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Original poster

Is the Christian God's love unconditional?

902 replies

Woolmark · 20/11/2013 19:57

Ok, some questions which have been playing on my mind, I am genuinely interested.

Surely his love is on the condition that you are a) a Christian and b) follow his rules?

Also, if God loves everyone as much as he does, why can't he save everyone by simply appearing to them? If I could save my children by doing this then I would in an instant, rather than turning up at the end and destroying the ones who weren't Christian.

OP posts:
headinhands · 01/12/2013 12:46

So we're agreed then, there's no difference between Christians and non Christians. We're all doing the best we can with what we have. Personally, I would expect having a hotline to the creator of the world, who was infinitely wise and loving, to make an obvious difference but hey ho.

headinhands · 01/12/2013 12:49

So what qualities are measurable? Where would Mr lifelong average Christian be different to to Mr average lifelong non-Christian in terms of personality etc?

Golddigger · 01/12/2013 12:51

Of course there are difference between Christians and non Chrisitians. Though it can hardly be measured can it?
Doesnt mean that it is not true though.
You must still have Christian friends, do you not? And probably Chrisitian relatives too?

sandfrog · 01/12/2013 12:51

Faith isn't irrational. It's a perfectly reasonable and rational response to the way the world is, and making sense of its meaning.

capsium · 01/12/2013 12:58

I wouldn't say there is no difference head. Just that it is the sort of difference that is best discerned through personal testimony, since we are all different anyway.

Maybe studying a culture that is very different in belief to Christianity would show more marked differences. I have mentioned the Piraha before, trying to fully understand their culture is mind boggling.

Thing is there are similarities across the major religions in this country, even elements of paganism was incorporated into the church here. So much is cultural albeit incorporated into the Biblical in the Christian Church.

However, being unable to judge people's hearts, as humans, is Biblical. So this is not surprising to me.

Italiangreyhound · 01/12/2013 13:33

Sunshine I am so sorry to hear your sad and terrible story of your childhood. I am really pleased that God met you in that cafe through that lady and life turned around. I am just so sorry you had to suffer a childhood like you did and that your father was so cruel.

Back you said ...pope or archbishop! umm now there is an idea?

HiH I love those long bits in Bombay mix.

mad could not agree more with Jesus is unique, and I follow his path because I think it is the only faith where God showed Godself to be so passionate about us that God did something about it; came down among us, in poverty and obscurity, and showed us a way to be reconciled to God that is not through our own efforts. Most other faiths concentrate on being good enough to reach God, and while I would in no way deny that people of faith (and of no faith) can be very good, wonderful, loving people, I would still say that Christianity provides a unique way whereby our own efforts are not the most important thing in the equation. Christians are certainly no better than anyone else and any Christian who believes they are are not grasping the reality of grace.

I'm interested in this discussion of 'spirit' and 'soul' are they two things or two words for one thing? I think in terms of mind, body and spirit/soul - Mind is my thoughts, I might one day find my mid utterly deteriates (sadly I know of people with dementia where the mind is going and it is tragic), body, I am experiencing my own body getting more decrepid! Then there is that other part of me, he part that is eternal, the part that relates to God and is truely me. I would call that my spirit, I am not sure that I would really use the word soul, but if I did it would be to refer to my spirit outside of my earthly body, I believe in heaven we will have a new body and I believe as a Christian my mind is being renewed all the time (best case scenario) but to be honest this is just off the top of my head! So I do wonder what others mean when they use the terms spirit or soul. Thanks. (Bible references welcome too and opinions of any from other faith/no faith. Don't want to derail so PM me if you prefer! Thanks.

Back I thnk a person's mind does maybe become part of their spriti is that makes sense, so the renewed mind does go to heaven, meaybe, not really thought of it! Also, you said interesting that you count 3 parts not 2 as most christians seem to, which 2 do they normally count. Have nto caught up yet so sorry if this is old history!

headinhands · 01/12/2013 13:43

Yes I do have some lovely Christian friends, but I couldn't say that all the Christians I know are loving, and gentle peacemakers and that the non-Christians were hapless, aggressive losers.

Golddigger · 01/12/2013 13:45

Oh gosh no. I couldnt say that either. I dont expect any of us could.

headinhands · 01/12/2013 13:48

Did I mention that I'm regularly in touch with super intelligent aliens who visit me at night and teach me all sorts of wonderful things...

I can't prove it and sadly there's no discernible difference to show for the tuition I receive but it's all true I tell you.

capsium · 01/12/2013 13:54

head What have they taught you?

headinhands · 01/12/2013 14:24

Lots of things, about being kind and they've shown me a deeper understanding of love and they give me advice when I have trouble so I can deal with it better. I don't know what I'd do without them.

headinhands · 01/12/2013 14:26

It's great, all I have to do is leave 10% of my wages under my pillow ;)

capsium · 01/12/2013 14:34

Have they died to save you?

headinhands · 01/12/2013 15:02

You mean like pushing me out the way of a car or something? Not that I know of.

headinhands · 01/12/2013 15:19

Do you mean one of them, or all of them? They wouldn't be talking to me if they were dead would they?

capsium · 01/12/2013 15:24

You tell me head...

Jesus is alive though (in Heaven). He rose again.

headinhands · 01/12/2013 15:32

Can you think of a good reason why I should believe that?

headinhands · 01/12/2013 15:34

You don't know if someone who's dead can talk? I don't think they can. I think death pretty much decimates your conversational skills. That and snooker. Grin

Golddigger · 01/12/2013 15:35

You dont want to believe again head.

Golddigger · 01/12/2013 15:36

Upthread, someone [I dont think it was you] said they like debating. Personally I dont. If everyone all agreed with me, that would suit me fine! Job done!

capsium · 01/12/2013 15:37

It's up to you head. You choose to believe. I've already told you some of the reasons why I do, but I think I always did. From hanging a crucifix over my bed at night at 4yrs old to 'protect me' from evil (had filled my head with some disturbing Grimm and Anderson) and saying the Lord's Prayer when frightened, to now.

headinhands · 01/12/2013 16:01

Belief shouldn't be a choice should it. Could you choose to believe in Allah? If I had good evidence I would have to believe wouldn't I.

headinhands · 01/12/2013 16:02

I think I said I liked debating. But I only like it when I know I'm right. Grin Otherwise I tend to keep schtum or get really stroppy.

headinhands · 01/12/2013 16:03

Yeah but someone transmitted those ideas to you. You'd seen a crucifix. It wasn't something you fashioned out of pipe cleaners having never even heard about Jesus etc.

Golddigger · 01/12/2013 16:07

Belief should always be a choice imo. Otherwise it is like a cult or something.