Do Christians on here feel that state Church schools should be scrapped?

[nolongeraworriedmummy]

Ok this is a thread about a thread really but I just wondered what Christians thought, to me being a Christian is about living everyday as a Christian but have just read a post on another thread that says if I want Christian ethos and morals for my child I should give them a bible at night and take them to church on Sunday and they shouldnt be allowed to have daily prayers and religious assemblies as there is no place in school for that basically,

What do you think?

sorry I didnt make myself clear as to the point of the post, do you as Christians feel that Church schools cause divisions from the rest of the community and do you think they are a bad thing?

My DS's both attend Christian State schools (infant and junior).

I'm not entirely convinced (unless there's a ridiculous "criteria" for getting in - which ours doesn't have.......well the Junior school you won't get into unless your child is at the infant as it's the only feeder school lol) that it creates a divide.

The infant school is very clear that is a Christian school and therefore prayers etc will be par for the course.

However DS2 just this week had a parent come into school to tell them all about Diwali (sp) (had to be this week as they're on half term next week when it actually is) as being Hindu's they were able to bring a personal perspective to it. I noticed at the Harvest Service in the church the parent (and I presume her DH?) were there.

No, but I think unchurched children should have priority for places.

Yep also have the same experience, ours celebrate Diwali and Eid also.

Theres lots of talk on the other thread thats all about it causing divisions because none churched children cant get in, but of all the school schools that I have worked in or dd has gone to I dont see that happening at all, I see a complete mix, dds well achieveing school in a big and heavy populated town and I can only think of 2 children from the 30 that are church attenders.

I think they should be scrapped, and there should be a complete separation of church and state.

There are a number of issues as I see it -

children not getting into their local school because they are not churchgoers

parens having to accept a Christian ethos if they want their child to go to the local (in some cases only) school

Up here in Scotland the issues are different, because the only "church" schools are Roman Catholic, and in some places that feeds the whole sectarian issue, whereas mixing children throughout their education would at least improve understanding.

Actually what really irritates me are the "christian" schools that don't actually teach their christian beliefs. I also think that church schools that are 90 odd % funded by the LEA should have to prioritise local chidren, if its a school heavily funded by a church that it should be able to have some say in the selection criteria.

I really haven't thought out all the pros & cons tbh but people who send their children through choice (it's not always a choice ie only school in the village/locally) should not then moan about the school making a big thing out them practising christianity and down playing pagan events etc.

I think that Christian or Muslim or Jewish schools can cause divison, theoretically.

We sent DS to a Catholic school, not primarily because it was Catholic, but once he was there DH decided he would like to start attending mass again, and DS has since been baptised. I see this should as a success of a faith school; if DS had not been offered a place because he had not been baptised the church would have been a little emptier on Sunday mornings.

Maybe faith shcools should be offering places to the faithless and lapsed first??

I find the whole concept of state faith schools a little odd to be honest. Private faith schools I can completely understand.

I shudder a little at that word "unchurched".

AMum - the criteria for our infant school goes

1. Children in care (or whatever the term is these days)
2. Children with special needs
3. Siblings of children at the school, or the linked Junior school.
4. Those in the catchment area
5. Anyone else

Next year 1/2 of the places that are available will be taken by siblings

Thats an interesting post Lynette

I actually wanted dd to go to a private faith school and emailed three for an application form and not one replied

Yes I think Church schools should be scrapped (I am a Christian btw) mainly because the admissions system is unfair and increases social division rather than promoting equality. Dh is a minister of religion and feels even more strongly than I do about it.

But I do think there is a place in schools for Christian religion. My boys attend 'community' primary and secondary schools but there is a strong Christian ethos. I work in a secondary school where Christianity and/or religious values are not mentioned ever, except in RE lessons, and I think there is a yawning chasm, a void waiting to be filled.

Personally, I like faith schools if they are set up to be gentle, understanding, compassionate and respectful of all, but with a strong belief in their values. I think there was research that showed that children brought up to believe in one faith (whichever one) fared better than those who were brought up to believe that anything could be equally 'right'. Perhaps there's a wisdom to promoting one set of ideas in a respectful way, then letting children explore more when they are ready to do so?

Who brings up their children to think that everything is right - that is ridiculous.

I would be more than happy in a none church school with a Christian ethos.

Perhaps there's a wisdom to promoting one set of ideas in a respectful way>> suppose the set of ideas was witchcraft or islam though?

onager, my daughter attended a school with a muslim ethos as most of the children and staff where muslim. They still taught her morals, self respect and self discipline which is all I ask.

I am a Christian. My kids attend a faith school- not through choice, we moved here mid term so were allocated the local- a faith school.

I wouldn't have a problem if they ahd a Christian ethos but were inclusive but they are not; admission allows catchment kids first option regardless of faith which I think is great, but there is still very real ways they can alienate poeple- cost of uniform from strange little shop; discouraging kids with SN; anything like that.

I also dislike the teaching attitued. There are a few non_christioan kids there (as there should be, catchment kids in a state funded school) but the school refuses to teach about other faiths. This is not through alck of knowledge- becuase I have a relevant degree an my offer to support was turned down flat with a big fat no. They teach Christianity an Judaism because 'the alw says we cover 2 faiths, and for Judaism we just do the OT' .

Goodness how the 2 Muslim famillies feel- do they feel welcome at their local school I wonder? And I know the Juniors now has a Buddhist family as well, again catchment, doubt that is covered either.

The argument is that they shouldn't be 'peddling' other faiths and it is one big topic my evangelist friend (a Governor) will never agree on becuase I truly beleive teahing understanding is not the same as peddling other faiths! If learning about other faiths converts people then how come I am not seriously confused as I covered 8 in my studies!

DS1 (almost 9) didn't know what Ramadan or Eid was despite having a Muslim friend; and he brought home pictures of Ganesha but the school ahd just said it was 'an Indian picture' no explanation whatsoever. What on earth is that about?

Sorry- rant over! Bit of a pet topic of mine .

I wouldn;'t have an issue with a school that taught all faiths but advertised itself as holding Christian / Muslim / Jewish etc worship; it's this all-else-is-ot-worth-acknowledging crap that gets my goat

Interesting thread nolongerworried! I had considered starting a thread asking 'so what are the arguments for state-funded faith schools?' but not sure I need to now!

Yes, I think there should be entire separation of church and state and find church schools divisive and all the reasons scottishmummy said

At finding herself in agreement with UnquietDad, I hate the term "unchurched" too.

I'm RC and believe that religion and the state should be separate. I don't think the state should interfere with or have any interest in an individual's religious beliefs or practices. For me, that carries through to the education that is provided by the state.

I think it's the school's job to provide an academic education and the parent's job to provide a moral/religious education.

I hate the thought of creationism being taught in biology lessons! (Is this actually happening or is it just an urban myth?)

I also struggle to see any logic in a school selecting pupils, not on academic aptitude or any other talent or ability, but on the religion of their parents.

On the other hand, the local RC primary is easily the best primary in the area and when it comes time to get DD into school, I expect my desire for her to actually have an education will end up outweighing my principles...

What is wrong with 'unchurched'?

'I hate the thought of creationism being taught in biology lessons! (Is this actually happening or is it just an urban myth?)'

Not biology, but my 6 year old last year told me I was wrong for beleiving in evolution because his teacher had said

Funnily enough, kids ask about Creation when you are trying to teach them the origins of the Earth or evolution. It is something they are thinking about and want to know more about.

My teaching philosophy is that it is as much about building relationships as it is imparting knowledge. If kids want to know something, I tend to stop and address these needs.

i dont think that they are a bad thing. but i am quite happy to sugest that as a whole we should have a one tier education system. ergo church schools should be scrapped.