God was most definitely here this evening

[Zipitydooda]

He answered my prayer. I am so sure.

This sounds a bit crazy but I am on my own with no one I can speak to about it at the moment and I had to write it down.

[hiddenhome]

[Panadbois]

Will you tell us more?

[madhairday]

Please do share more if you like :)

[Zipitydooda]

A close friend of mine had a stillborn baby a year ago at 37 weeks pregnant and is/was 37 weeks pregnant again yesterday when rushed into hospital with bleeding last night. I was looking after her 2 children at the time.
I had heard nothing and was praying that her and the baby were ok. I specifically pictured her having an emergency c-section to get her baby out ok (she was due to have a planned section later in the week).

A few minutes later my eldest called me from his bedroom to say he had made a wish that he could see his clock to see the time (he is on the top bunk and clock was out of his reach facing the wrong way) and straightaway a big breeze had come and blown the blind which had moved something else and turned the clock for him. He said his wish had come true; this conversation is not typical of him. At the same time I got a text from my friends phone saying they were both ok and she was being taken in for emergency section. This was my answer from God.

Still praying this morning as her baby is in special care. It doesn't sound very very serious; I am surmising from v brief text (fluid on lungs & small baby) She and her family need a happy ending and a healthy baby back home with them. I hope and pray for this for them.

[TheFogHorn]

So god was there for this little one but not for the last one...or people just didn't pray enough for the first one?

[Tuo]

Zipity: I am so pleased to hear that your friend's baby has been safely delivered. Praying that all will go well for them.

FogHorn: Your (many) threads make your views very clear. I really don't think this is the place. A little sensitivity?

[WingDefence]

Zipity - that's fantastic! I pray the newborn comes through fine.

[ginmakesitallok]

hope that new baby is OK - but agree with Foghorn, if baby is OK it will be more to do with the medical care given than the success of any prayer.

[TheFogHorn]

People can beat themselves up over not praying enough or thank themselves for praying if the timing was right. They can also tell themselves someone died because it was god's will, which would make it a despicable thing. Other people can absolve themselves of guilt by putting misfortune down to karma. Disabled children are often overlooked in India due to 'repaying a debt of karma'. Lucky people can think their luck came in due to good karma and not feel obliged to help the 'Untouchables' amongst them.

I think the focus should be on the loss of life or the saving of life with no other thanks or blame handed out other than to medical staff or those provably responsible.

It's very sad to hear a baby didn't make it but it's lovely to hear this one hopefully will.

[technodad]

Zipity,

I am glad things are working out for her. But all of what you said is statistically very probably indeed and you are making an assertion that there is a common cause for these things when it is extremely likely to be the case.

Well done to the doctors and all of modern science that has given them to tools and training to save the lives of people who would have not survived before modern medicine (even a few years ago).

Fog - you are spot on.

[madhairday]

So glad your friend's baby is doing well, OP. She must have been through such a terrible time. :(

Not sure some comments on here are particularly helpful, but glad you have found help and peace. Hope the baby thrives from now on.

[TantrumsAndOlympicGoldBalloons]

There are a great many people who gain strength, hope and peace from prayer, visualization, having a connection to people who have passed. It gives them peace of mind.
To come on to such a thread and try to make someone feel wrong or silly for having these beliefs is not a kind thing to do.

But maybe you do not believe in kindness either.

OP I am glad the baby is doing well, and you can take strength and hope from your prayers.

[headinhands]

Even the posters who have suggested that there was nothing paranormal afoot have expressed their pleasure on hearing that mum and baby are okay. They've just pointed out the fundamental and illogical contradictions in assuming there is a higher power moving clocks around so a child can see what time it is while simultaneously allowing millions of people to suffer and die in dreadful circumstances. It bothers me when posters offering an alternative explanation are labelled 'unhelpful'. If I posted about evolution and an evolution-denier posted an alternative explanation that I felt uncredible I would merely disregard it or probe the posters reasoning. I wouldn't feel the need to speciously call their views 'unhelpful'.

[headinhands]

If someone holding an alternative view to yourself makes you feel like your views are 'wrong or silly' you probably need to examine the strength of your convictions?

[TantrumsAndOlympicGoldBalloons]

I said trying to make people feel wrong or silly.
Not succeeding.

I don't understand this obsession with having to take every bit Of pleasure someone may have from their own personal beliefs by having to jump on the thread saying well actually you are wrong

I'n situations like this it's just spite. And an overwhelming desire to be right above everyone else. To me, thats mean spirited.

[seeker]

"To come on to such a thread and try to make someone feel wrong or silly for having these beliefs is not a kind thing to do.


I am amazed at the fragility of Christian beliefs. They must have changed a lot over time if a stranger on the Internet raising a question can make a modern Christian feel "wrong and silly"

[TantrumsAndOlympicGoldBalloons]

^So god was there for this little one but not for the last one...or people just didn't pray enough for the first one?*


And if you don't think that is a horrible thing to say in this situation, I find that shameful.

Believe or don't believe, people can debate that all day long. But that was a fucking awful thing to post.

[madhairday]

I agree, Tantrums.

It's not about fragility of beliefs. It's simply about the nature of this thread, where the OP was feeling that prayers were answered for a friend. A friend in a real situation. Perhaps views about whether prayers are/are not answered are best left for another thread, a thread based on a theoretical question rather than a person having lived through an extremely harrowing set of circumstances.

You know very well seeker that me and many of my fellow Christians are more than happy to engage with views and ideas different to ours. Can you not see that here is not the place?

[headinhands]

But it wasn't the mum herself who had posted. The op is a friend of said mother who now felt her friends baby would be okay because god had heard her prayer. I think people are allowed to suggest otherwise. I think it's natural to question the logic of that assertion.

I don't see how it's horrible to wonder why god didn't step in the previous time. Can you explain why that is actually horrible?

No one is suggesting that people shouldn't hold and cherish memories of passed loved ones. No one is minimising the personal agony of such losses. What I do suggest is that there are many alternatives to a belief in the afterlife to comfort the mourning that are just as valid, actually more valid but that's obviously my opinion.

[technodad]

Turn the discussion on its head and imagine the following scenario:

Someone posts a thread stating that they used to be a believer, but could now prove that God most definitely does not exist, because they had a bereavement of a young child in their family.

I am willing to bet a pretty large sum of money that many religious mums-netters would reply to the thread stating spurious comments about it being gods wish etc and trying to convince the OP that they are wrong to turn away from their faith. To be honest, I don't see how this thread is any different from that scenario (apart from the fact that this is a joyous occasion, rather than my suggested scenario which would be a vulnerable person in a state of active grief).

[Zipitydooda]

I've been pondering whether to come back to this thread. I really don't want to get involved in a is-there/ isn't there discussion.

People who live on logical principles alone are impossible to argue with anyway. I'm married to one and have long given up on him and I am confident enough in my own beliefs not to be upset.

Thank you for the messages of kindness. Baby is doing well.

[technodad]

I am really glad the baby is doing well.

[madhairday]

That's good, Zip.

techno: I would never, ever post a comment about the loss of a child being 'God's wish' , and don't know any Christians who would, either. In such a circumstance I have only seen messages of support and love, as it should be.

[DioneTheDiabolist]

Actually Technodad, to turn this thread on it's head would be:

"My friend lost her child x years ago. Recently she gave birth prematurely, we all feared for her but this time her child survived. Thanks to all the medics involved in her care."

Is to thank the current now to assume that those involved with her other child were negligent?

Zippity, I am so sorry if I have hijacked your thread. I am glad that your friend's baby is (hopefully) going to be ok. And I am heartened that you feel able to post about your faith and feelings here.

[seeker]

"Is to thank the current now to assume that those involved with her other child were negligent?"

No- because nobody has ever suggested that the medical profession are omnipotent, omniscient and all merciful.