If God exists, why all the suffering and evil in the world?

[MexicanMarissa]

Hello :-)

I believe in God and am thinking about returning to church, but if God really exists why all the suffering and svil in the world such as the tsunami, poverty, murder and rape?

[monkeytrousers]

Ruty!

[bloss]

Message withdrawn

[HappyHuggy]

wheres god when so many innocent people can die?



Helping the living and welcoming those who pass over


maybe?

[ruty]

but Bloss if the devil works thru lies and deception, he does work thru people who lust after power and money above all things, and all the evils in the world - Darfur, Mugabe, and many situations controlled by Western leaders are controlled by the lust for power and money.

[ruty]

the terrorists also lust after power.

[swiperfox]

I admittedly havent read this whole thread but in response to the question.... After 9/11, I had a christian lady come to the door and gave dd some books etc and then 'discussed' the same question with me.

She actually told me was the reason that all these things are happening is because we haven't looked after God's Earth there fore basically he isn't looking after us!!

Charming!!

[HappyDaddy]

Because God gave us free will. It is men who have caused all of the suffering in this world, not God.

[ruty]

a lot of us have said that Happydaddy

[HappyDaddy]

I was a bit late, sorry.

[ruty]

i shouldn't be speaking for other people anyway - what i meant was i agree with you!

[Spongebob]

Off the trail a bit I know...but you know what I find weird? Talking about God and the Devil etc. It sometimes strikes me that bad things (especially natural disasters) always seem to be just before Christmas, or, in the case of the Tsunami, at Christmastime...and the earthquake in the same region, at Easter time. "Two fingers up" at Jesus from the Devil?

[HappyDaddy]

Spongebob, there's a theory that talking or thinking about the devil actually invokes his wrath.

[SenoraPostrophe]

not all christians celebrate christmas on the 25th dec, y'know.

[HappyDaddy]

Wasn't Jesus actually born in September?

[Papillon]

Whether God exists, or not, the concept or truth of God is that he/she/it tends for the most part to be a separate reality / entity - so our management of suffering and evil is our own responsibility.

To feel Love and all the feel good words associated, we must feel Pain. How could one truely recognise joy if we did not have sadness? Its a benchmark of Life. Suffering is part of our emotional makeup. Evil is ideology, it is ignorance and rejection of anybody elses opinion, and judgements of such kind breed hatred.

God and Satan are reflections of our existence, a reality to mystically - spiritually seek answers. Their reflections have frequently been used to control and organise the Life of the masses. They are signposts for Love and Hate - we gave them names.

Whether God and Satan need not work through us directly or remotely is obviously a varying perspective in the Christian point of view. As this is the case as we are unsure of how they associate with us, how can we be actually certain of their existence? We can feel their manifested truths in our emotional selves, and through the works of humans - but not their actual forms.

Thats why I prefer to seek through Lifes Ways and not under the protected imagery that the bible and religion offers in the name of God. Rather than seek answers, is it not better to spend the time seeking truths in every spiritual avenue and realisation that One ideology/religion can create suffering and evil?

I would find the judgement of myself upon death ( a life review ) far worse than being sectioned off to heaven or hell. If God exists, how can he accept Christians like George Bush who commit terrorism, or send countless people off to control and subdue others in the name of Peace. or whatever glibe terms his press secretaries make up?

[Papillon]

No HappyDaddy that was me that was born in September - astonishing I know

[HappyDaddy]

Ahh, I always get you and Jesus confused.

I was born in september too.

How do we know that God will accept Bush into heaven? Only God knows that.

[ruty]

Just because someone calls themself a Christian Papillon doesn't mean an automatic free entry into heaven.

[Papillon]

He surely thinks he is a good Christian though... I mean born again is quite an active relationship Christian. Its another area I find very grey. As (some) Christians judge each other in their relationship with God / entry to heaven status. I quite regularly heard Pentecostal Christians say that ´those Anglicans are real Christians and are in for a huge shock´etc. Apparently God is wiser to these things than us humans, and just knows these things when admitting a believer.

You can see why they did not warm to me at Alpha

[ruty]

yes Papillon, sometimes i think heaven [if i was lucky enough to go there] would be a terrifying place if full of Charismatic Evangelicals! sorry, not meaning to be offensive, just joking. Anyway, its not for any of us to judge. And just because someone thinks they are a good Christian has absolutely nothing to do with it.

[bloss]

Message withdrawn

[Papillon]

ah thought I would see you here today Bloss, given that GF is on the thread menu today. Its the other place I saw you use the term ´narrow-minded´! Are you baying for my blood

I used George as an example. Whilst you like to only consider whether you will get into heaven, I also you might notice referrred to people of other Christian denominations using their own faith as a benchmark for the entry of others. So not all people just look to themselves and I was exploring the idea within the realm of God and Satan in the questions and ideas I posted on Sunday, 10 July, 2005 9:33:47 PM.

Its not biblically orientated, but experiences my eyes and ears have seen Christians judge others and wonderment at how many people have to die to gain ´peace´ in the War against Terror.

You apparently know me or life well enought to judge me either naive or narrow-minded!! But then again we are more than Chalk and Cheese.

I was thinking of posting today something else today, will do it in my next post rather than in this one though!

[Papillon]

I want to thank you ALL very much for talking with me over the months about your spiritual and religious views. I do enjoy to ponder all things spiritual and so thanks for welcoming me in Christian discussions with open arms

Given that new moderators have been assigned by MN it makes me proud that the Spiritual board is 99.9% of the time such a peaceful place to visit. When the board first started people were worried we would all fight like cat and dog. I am glad (so far!!) that it has been the opposite.

Looking forward to more conversations of all things spiritual

Blessings

[bloss]

Message withdrawn

[Papillon]

why am I not suprised at that excuse of non-comprehension! Sounds familiar and abit smarmy tbh. Perhaps a spiritual blockage which one day might be clearer to you