Aggressive puppy

[twddarylstruelove]

Please can I ask for kindness and empathy, I am really upset. the following will be long so as to give the full story.

5 months ago I was on a camping holiday. There was a man with a Staffy, and I happened to stop and say that they reminded me of my old dog. He then said that he had some puppy’s in the back of his van. He continued saying he had recently been made homeless and didn’t know his dog (bitch) was pregnant.

While I was talking to him his dog was barking and straining towards me. He said that he could let me hold one. I declined.

To shorten the story, he did bring a puppy to me whilst I was with my husband and said we could have her for £xx price.

We already have a dog so said no.

On the last day the man saw me and said he thought we looked like kind people and that we could just have her. After we decided to do this, the man gave some basic information- she was 5 weeks old and had been on adult dog food from 5 weeks. We knew we had to help her.

I spoke to my husband and we decided to take her with the intention of taking her to a rescue centre, we did not think our other dog would accept her
.
Well, our other dog was amazing. She took her on and we decided to keep the puppy.

She was absolutely fine, we carried her with us on other dog walks, she met family and friends at our home, I’ve taken her on puppy walks.

As the weeks have gone on she has become more and more aggressive towards people coming into our home. She barks and growls.

I have been working really hard with her on walks and she will walk past people and dogs with treat based rewards, which has worked so well!
I have spoken to dog trainers and the dogs trust to ask for help.

Today we were walking back from a field we use for her and my other dog to be off lead. A couple were on the narrow path and moved to the side.

As I was coming up to them I said that she might bark (I was using treats to keep her focus as I have been doing with great success). She did did stop and look at them. The man then put his hand out to stroke her and I couldn’t get the words out quick enough to say don’t touch her.

She didn’t cower or growl or bark, she immediately jumped up and bit his thumb. She didn’t cower draw blood.

I can’t have a dog that is that aggressive.
please tell me if there are any options other than euthanasia.

Thank you if you read it all. I know some details will be missing and will answer anything if I can

Poor dog. Was taken from mum far too early for a start so did not have a good start in life.
Have there been other biting incidents? Was it definitely aggression not playful?

A vet needs to check it over. It could be inbred or poorly.. An unknown dpuppy isn't always a safe option... Shame as you tried to do something lovely...

Bless you, I have a dog exactly the same. I believe she suffered trauma from a puppy as when I went to the home to collect her she was cowering under a table and was covered in bites. She doesn't like strangers or other dogs. Vets advised to use medication to make her calm on walks but I didn't want to medicate her. So we used a muzzle which worked, keeping her on a lead and making people aware before they get close, you can get a special yellow lead which says nervous dog, walking her where there are minimal people around. There are so many other options than euthanasia.

Thank you for your kind replies. She is honestly the best dog at home.

We knew it was a massive risk taking her- our other dog is from a rescue, and our stuffy before that. It was definitely a heart over head decision.

I have realised I made a typo in the first post- she had been put on adult dog food from 3 weeks.
we were away for a week and she was in there the whole time.

I have ordered a muzzle for her, I’m just very anxious about people coming to our house.

At the moment it’s just barking (although she will eat treats thrown by visitors, and progress to taking from their hand).

it’s the lack of fear she showed. Surely if it was because she was nervous she would’ve at least backed away first or growled/barked?

I Just think how bad if it had been a child.

I will definitely be making it very clear not to touché her for now.

Whats worse is that she had walked past about 6 other people with me saying her name and throwing treats down.-i was feeling so proud of her.

She hasn’t bitten anyone before, but I have always been very clear not to look at/or touch when people come to the house or when out.

I’m so upset I didn’t say not to touch her,

Unfortunately I only said that she might bark as we walk past.

He was very understanding, said that she needed a muzzle and someone else would’ve called the police.
I apologised, and made sure he was ok.
I did say that he shouldn’t have tried to touch her, and he said that she looked friendly. This is my worry when we are out.

The man was at fault. Sorry; I have a lovely dog like that, no one should try and touch an anxious dog. I suggest a literal sign for their lead, saying ‘please ignore me’ or ‘do not pet’ the public need clear directives. Anything like ‘they might bark’ or ‘they’re a bit nervous’ will not work. You can buy online.

Don't feel too guilty about what happened with the man – you made it clear that your dog could be reactive and he was stupid enough to stick out his hand to pet her "because she looked friendly". It's my biggest bugbear when we're walking our Goldie pup – people just think they're entitled to get in her face!

I agree with other PP that you should get her checked out with a vet for signs of inbreeding, but do yourself a favour in the meantime and get a lead or harness that says "reactive dog" etc so you don't have to tell people to back away all the time. Because it sounds like you are doing a great job with training her and you shouldn't let this one incident derail that.

In the meantime, when people come into your home, can you put her in a room with a baby stairgate across the doorway? We do it with ours because she always go nuts (although she's not a barker) and jumps up. She now knows that she's not allowed out from behind the gate until everyone's seated in another room and she's calmed down enough to say hello. It's working a treat!

Sorry – edited because I replied to wrong person!

Also, he is at fault, no matter how many times he said ‘someone else would have called the police, she looked friendly.’

Editing post fail, wrong thread, latest post relevant.

@MotherMary14It’s my fault, I replied to the wrong post. Signs on our dog have been life changing!

We use a julious k9 with a changeable patch that says ‘do not pet’

We're thinking of getting one too. Tired of having to tell people to back off. If you see an owner keeping their dog tightly to heel on the lead to walk past, you don't block their way to say hello and pet them! (The dog, not the owner.)

My DP wants us to get this one. 😂

Love That one, and can also so recommend it. You’ll be amazed by how many people see them and say that they’ll get one for their dog!!

I’m going to order one, thank you

You won’t look back! It’s been so helpful for us!

We have this patch for our K9. Very successful, only one person proceeded to pet, as he didn’t have his glasses on…as it happens on that random occasion the dog was fine 😅

thank you, I will also order one of these.
I really want to help her be a happy dog.

Bump for any more advice- thank you to you all for your recommendations and kind words so far.

There is a lot of free advice via guides on Dog Training Advice and Support’s FB page. This is their website with more info https://fbdtas.com/

Read the relevant guides and, if after trying the advice you still need help, you can post to the experts for advice.

I would for the moment ensure you protect your dog from others who wish to pet her - the signs and muzzle are all good ideas.

However I really wish there was a nationwide campaign to educate the public not to approach dogs and pet them without permission from the owner. I know Dogs Trust go into schools and do this - we had them at my kids primary school - but I wish they did it for adults too. The public should know that dogs are not fluffy toys; they’re animals with their own emotions and should be respected.

I don’t think the man is at fault, it’s quite normal to assume a puppy is safe to pat.
Sorry to say but at this young age, it’s going to be virtually impossible to train her out of that aggression. Like you say, she’s a risk to young children given her eventual size and breed. I’d take her to the vets for a chat/check, but sadly think euthanasia is kindest.

It would be really helpful if you would tell @twddarylstruelove what training and experience you have in dog behaviour? It's a very bold thing to confidently give a verdict about a dog you've never met.

@twddarylstruelove the same behaviour can come from very different root causes, and therefore will need very different management. If you are in the South, I know two very good behaviourists who could help you to unpick what is going on for your puppy, and give you a plan to change it.

No dog is aggressive because they are 'nasty'. Most aggressive behaviour can be modified.

First of all, this guy was in the wrong. You don’t reach out to touch a dog without asking first, you’re basically asking to be bloody bitten. You have got to become your dogs biggest advocate from here on in, be firm and say “she may bark, please don’t touch her, she will bite”. I’ve found many dumb people need it clearly told that your dog will bite because otherwise they’re all “ahh but dogs love me, don’t worry I’m sure she’ll be fine!” You can also get lead covers that say “do not touch”. These are common now and most people understand that rescue dogs have past traumas that mean they can’t be touched. In the meantime, try muzzle training. The muzzles from Muzzle Movement are amazing and have a hole where you can still feed treats and the dog can still pant, drink and behave like normal but safely.

Secondly, this poor dog has clearly had a rough start. Sounds like she is fear aggressive, dogs aren’t usually aggressive for no reason at all. Using the treats is brilliant and I will always advocate for force free / positive reinforcement dog training and behaviour modification.

I’d start with a thorough vet check. Most dogs who bite are in pain somewhere, whether it be arthritis, luxating patella, digestive issues or something else. If the vets can’t find anything obvious you can request a pain med trial, where they give her light pain relief and see if it impacts her behaviour. If it makes her behaviour better, she’s obviously been in pain and they need to dig deeper. If it has no impact, it’s likely not pain that’s the cause.

Thats not to say this isn’t all likely due to her difficult upbringing and maybe genetics. Look on the ABTC website for behaviourists near you; all of the ones on here are rigorously checked and have to meet certain standards to be members of the ABTC. They’re all force free (so no horrible choke chains, e collars etc) and have a deeper understanding of dog behaviour. We found our behaviourist on there and she changed our lives. Our rescue dog had bitten us and others when we made a last ditch attempt for help and paid the money for a behaviourist. 3 years later we haven’t had a single bite and he is cheeky but brilliant. He feels safe with us now and I am his biggest advocate. I’m in no doubt that without our behaviourist we wouldn’t have coped with him and he would no longer be here, which kills me to say. He’s currently snuggled up on my knee snoring after his hour long morning walk where he’s said hello to 3 of our neighbours who he absolutely adores and sits patiently at their feet waiting for them to dish up the goods (a gravy bone!).

Thanks everyone. I have got the muzzle to pick up tomorrow, a very fluorescent jacket that says do not touch and a do not touch sleeve for her lead.
I have also booked to see the behaviourist at the rescue where I got my other dog, they have helped me with her and I trust them.
I will be speaking to the vets tomorrow and see what they suggest- I know she could be in pain, but she has never shown any aggression towards any of us in the house at all, she’s the soppiest thing ever.
I haven’t got a stair gate but have got a large crate. I have setup this up and gave her lots of treats hidden in there and a treat ball and a bone. She was happy in there for a 15/20 mins while I was in and out of the room. I am hoping this will be a good place for her to go when people initially arrive.
I think k until I have seen everyone I can I will muzzle her inside the house if people are coming round.
I think I need to try and find out if it is trauma related or in her dna.
it can feel very isolating when you have a reactive dog so thank you all again.

No one should be touching a dog or putting their hands towards a dog unless the owner has clearly said it’s okay.

I wouldn’t be too concerned with this, the dog felt threatened and understandably wanted to protect herself.

Keep going with what you’re doing training wise and socialising.

Thank you for this. I know she shouldn’t have bitten him, but it definitely could’ve been avoided if he hadn’t gone to pet her, she would’ve just walked past chasing her treats.
A muzzle going forward should avoid all this hopefully.