Speaking in tongues in church?

[kiltedsheep]

Hello all 👋

Am just wondering whether any of you have had any experience of speaking in tongues, or whether you've witnessed anyone else having that experience. What happened and how did you feel about it?

Personally, I'm not even sure what 'speaking in tongues' means. In Acts 2, the apostles are said to have been filled with the Holy Spirit 'and began to speak in other languages'. But surely nobody's suggesting that people who speak in tongues today are suddenly fluent in a language which they previously didn't know, but in which they can suddenly communicate to other native speakers of that language?

Or is that a total misunderstanding? Grateful for your thoughts!

(Am also interested in similar experiences in non-Christian contexts, too.)

So sad that you were scolded for not speaking in tongues, @canijoinin. I have no words, really... I think it comes back to what I was saying earlier about some people simply desiring power over others, and actually forgetting what it is Jesus said and the early church learned about this kind of thing. I'm so sorry you felt ostracised and left out.

I think you're right about the showmanship thing - in any setting like that I feel immensely uncomfortable and 'wrong'. At places like NW these days there really isn't anything of that, pressure, dramatizing, even much mentioning of it, and people still fall down and shake etc without the hype, which is much more authentic to me. My one experience of falling wasn't one of being pushed at all, in fact, no one was there 'laying hands' at all, it was just God, and a bit like picklemepopcorn says, it was like the greatest sense of utter relaxing, like my body was wrapped in the softest of duvets, really weird but really, really beautiful.

Paul told the Corinthians off for this showmanship mentality. He said people who came into the church would think they were 'out of their minds' - just as you say, @bluecloudyskies! - so advised them to keep it between themselves and God unless an interpretation was present for the edifying of the church. Therefore, I find any ostentatious displays feel wrong and odd and basically cringeworthy, to be honest. But singing together at a massive gathering where some sing in tongues and some in English/whatever other language is actually a profound experience and different to this more 'out there' way of doing things which really does make people feel a/ uncomfortable and b/ left out.

Perhaps churches should be giving some better quality teaching on it. Some do, many avoid it, funnily enough. After all, we do look like a bunch of nutters. But so did the apostles, so we're in good company

I was desperately hoping, if I was touched in the same way, it meant that I was as righteous, loved and accepted as everyone else there but at the time, I felt that my past sins must have put up a barrier between me and Jesus and I felt like a fraud and I should take the hint.

That's so sad. My experience of God is that God touches lives in so many, many different ways, and there really isn't a 'one size fits all' formula to it. If there was, this would narrow God, and we humans are so diverse, so why would God restrict the way God works to one way which works for some people in a certain time and a certain place? You are as loved and accepted as everyone else - that's the beautiful and unprecedented thing about grace. But God will never force something which is not right for someone at that time. I don't think there is such a thing as an 'un spirit-filled' Christian...

Must go. Have two deadlines and keep on procrastinating.

To be honest these kind of churches are very brainwashing and they seem to get the most vulnerable. Speaking tongues is rubbish and very deceving. The word of God is silence in the nature sense. More calming to mind and body.than talking gibberish and probably coming from more dark sources

For those seeking a connection with God who are unable to embrace the whole speaking in tongues thing, there may be solace to be found in these words from 1 John:

My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth.

And then there are the words of Rumi the Islamic poet to contemplate too ...

Another shout out for bullshit here too.

To be honest these kind of churches are very brainwashing and they seem to get the most vulnerable.

^
Agree.

When I was 15 me and my mate went to a 'church' like that. We left early to go to the pub, me and my pal felt uneasy and slightly like prey.

Few years later it turned out the minister or whatever he claimed to be was a pedophile.

Bullet dodged.

Both churches I attended believed in the gifts of the spirit (as set out in 1 Cor 12), and so I've heard people speaking in tongues to themselves whilst praying, singing in tongues, people speaking a word in tongues for the church and then you have to be quiet and wait for the interpretation.
I've also been to Spring Harvest / New Wine / Soul Survivor and seen it there - along with poeple being prayed for and dropping to the floor. It happened to me once when the person I was praying for went over like a felled tree. I had an overwhelming sense of something I should pray and did, and over he went. It was slightly unnerving.

My understanding of tongues is that it's what happens when our feeling / love for God becomes so inexpressible to our congitive brain, that our hearts sort of take over and talk to God direct, bypassing our understanding. Having experienced that sort of feeling, but not ever spoken in tongues, I can make sense of that.
None of the many people I've known who speak in tongues would strike me as being mentally ill or disturbed in any way - perhaps it's just one of those unexplainable things that can happen to us at times.

If you read the bit in 1 Cor about the gifts of the spirit, it does say that God gives to each as He sees fit, so not everyone will be able to speak in tongues (or prophesy, or heal, etc), but I do think there's an element of 'spiritual one-upmanship' at times in churches, where you're seen as a not mature enough, or not 'good' enough Christian if you don't speak it. It would depend on the church you go to, of course, but the ones I've experienced have been guilty of this at times, I think.

I also think in a very small minority of people there is a show off element to it as well, but I think that's more about them as people than anything else. Most of the people I know wouldn't do it to show off, or prove something.

That's a good description, catinabeanbag. And I do agree that there will always be those who want to be seen and think they are in some way better than others. Jesus, and Paul, would have very short thrift...

I don't think it's fair to say churches like these are brainwashing. It's a bit generalizing. I've had a really negative experience in a high traditional church but wouldn't label all such as bad because of it I do realise some are, though, and it sickens me when I hear tales of control and negativity in the church at all.

Harvester and outwith, I agree God can be found in silence and nature. In beautiful ways. But God is so much wider, and these things can mean that we can express our deepest emotions in words at times. It's a powerful and strengthening thing. I never like to narrow God down

It’s interesting that the practice of speaking in tongues is not unique to Christianity. It crops up in a lot of religions but, perhaps surprisingly, there’s no tradition of it within Judaism.

I would hazard a guess that such an activity would have seemed strange to Jesus had he witnessed it, given that he was a devout Jew. (I realise this is probably a controversial viewpoint!)

The only mention I could find of the practice in the Gospels is at the end of the Gospel of Mark where Jesus is reported as saying:

He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues ;

But this passage, which appears at the end of the gospel, isn’t present in the earliest copies of Mark available. Most scholars regard the text containing the quoted lines as a later addition rather than an authentic part of the original. A motive for attributing such words to Jesus could be to bring Mark into line with the Christology that developed later.

In contrast, there’s a lot about speaking in tongues in the Pauline epistles/Acts. As a Hellenistic Jew, Paul wouldn’t have found the idea so odd – the practice of speaking in tongues features in earlier Greco-Roman writings.

In short, I think the practice was a part of gentile Christianity that developed after the death of Jesus rather than being something he advocated personally.

I don't think it's necessarily something Jesus would have had to advocate personally. He didn't talk about other gifts of the Spirit much, either - but he was always interested in behaviour and motivation. The gifts came later when he'd left - the day of Pentecost is a very very early tradition, so these things were happening straight away, before Paul's conversion. He obviously developed the theology along finer lines, but from a starting point of something which happened in the church among the apostles, who were still around to tell him about it (or tell him he was talking rubbish)

I never like to narrow God down

Sorry, don't wish to disregard, I started going to church in 1982 and heard this sentiment trotted out week in week out repeatedly up until I left.

I'm still not sure what it actually even means? If anything. I'm trying to imagine what it would mean if we said it about another person. 'I don't put Geoff in a box, he likes to surprise me, he likes to take me outside of what I thought.' It just makes Geoff sound like a colossal manchild who think he's 'off grid' for growing some cress on his windowsill.

In all honesty I've never heard someone claim some god meddling that was actually remotely outside of what you'd expect him to be meddling with. It's not like he doused you in whale blood while you were putting your bin out, or you came home and found he'd filled your house with cauliflowers?

Sorry but it sounds tired and meaningless. Unless you'd care to share something like the above. Usually it's a recount of the time god used a tramp to cheer you up or a similarly very unremarkable 'in the box' event.

*sound like a colossal manchild who think he's 'off grid' for growing some cress on his windowsill.
t's not like he doused you in whale blood while you were putting your bin out, or you came home and found he'd filled your house with cauliflowers? *

lol

You have made me splutter my tea.

Headinhands, i love your expressiveness! However, an awful lot of people seem to want to 'narrow God down'. I agree, God by nature God can't be narrowed. He doesn't cast out unmarried mothers, people with tattoos who like loud music, or even snobs (though I bet he's tempted!). Lots of people try and claim he does, though!

So when you say you don't narrow him it just means you think god loves, or should love unmarried mums etc? So it's actually about YOU not being judgy.

Maybe I've been lucky but for the main most Christians I've known haven't had an issue with those things. (God has though according to the bible, sounds like you're more out the box than he is!)

I think mhd was pretty clear - that God isn't found only in nature, or only in Scripture, or church, or other people but all of these and more. If we think we can define God - we make ourselves God.

So no house filled with cauliflower here.

In the original question, I go to a fairly well attended but middle of the road CofE church and 'speaking in tongues' is not a regular thing at my church. But in my student days I went to a variety of churches and I've been to a couple of conferences and witnessed some real gifts - and some manipulation of people in the name of 'spiritual gifts' as has been described here.

I started to pray in tongues on my knees after I came back to God after a disastrous few years for me personally during which I'd walked away from the church. It was absolutely the Spirit interceding for me. It still happens - but never at a time or place that might make people feel uncomfortable - which is how I can test it as being from God, as it builds up his people - those I am praying with.

If we think we can define God - we make ourselves God.

Utter piffle. You define god all time. Good, merciful, loving, etc. If you hadn't defined him you wouldn't be a Christian. Sorry but this word salad is so infuriating. It's like you're not even listening to yourself and repeating some meaningless deepity.

Thanks, Vanity - I know what you mean about the Spirit interceding. It's like when there simply aren't any words to say, and being able to express something at an even deeper level.

@hih Geoff's not the creator of the universe, though. And my house is too full of courgettes at the moment to countenance God sending me an abundance of cauliflower.

But to your point about narrowing God and it seeming a tired old script to you. As Christians we are talking about the God of the universe, the God of all people and tribe and nations, the God who is far beyond our understanding and yet who desires us to know him. The more I know and love God, the more breadth of God I see and experience. And alongside that, we're trying to counterbalance those people who seek to keep God boxed in; who see God as a means to an end, a justification for poor behaviour, a God in a set of very narrow parameters which allow no movement. We challenge that because that kind of view seems to encourage the more kind of controlling behaviour we can sometimes find in churches. It's a 'God thinks what I think therefore think like me' kind of narrative. So one of the reasons the notion might seem old to you is that it needs to be reiterated, it needs to be shared to challenge and to broaden, to open horizons and bring people further into who God is.

If we like, I could always start a new thread about philosophy of language and attempts to capture God? (Btw am liking 'word salad'. Tasty.)

I think I get what posters below are saying. We obviously ascribe characteristics to God like 'kind' or 'loving' or whatever, but we should be very cautious about confining God to those. But am happy to be corrected.

Anyway, to get back to the OP, thanks to everyone who's posted about their own personal experiences (or just general opinions) re: speaking in tongues. Am sort of hoping that it'll happen this Sunday at the church at which I'm doing a placement - because then I can report back to you all on what I thought!

I was just listening to a summer repeat In Our Time podcast about Margery Kempe, and it occurred to me that I take her account of her visions seriously (and those of Julian of Norwich), so perhaps I shouldn't be so acutely sceptical of (supposedly) present day manifestations of the Holy Spirit.

Easier said than done, though...!

Unless you'd care to share something like the above.

I've got many out of the ordinary stories, hih, but I'm never sure how productive it is sharing them here. I'm not into the whole 'look at this miracle that happened and therefore you should believe' narrative. I'd prefer to engage in gentle respectful conversation. Some of the stories would out me or others, and some are not mine to tell. So I'm not avoiding your challenge - well, at least, I've seen it.

Those small 'inside the box' experiences can be profound and life changing as much as more impressive stories - and are definitely more what we live in the day to day. But I'm not trying to prove anything through them . I often thank God for them, and see something I might not have if I'd not stopped to do that. But that doesn't mean imbuing them with unnecessary meaning.

Am also keen to hear from anyone with similar experiences in other religious contexts. Are there any Sufi Muslims in the house, for example?

It's a good comparison to talk about Julian etc, @kiltedsheep. God's always worked through mystery as much as through reason, through complexity as much as through simplicity. If God's worked in this way in the past, why not now? I understand though that it's difficult to get through the layers of issues posed by people who control and who show off, but it was ever thus. The presence and practice of these people doesn't render the work of the Spirit non existent in the forms we're taking of, it just makes those people a bit annoying at best, abusive at worst. I hope I've communicated it's possible to be active in these gifts without the frippery and the hype, and find them a place of great depths which challenge me in my walk with God and my behaviour to others.

I was taken to a church where this happened as a young teenager
It frightened the life out of me, and did not help my trust of adults
As a result, I would choose to worship at a church where there is a traditional organ played, and avoid anywhere with guitars.
The congregation at the church I attend was split over the use of a projector screen....it was the reformation all over again.

look at this miracle that happened and therefore you should believe' narrative.

No I don't mean miracles. That's very much 'in the box' isn't it. I mean an example of a time god did something outside of the box you had put him in.

I've never been to a Quaker gathering, as I've read they're mostly in silence but I think if anyone feels the urge to stand up and say something this sometimes happens. I've got a feeling it'll be more subdued though. Would be interesting if anyone would like to share accounts of this too.

Interestingly, Quakers were so named because of the shaking that went along with their experience.