dogs at school gates

[southeastastra]

hi im really livid but would like to hear all sides.
took my ds4 to school this morning - outside the school (not in school grounds) someone had tied up a dog I would say it was a cujo type dog (sorry dont know much about breeds). It was tied right by the entrance that we have to go in which is very small and also the nursery entrance.

im not saying this dog is dangerous it just looked big and to my son scary. I am so fed up of people taking these animals, even tied up, to the school.

Am i over reacting? my son is scared of dogs, and i have tried to tell him they're nice etc, but this is now getting on my nerves, it seems so irresponsible for parents to do this, should i call school? this dog was not on the school grounds but very near!

Thanks Im just so angry.

Coming late to this but was surprised to see someone saying their dog couldn't possibly scare anyone as it was only a terrier. Terriers might be small but they are bred for rat catching and can be very aggressive. It's not the size of the dog, it's the behaviour. Some of which is inherent to the breed. Spaniels might look cute but can be very boisterous.

I did eat a guinea pig, yes. It was a bit like very tender chicken. I've heard rat is very similar.

So donnie what would you propose happens to the dogs when they are no longer useful? My guide dog who has worked loyally for me for 9 and a half years, but she's 11 now and deserves a retirement. Would you propose that as she's no longer useful I get rid of her? and if so what would you propose happen to her

I think she would like them exported to China where they would be stir fried with water chestnuts and beansprouts and jazzed up with a nice hoisin sauce.

There are lots of good reasons to have a dog - it cuts down on stress levels (cortisol is lower in pet owners than others), children in homes with pets are less likely to have asthma, eczema etc. (although they don't know whether that's because people whose children do have asthma, eczema, allergies get rid of their pets - still working on that), you are safer to go for a walk after dark if you feel like it, they are an alarm system, they are great company, they are unquestioning adoration and loyalty, you are less likely to have a heart attack, they keep you fitter than you might otherwise be because you have to walk them... I'm sure dog-owners could come up with more reasons for.

None of which of course, means that you're entitled to leave its shite on the pavement, tie it up next to a school, or allow it to bound up to unsuspecting people minding their own business. Most dog-owners do know that. But oh yes in my area, so many of them just don't. That's one of the reasons the dog licence was originally invented. Pity they don't bring it back.

ooh more reasons for - teaches children about facts of life, also about responsibility - dog has to be fed, walked, bathed, wormed etc. - is not just for when you feel like it. Not a bad lesson imo.

Bugger it teaches children responsibility, my children like having a dog around because she is fun

Yes they like having her because she's fun, but they benefit from having her because of blah blah blah...

Yes, admittedly that's the case....

That was a fab link to the 'assistance' dogs, I never would have thought of using them for autistic children but it makes sense when you think about it. I would love to have one for ds!

There was an article in 'Horse and Hound' a while ago about a 9 yo blind girl who was unable to have a guide dog (can't remember if she was allergic or scared) and she had a specially trained shetland pony instead. It was such a success that the trainers are hoping to extend the scheme, not least because the working life of a pony is three times that of a dog and it would save a huge amount of money.

At least a dog outside the school can only lick you or bite, it's not going to give you a crafty kick .

i thought this said 'drugs at the school gates'!
Now that is controversial

not really into stir fry actually....and I would only eat the dog if it was organic.

mt older dd did mention wanting a guinea pig recently but maybe she was hungry at the time!

edam: I don't know if you're referring to my comments about a terrier. If so, I think you misunderstand / misquote me. I understand that though they're small, they can be threatening, scary, aggressive, whatever. In fact, in my experience they can often be more aggressive than some larger dogs because they're bred for independent hunting and are not terribly biddable or submissive. Mine is uncastrated as well - so he really does tend to think he's the Alpha Male amongst other dogs. When I said that a boy was ridiculous for running screaming from him, it was because he was old enough to try and deal with the problem in another way - and the dog was only three months old at the time. And tiny. With little puppy teeth. And a subserviently waggy little puppy tail.

Why do people have dogs? All the reasons people have said. Constant companionship. Fun. Joy. Exercise. I love my dog. The thought of his comparatively limited life span has me practically blubbing like a big girly wuss. In fact, wannaBe1974's comments about retiring her dog almost set me off.

I'll go now, before I embarrass myself...

Well I only have dogs because I like to leave poo everywhere I go (which I always ensure is the most populated of places), regularly have fun arrangeing the savagment of small children, eat the neighbourhood cats and make my sofa smell bad.

Of course - why else would I have one?

actually, my puppy pissed on the briefcase of the social worker who came to see me yesterday (about arranging some help for dd2 - he's an arse and a complete time-waster). Surely that's all the reason I could possibly need?

gg

"When I said that a boy was ridiculous for running screaming from him, it was because he was old enough to try and deal with the problem in another way"

Well he might be, but the point is, sometimes children are ridiculous about all sorts of things - dogs, traffic, etc. It's up to us as adults not to expose them to potential danger or terror, though isn't it? It may be ridiculous to be afraid of a 3 month old puppy, but that doesn't actually mean you ought to be allowing it to run after a ridiculous child. Also, why should he "deal" with the problem? What was the problem? The very existence of the dog, in which case that's his problem, or the fact that the dog was running after him, which is actually a problem which he shouldn't have to deal with in any way shape or form. Dog owners just shouldn't let a dog run after children and if your dog won't come back to you immediately you call it, then you either haven't trained it very well, or it's a type of dog that doesn't respond to training and arguably, shouldn't be out without a lead...

This thread could run and run!

oh, i've only a minute, but, i couldn't resist. everyone is talking about dogs being fearful. as a muslim, my concern is that the dog's saliva doesn't touch me. muslims believe that it is dirty/filthy. not in the normal sense, but the bacteria, etc. in order to get rid of the germs, you have to wash the bit that touched you with water six times and once with sand. as there aren't much dry sand about here, i'd do avoid dogs. it's the same for the majority of muslims. i'm not scared of dogs,(as a child i'd always wanted those wolf like dogs, still do) but it is because of my religion that i avoid it. idon't really care who has a dog, but it would be very considerate of you who do have to keep them away from running after ppl/jumping on them, avoid tying them at the gate, and keeping a short leash on them.
there are instances where we are allowed to keep dogs, mainly as guide dogs, hunting and guarding. they are well trained dogs, and don't get their saliva all over the place/you.
not sure if any of this made sense, but i bfing and in a hurry.

I'm a dog at the school gate culprit (yes I always pick up poo, no my dog is not large or aggressive, yes she is kept under control, no she doesn't block any gateways or entrances).

Some of what has been said on this thread has given me paws for thought (sorry!)I really am quite shocked that people could object to a well behaved dog being on a pavement. I hadn't considered that my very biddable dog should be muzzled to prevent accusations. Probably she should be but then will look like a scary fierce savage biter which she isn't.

Can I just say (covered on another thread before) that if you are one of those plonkers who lets your child hug and kiss strange dogs, please just don't.

Yesterday a child came up to my small fluffy dog and literally had her in a bear hug kissing face to face. Her mum just stood beside her and looked on. I trust my dog but wouldn't even let my own children do that to her let alone to a dog they didn't know. You never know if it'll be scared enough to do something that she's never done before.

Just like stranger danger it is important to let kids learn that while most people/ dogs are very kind and friendly, there are a few who might hurt you so stay away unless parent says OK. And what a shame it would be if we had to remove all site of dogs from small children just in case they are scared. Is this really the best way to teach them not to be scared??

no objection to people taking their dogs a walk whilst collecting/dropping their kids off but they should tie them up well away from the gates and they should be kept on a lead if they are one of those excitable dogs who is likely to chase and jmup all over people. sorry its short and sweet, but i'm in a bit of a hurry!

it's difficult though shimmy. should your dog get hugged by a child that doesn't know any better and whose parents don;t know any better and should your dog get annoyed and snap, who's responsible? I was vert pro dogs tied up outside school until this thread and now I'm not so sure. there is some merit to the argument that as an owner you're responsible for ensuring the dog is not put in a situation it doesn't like and to which it might react badly, and by leaving it you're not making sure. I haven't made my mind up but think there's more to it than I did at first

Depends on the dog.
My DD1 is terridied of dogs, don't know why as her grandparents had dogs that were fine.
I try not to keep her away as someone said earlier, as this could make her worse (if that's possible !!)
When we are out walking in the woods she goes nuts if there is a dog loose but I just try to reasure her and hope that it is a nice dog running towards us.

Unless it's a yappy annoying thing or a vicious dog then there should not be a problem.
I guess you'll always get that cruell child who will wind the dog up though and it may get fed up of the attention.

Shimmy the problem is that sometimes children do things which their parents don't/ can't anticipate - "don't eat the daisies" springs to mind, I can't remember where I heard that, but it's something you don't think to tell your kids not to do. A friend of mine (the one who now puts a muzzle on her dog) was in exactly the situation you describe - a child ran up to her dog to put her arms around him and kiss him, and he bit her. It is just a normal, defensive thing for a dog who feels he is under attack, to do and tbh not doing it is in some ways requiring him not to behave as a dog.

In that instance, the police were called and warned my friend that if the dog ever bites again she'll be legally liable. Hence the muzzle. But the child's mother was just in shock - the girl had never done anything like that before and it was totally out of the blue and unexpected. Sometimes I think it would be easier if all dogs were simply required to be muzzled in public - for both owners and everyone else.

Caligula: Really - I don't think you know what you're talking about.

"It's up to us as adults not to expose them to potential danger or terror, though isn't it?" I disagree. It's our place as adults to raise happy well-balanced individuals, and allowing such fear to fester (with regard to anything) means that we are failing in that brief.

"It may be ridiculous to be afraid of a 3 month old puppy, but that doesn't actually mean you ought to be allowing it to run after a ridiculous child."

I didn't say I did, but thanks for the pointer. The puppy was on the lead at the time.

"Dog owners just shouldn't let a dog run after children and if your dog won't come back to you immediately you call it, then you either haven't trained it very well, or it's a type of dog that doesn't respond to training and arguably, shouldn't be out without a lead..."
Did you get the bit where I said he was a three month old puppy at the time...? Do you imagine that they come out fully socialised and trained? Or that there's a boot camp in the mountains of north Wales or somewhere where unruly newborn dogs can go to be turned into model citizens?? Dogs become trained and socialised by being exposed to everyday situations. If you never let your dog off the lead, he never has a chance to learn to come back to you.

Really - how much familiarity do you have with dogs...??