicar to get your DC christened without them having to do a lot of paperwork on your behalf (and I guess he thinks it's not worth it if you're not prepared to join the church yourself).

Original poster
HerHonesty · 07/07/2010 15:25

No, its not attached to a school. yes we live in the parish.

OP posts:
Original poster
HerHonesty · 07/07/2010 15:30

zzenn i think its possibly about the rejection of all other faiths, not just muslims and tbh he did say some pretty awful things about islam, but thats by the by.

isnt it more important to live your life as a christian every single day then turn up to church events (which i do anyway?)

OP posts:
loopyloops · 07/07/2010 15:31

C of E definitely have a policy of christening any child. We had a thanksgiving and it was lovely, but just contact a different (less judgmental) vicar, who won't have a problem with it. one of the faqs here confirms this

AMumInScotland · 07/07/2010 16:18

Unless the rules have changed very recently, a CofE church has to baptise any child who lives in the parish, although they are allowed to delay it for "preparation". I know of a small number of CofE vicars who stretch the idea of "preparation" to include anything which they feel ought to be done first - I'd guess this is what your vicar is perhaps doing in requiring you to be baptised first. I met one long ago who decided that the necessary preparation incuded the parents getting married!

But like others I don't really understand why you would feel it is important for your dd to be baptised, when you don't want the same thing for yourself. If you feel baptism is important enough to "do it" to a child who hasn't expressed an interest either way, then why not also do it yourself when you count yourself as a Christian? Not meaning to be shirty, and I don't have a problem with baptising small children, but I don't see why someone would want it for their child but not themself.

wisteriawoman · 07/07/2010 21:04

Can you take this up with the local bishop? Ask the vicar for a written explanation of why your dd can't be baptised at the moment. (I'm not conversant with C of E rules and regulations but your vicar's behaviour seems to be appalling on the face of it).

You could go and join the local Baptist church as they don't baptise kids they just do adult baptisms which are wonderful. (I'm not a Baptist but I witnessed an adult baptism recently and found it v moving hearing the testimonies) Our local baptist church is wonderful for all the things it does in the local community - I'm not a member of it- but I happily support their activities. My DD loves their Powerpack group for young kids.

Original poster
HerHonesty · 07/07/2010 22:30

I'm not really interested in fighting, just really disapointed.

OP posts:
MaryBS · 08/07/2010 10:42

I think your heart is still saying baptism - so I don't think a Thanksgiving is going to work for you. Will you really be able to feel thankful, given what you've told us?

Am also a bit about him dissing the Muslim faith.

busymummy3 · 10/07/2010 23:46

Am a little confused as thought you had to be baptised before you could be married in church?