Ideas for debate with my father needed please re: Witches

[TricknTreatinHairyToedHobbit]

In relation to this argument here the Christian replying seems to hold exactly the same view as my Dad. I came across this while researching answers and thought it would save me the time trying to explain his views.

The context of our heated row lively discussion is that while attempting to solve a crossword clue my Dad started on about an incident many years ago when a Witches' coven was discovered in a local village. My father insists that the Witches were "praying" for the break-up of the local Christian's marriages.

My view was that if this was actually happening (which I doubted) then the "coven" were not Witches. Anyway I hope I'm right and I'm hoping to be able to give a better argument next time although I don't think I'll ever win one on religion

My background is that after being brought up being (IMVPO) brainwashed by two evangelical Christian parents, I have spent the past 20+ years questioning everything. I have a fascination for other people's beliefs and why they believe what they do.

I won't expect any replies tonight but had a spare couple of hours when I couldn't sleep and this has been bugging me for a while and could well come up again this week as it is a bit topical.

Bloss: I think you would have a hard time proving that more people were killed by atheist organisations (I presume you mean Stalinism and Maoism: if you are gonig to suggest Hitler than check your facts as he was not an atheist: qite the reverse) than religious ones.

ANd you're right, we don't know where the OP's dad got his idea about evil wiccans trying to mess with good christians' marriages from (local newspaper possibly - most local papers make the Daily Mail look like Liberal Pervert Heathen Xtra). But he sounds entirely closed-minded, so the OP is not going to get anywhere giving him facts and probably just needs to choose between telling him not to talk bollocks and saying that they'd better agree to differ on the subject.

atheist mass-murderers don't tend to murder in the name of atheism though...

Bloss, the fact that fanatical religions can cause trouble for ordinary people IS a cause for concern. That there are other dangers in the world is beside the point. Should we not disapprove of dangerous driving because terrorists exist? I'm capable of being concerned about more than one thing at a time.

Message withdrawn

Right, I'm back now from a few hours of RL and very surprised to see all these posts.

Those of you who say I should avoid the subject, you are right. However, the only way to do that is either avoid my dad completely or argue about something else instead. If it's not religion, it's another subject that he knows will push my buttons. He gets a kick out of arguing and I seem to be the only one who bites. I probably should have posted in AIBU or Relationships instead but I am genuinely interested in this subject so it's here.

The thing is, I really do need to learn to debate more effectively rather than ending up shouting something like Feck Off out of sheer bloody frustration.

Message withdrawn

The basis of the Contender Ministries' argument is that they believe the pagan's are tapping into a supernatural power. (And therefore, by their lights, since that power isn't the Christian God, the only alternative they believe in is the Christian Devil.)

A counter argument would be that pagans have no more power to influence reality by thinking at it than a young child does who wishes upon a star or who claps her hands to stop the faries in the pantomime dying.

Avena et al. Lots of myths here.

NO midwives were burnt in England. None. In fact, no-one was burnt in England for witchcraft. Ever. Witches were hanged. In Scotland they were strangled and then the bodies were burnt. Grisly, but that was the era.

Midwives were ont eh side of the accusers, mostly.

There's really no trace of a link between those thus very unjustly persecuted (who were mostly poor and elderly) and paganism.

PLenty of pagans also believed in malificium (malice through sorcery) and people were executed for it before Christianity.