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Philosophy/religion

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Something for all who believe there is no God

68 replies

boughs · 19/12/2011 17:30

The White House referred to Christmas Trees as Holiday Trees
for the first time this year, which prompted this from CBS presenter, Ben Stein. Happy Christmas!

The following was written by Ben Stein and recited by him on CBS
Sunday Morning Commentary.

My confession:

I am a Jew, and every single one of my ancestors was Jewish. And it does not bother me even a little bit when people call those beautiful lit up, bejeweled trees, Christmas trees. I don't feel threatened. I don't feel discriminated against. That's what they are, Christmas trees.

It doesn't bother me a bit when people say, 'Merry Christmas' to me. I don't think they are slighting me or getting ready to put me in a ghetto. In fact, I kind of like it. It shows that we are all brothers and sisters celebrating this happy time of year. It doesn't bother me at all that there is a manger scene on display at a key intersection near my beach house in Malibu . If people want a creche, it's just as fine with me as is the Menorah a few hundred yards away.

I don't like getting pushed around for being a Jew, and I don't think Christians like getting pushed around for being Christians. I think people who believe in God are sick and tired of getting pushed around, period. I have no idea where the concept came from, that America is an explicitly atheist country. I can't find it in the Constitution and I don't like it being shoved down my throat.

Or maybe I can put it another way: where did the idea come from that we
should worship celebrities and we aren't allowed to worship God ? I
guess that's a sign that I'm getting old, too. But there are a lot of
us who are wondering where these celebrities came from and where the
America we knew went to.

In light of the many jokes we send to one another for a laugh, this is a little different: This is not intended to be a joke; it's not funny, it's intended to get you thinking.

Billy Graham's daughter was interviewed on the Early Show and Jane Clayson asked her 'How could God let something like this happen?' (regarding Hurricane Katrina)? Anne Graham gave an extremely profound and insightful response. She said, 'I believe God is deeply saddened by this, just as we are, but for years we've been telling God to get out of our schools, to get out of our government and to get out of our lives. And being the gentleman He is, I believe He has calmly backed out. How can we expect God to give us His blessing and His protection if we demand He leave us alone?'

In light of recent events... terrorists attack, school shootings, etc. I think it started when Madeleine Murray O'Hare (she was murdered, her body found a few years ago) complained she didn't want prayer in our schools, and we said OK. Then someone said you better not read the Bible in school. The Bible says thou shalt not kill; thou shalt not steal, and love your neighbor as yourself. And we said OK.

Then Dr. Benjamin Spock said we shouldn't spank our children when they misbehave, because their little personalities would be warped and we might damage their self-esteem (Dr. Spock's son committed suicide). We said an expert should know what he's talking about. And we said okay.

Now we're asking ourselves why our children have no conscience, why they don't know right from wrong, and why it doesn't bother them to kill strangers, their classmates, and themselves.

Probably, if we think about it long and hard enough, we can figure it out. I think it has a great deal to do with 'WE REAP WHAT WE SOW.'

Funny how simple it is for people to trash God and then wonder why the world's going to hell. Funny how we believe what the newspapers say, but question what the Bible says. Funny how you can send 'jokes' through e-mail and they spread like wildfire, but when you start sending messages regarding the Lord, people think twice about sharing. Funny how lewd, crude, vulgar and obscene articles pass freely through cyberspace, but public discussion of God is suppressed in the school and workplace.

Are you laughing yet?

Funny how when you forward this message, you will not send it to many on your address list because you're not sure what they believe, or what they will think of you for sending it.

Funny how we can be more worried about what other people think of us than what God thinks of us.

Pass it on if you think it has merit.

If not, then just discard it.... no one will know you did. But, if you discard this thought process, don't sit back and complain about what bad shape the world is in.

My Best Regards, Honestly and respectfully,

Ben Stein

OP posts:
boughs · 19/12/2011 18:12

Thank you, woolly! Just so nobody is naive enough to think we're not completely human. And why assume I'm Christian?

tsk tsk

OP posts:
allthethingsshesaid · 19/12/2011 18:12

Yes, of course the reason why I'm not a mass murderer rampaging through towns is because I'm not a Christian.

mrsravelstein · 19/12/2011 18:15

properly hilarious.

CotherMuckingFunt · 19/12/2011 18:17

I'm a Christian and I do find it astonishing to hear that some people seem to be keen to remove Christ from Christmas, but I have to say, I've never seen proof of this happening apart from in the Daily Mail so I disregard that without choking on my coffee.

I really don't believe that God is vengeful though. He's not a 5 yr old saying "you were mean to me so I'm going to break your things". I think he's a touch above that kind of thinking.

BoulevardOfBrokenSleep · 19/12/2011 18:20

Hmm. According to Wikipedia, the South of the USA is its most religious area, with levels of belief in God surveyed at 86%. Bit of a bugger that they get all the hurricanes, eh?

Still, it's lucky England still makes schoolkids pray, we haven't had a hurricane in years and years. This Graham lady is clearly onto something!

(I thought this was going to be about this month's New Statesman, edited by Richard Dawkins. Definitely worth a read, if you're finding this thread disappointing)

OldLadyKnowsSantaClaus · 19/12/2011 18:21

not vengeful? He wiped out almost the entire planet at one point. Noah and all that. Ben Stein has an OT version of the Xtian God.

PeggyCarter · 19/12/2011 18:30

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Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Liluri · 19/12/2011 18:34

Terrible grammar!

CotherMuckingFunt · 19/12/2011 18:49

TheJoyfulPuddlejumper

Well, for a start I HATE 'pass this on or you will feel guilty forever' type messages so that ruins it for me. Secondly, I'm the most shockingly shit of all Christians. I believe in God, I try to live my life if you take out my lying thieving drug taking teenage years as I think God would want me to and I cringe typing things like that even though it's true but I'm not very good at being good so I'm not sure I'm the best person to ask.

I am pleased that someone has stood up and stated that there is nothing wrong with being a Christian. But I really think he's gone the wrong way about convincing other people. I definitely don't believe that rejecting God causes you to get murdered/become a murderer. I do believe that there is a massive decline in morals in the world which causes many many problems. My dh isn't a Christian but he's the most morally good person I know so I don't think you can blame a lack of religious belief for this decline.

I also really struggle with the bible. I was taught that I should believe everything it says but, imho, it was written by humans interpreting what God was saying. Then it was translated from language to language by more humans. I don't know of any human that doesn't like to put a spin on things to create a better slant for themselves. I was told by my doctor that I should do as little housework as possible in order from my wrist to get better. I told dh that he said I shouldn't do any housework - not an out and out lie, but definitely a spin on the truth to favour myself.

Anyway, I'm rambling - I told you I was the wrong person to ask! I guess I don't agree with what Ben Stein has written but I do believe there is an underlying truth once you get rid of all the hooha and emotional blackmail - just not necessarily the 'truth' that he is trying to promote.

I'll shut up now.

PeggyCarter · 19/12/2011 19:10

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Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Snorbs · 19/12/2011 19:14

Um, you do know that Ben Steins didn't write all of that, don't you? And you do know that much of it - eg, the bit about the White House calling them ' holiday trees' are blatant lies? Snopes is always worth checking for this sort of thing.

Presumably the person who added the lies haven't read the bit in the Bible about not bearing false witness.

boughs · 19/12/2011 19:18

puddles, you are quite a literal chap, of course my intelligence is limited! Dur. [Even if it's alleged to be better than 99% of the top 10% of english speakers globally... but that it just another of God's trivial gifts.]

Apart from it being a little boring to engage superficially, dinner is far more important that MN. Wine

OP posts:
boughs · 19/12/2011 19:20

Chinese whispers, snorby, surely this sort of thing cannot be considered a conspiracy by the balanced?

You're obviously obsessed with Christianity though, unlike me...

OP posts:
helpmabob · 19/12/2011 19:23

The first 2 paragraphs were fine, the rest of what he had to say was absolutely abhorrent. What a vile thing to read.

Snorbs · 19/12/2011 19:24

You are so uninterested in Christianity that you started a thread about it. Righty-ho Wink

BoulevardOfBrokenSleep · 19/12/2011 19:25

And I see the bit about Dr Spock's son isn't true either.

Tasteful!

faeriefruitcake · 19/12/2011 19:27

I am religious, pagan, but have never felt the need to 'proove' to others that a god exists.

Why do you feel the need to post this, feeling insecure in your faith are you? Need a Jew to validate your faith? Mazel Tov.

EssentialFattyAcid · 19/12/2011 19:28

HO Ho Ho
i believe that religion is an instrument of social control to repress the masses and make them content with their lot aand thus maintain the social order

Do I worship celebrities instead? Hell no.

bemybebe · 19/12/2011 19:28

Thank you snorbs! I am not surprised that this drivel is just one of these chain letters that are going around.

OP, bon ap and don't bother your intelligent head with arguing - after you posted total bollocks here, didn't you?

jumper and cother do you seriously think there is a decline in morals?? in comparison to what? in what time frame? 80s? 50s? XIXc? X? is it moral to beat ones children? to rape ones wife? to stone people for adultery? to burn people for challenging religious dogma?

sorry, but moaning about "moral decline" was happening since the dawn of times.

ginmakesitallok · 19/12/2011 19:29

What a load of absolute bollocks.

gaunyerseljeannie · 19/12/2011 19:30

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bemybebe · 19/12/2011 19:30

the only thing I agree with communists about is that "religion is the opium for the masses"

totally

ginmakesitallok · 19/12/2011 19:32

Oh - and I don't NEED a bible to tell me not to kill or rape or steal etc and am always a bit Hmm at religious folk who just don't do those things "because the bible tells them not to".........

PeggyCarter · 19/12/2011 19:52

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PeggyCarter · 19/12/2011 19:53

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