Call a public inquiry into pro-Israel influence on politics & democracy

[Inauthentic]

This petition is calling for a public inquiry into alleged pro-Israel influence in UK politics.

If this is something you feel strongly about, you may want to look at the petition.

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/752646?fbclid=Iwb21leAQBfvJjbGNrBAF-5WV4dG4DYWVtAjExAHNydGMGYXBwX2lkDDM1MDY4NTUzMTcyOAABHmoGk2EfHTL0RZ-b8Cm-YKCw1PWUN_lB5vQEkFfuEB4EuWc4EwOoTSwfRxnN_aem_8U3rmKE71-tvR8IowzhMkA

I agree that once you see it you can’t unsee it. Sadly lots of people are absolutely determined not to see it! It’s sad, worrying and frightening.

I agree too that once you see it you can’t unsee it.

Antisemitism is rife in the UK at the moment. I’m so sorry for anyone who has Jewish family, it’s horrible.

Looking at the petition you posted @Inauthentic

numbers have certainly increased in just the last two days
If it reaches 100,000 ( approx another 23,000 to go ) it will be discussed in Parliament and it will be interesting to see what is said

It will be interesting. Keir Starmer has a commitment to fighting antisemitism, as have many other MPs.

Whilst it is appreciated some people feel questioning any Israel actions as antisemitic that is not in fact the case

So let’s not water down the definition.

According to the widely adopted
International Holocaust Remembrance Alliance (IHRA) working definition of antisemitism, which is utilized by the UK government, it is not inherently antisemitic to question or criticize the Israeli government or its influence, provided such criticism does not cross into anti-Jewish hate.
American Jewish Committee (AJC) +1
The distinction lies in the nature of the critique:

• Legitimate Criticism: Criticizing the Government of Israel, its policies, its foreign relations, or lobbying efforts—in a manner similar to that applied to any other democratic nation—is generally considered legitimate political discourse.
• Antisemitic Rhetoric: Criticism becomes antisemitic when it uses classic antisemitic stereotypes, such as claims of a "world Jewish conspiracy" or of Jews controlling governments, media, or other societal institutions.
• GOV.UK +1

Key Factors Regarding Israel and the UK Government:

• Conflation: Holding British Jews collectively responsible for the actions of the State of Israel is considered antisemitic.
• Conspiracy Theories: Allegations that Israeli officials secretly control or manage UK political parties or politicians can, depending on the framing, evoke anti-Jewish conspiracy tropes rather than focusing on legitimate diplomatic or political lobbying activity.
• Double Standards: The IHRA definition notes that applying "double standards by requiring of [Israel] a behavior not expected or demanded of any other democratic nation" can be a manifestation of antisemitism.
• The International Holocaust Remembrance Alliance (IHRA) +3

Contextual Definitions:
The UK Government accepts the IHRA definition but with caveats to ensure free speech is maintained in debates about Israel and Palestine. Other definitions, such as the Jerusalem Declaration on Antisemitism, also specify that it is not antisemitic to criticize Israeli policies, Zionism, or to pay disproportionate attention to Israel in political analysis, provided it does not constitute hatred or discrimination against Jews

@StandingSideBySide whilst in this instance the petition is about undue influence, as we have discussed, this would perhaps be better if it was broadened out to include China, Iran, Sudan or other countries. I think it's because it's only Israel.
Does that mean Israel can't be questioned or judged or queries made? No, but I think it's wise not to identify it as the only nation of concern globally.
My point about antisemitism is that currently, MPs, particularly Starmer, are aware of this. It's quite a vexed question, and in the current climate, a very challenging one.

Agree any countries having undue influence on U.K. politics should be questioned and I recall
many moons ago signing a petition about China
That petition was just about one country and there was no question or complaint that it should include a wider variety of countries

As we live in a democracy the person who started the petition is within their rights to do so
and anyone who wishes to start another about all countries or even just one can equally do so

All petitions are vetted before they become live so clearly this one is acceptable

Quite true, it's a democracy, and it's important to question what's happening. Of course the petitioner is within their rights, and people can sign it if they so wish.
I think if you read the thread, concerns raised about only identifying Israel is the issue at hand.
Bearing in mind what's been happening in the UK of late, and the global picture, posters were just responding to that.
I genuinely don't think anyone wants to limit democratic rights.

I would argue that this petition might meet the standards below from your post-

"Antisemitic Rhetoric: Criticism becomes antisemitic when it uses classic antisemitic stereotypes, such as claims of a "world Jewish conspiracy" or of Jews controlling governments, media, or other societal institutions."

And

"Double Standards: The IHRA definition notes that applying "double standards by requiring of [Israel] a behavior not expected or demanded of any other democratic nation" can be a manifestation of antisemitism."

Of course criticism of Israel isn't of itself antisemitic. For example the below-

Israel hasn't done enough to prevent civilian death in Gaza.
In getting into bed with the far right religious nutjobs BN has betrayed the original Zionists vision of a secular Israel.
Israel has been too aggressive with its neighbors in general.
Etc etc. I don't believe all of those statements personally but can see they are not antisemitic- but criticism of Israel.

Its always possible to criticize Israel without resorting to antisemitism or the use of tropes. It just takes a bit of thought.

If you read the full wording of the petition there is no claims of a world Jewish conspiracy or questioning of it

There is also no obvious intent that Israel are being singled out
If you read my pp other countries eg China have had similar queries put against them and at no time was there a thought that they were being singled out. So just as Israel aren’t

Anyone can question any Countries influence on ours and questioning Israel’s is not antisemitic as my pp showed and your final para reiterates quite rightly

Ok I'll simplify for you.

If you believe Israel has outsize influence over uk policy and that this needs investigating and bringing out into the open, you are very close to Jews control everything trope.

If you care a lot about how Israeli lobbying affects uk policy but you don't care as much about Chinese / Saudi / Hamas lobbying / use of propaganda in our media, you are right on the money of exceptionalising Israel / Jews.