I Got Everything Wrong - Not a good mum.

[user12345678901234]

Apologies this is a long one.
I was in an abusive marriage for over 20 years. Ex terrorised us all. I was petrified. He told me he would keep the kids and see me destitute if I left. He is in a job which I believed would enable him to do this.
My mental health was poor.
I was making quiet plans to leave once all the children were older; uni etc. This included putting the house up for sale under the guise of downsizing, I was then going to separate and buy a house just for us.
My oldest DD Was struggling with her studies, mainly due to her father’s behaviour. She confided in the welfare office at uni, who quite rightly, referred it to social services. I was still too afraid to tell ex what was happening. We fled with just suitcases and school books. I emailed him to let him know.
I have spent the last 2+ years trying to divorce him. It’s been horrendous and has taken up a lot of my headspace. I have been suicidal at points. My health has taken a complete battering; physically as well as mentally now.
My DDs are 19 and 21. They do not respect me. They seem to have stepped into the vacuum left by their father. They have been gone from uni since June. They are rude, dismissive and do very little to contribute to the running of the house. I have let this happen because I feel so guilty about not leaving their father sooner and exposing them to abuse too.
Things came to a head recently when they did something which was so disrespectful that I finally stood up for myself. The incident was a huge invasion of my privacy and massively overstepped a boundary. When I called them out their attitude was dismissive to say the least. They “apologised” but weren’t really that concerned that I was upset. Said they would not do it again and that I should get over it.
I’ve stepped back and just got on with things at home.
Yesterday, I needed to ask oldest DD a question, the standard rudeness appeared and I called it out. Words were exchanged. I pointed out that younger DD attitude towards me and behaviour deteriorates when older DD is home from uni, that this has been observed by others. Others have also quietly spoken to me about how poorly they treat me.
The upshot is that oldest DD shared that she has felt neglected her whole life and particularly these last couple of years. I was briefly seeing someone, (I ended things when they told me they were not ready to have any man in the house) she said this added to her feeling of being neglected.
I’ve asked her what sort of things I’ve done to make her feel this way. She cannot give me any examples.
They both state that I have done nothing to help them with how they felt after the separation. I did ask them at the start how I could help, did they want counselling, take a gap year, just talk. They didn’t want it. They cannot recall any of this.
I have a feeling that I’m being manipulated to some extent.
I’m a mess. I don’t know what to do next.

It suits them to be as they are. Thats why they dont want to change. The current narrative ensures they are the victim and they never have to take accountability.

I have been strong on the face of it - for two almost three years.
Since separating, I’ve dealt with losing my DM, buying a new house, going back to work FT after being a SAHM, sorting divorce, dealing with a major health crisis. All sorts and I haven’t broken yet.
I’ve worked hard on myself to have boundaries and build up some self confidence. I think it’s why this situation has come to a head now, I realised how much they disrespected me and I brought it up and asked that it stop.
I thought I’d shielded them from a lot of their father’s abuse, it was only in the latter years that they witnessed a few things.
I’ve realised now, how much they’ve been affected by it all.

They need to move out..
I have been in your shoes..
You now need to put your own mental wellbeing first..

Not necessarily. They could present themselves to your local council housing department as homeless. As they are young and female, I would expect them to be housed - probably in temporary accommodation at first.

No. They are disrespecting you & using your being upset as a reason for justifying their bad behaviours. They are not small children.

This! Can you access family therapy? You're all hurting thanks to this vile man.

They may have been impacted by their exposure to things as children but they are adults now and they do know right from wrong, especially if your friends and family have been challenging them, and they are choosing to behave that way. What consequences do they have at the moment for their actions? I would suggest whatever they are they’re not good enough to motivate them to stop treating you awfully. As well as consequences i’d also have frank discussions with them. Do they think they will be capable of healthy loving relationships? Do they think people will stick around if they treat them in a similar way? Do they think they’ve been damaged? What are they hoping to achieve in the way they treat you?

I’m not sure about your area provision but the local domestic violence charity may be able to help you and do a sort of family therapy for you as a group to discuss your children’s behaviour towards you. It’s incredibly common for children to mimic the abuse partner once they are living alone with the Mum. You are not the only one dealing with this and there is support out there. You need to ask for help.

You all need to sit and have a discussion about expectations in the home. Make it clear what behaviour you are willing to accept in your home, and what the consequences are if they are not followed. They may have things they ask you to do to, and you need to consider if this is appropriate.
You and your children are recovering from years of abuse, your children will know that they feel angry and may not know why. They may not feel ready for therapy, but that doesn’t mean they get to treat you the way that they do. They need to understand that they’re adults now. They are becoming defensive when challenged due to their shame, they are behaving in an automatic way, but they need to be supported to act differently in the home.
Contact a domestic abuse service who will be able help you all navigate this new norm, your children are survivors of domestic abuse too

Are they both living away for uni and going back soon? If so they might need to come and go for a while so it might be worth being supportive by providing a base when they need it in the vacations. Maybe pointing out all the things you have achieved to provide a home but calmly as a matter of fact.

One possibility is just to have low expectations/choosing your battles re loading dishwasher etc but just doing minimum eg no washing for them.
personally I’d calmly speak from ‘I’ eg I don’t like being spoken to you like’ and just carry on doing what you’re doing, or think about where you’d like to be for a weekend away., to take yourself mentally away from the situation. If they are away for uni the amount of time they are with you might gradually decrease. And hopefully as they grow up they will begin to appreciate that you did your best.

But teenagers and young adults, particularly ones who have experienced long term stress often let out their anger out at home where they feel safest. You haven’t done everything wrong, what you’ve accomplished in the last few years sounds amazing. And they’ve clearly done ok at school so they have that foundation . All the best with continuing to be strong in this difficult situation!

@whippersnapper55. Please don’t give this advice. Presenting themselves to the council will do nothing. There are families with children living in one room because of the housing shortage, so two teenage girls would be given a B&B if they’re lucky.

I do think that teens and young people can be disrespectful. I've witnessed it alot with this generation and it may not necessarily be down to the divorce. Lots of children come from divorced parents these days...unfortunately.
I'd stop apologising and just get your head up and crack on with your own therapy and sorting yourself out. They are adults now. If it continues I'd suggest they move out and rent a flat together if they are so unhappy under your roof!!!

It’s ok. I would never throw them out. But I did suggest they went back to uni earlier of they could not speak to me in a civil manner.

You do need to keep calling them out on this behaviour. You said “when I finally called them out” which suggests you were allowing them to treat you this way for a while. It must be really triggering for you so I understand why you became tearful. More therapy may help with that. Ideally you will learn to be assertive and consistent with them.

If they keep mistreating you, it would be reasonable to encourage them to live independently. It sounds like they sub consciously identify with the abuser (their dad) rather than the victim (you) - it makes sense as an ego defence, but it’s worrying for their long term prospects as they’ll be prone to bullying others and lacking compassion.

This situation has worsened because I have started to pull them up when they are rude or disrespectful.
Yesterday’s situation was a result of me asking that they speak in a more respectful way and reinforcing a boundary they stamped all over a week or so ago.
I do need therapy/help and I know that they do too.
I cannot afford private therapy, as all spare cash is eaten up by divorce costs right now.

I will reach out to DV organisations. (I previously asked for help from local places when I was trying to leave and they were very unhelpful, so I’ve been reluctant).
I thought we were doing ok until recently tbh. I’ve been consumed by the divorce and have missed a lot I suppose.

I'm in my 40's now, but I grew up in a house with domestic abuse. My mother didn't leave him until I was 17, so a similar situation to yours, though she left him because she met someone else and went straight from one relationship to another with no gap in between.

It is not an easy journey and I don't know if it ever will be. The anger is enormous, and the older I get, the more I understand just how badly my mother failed in her duty as a parent, how she buried her head in the sand regarding the harm being done to me, how she parentified me in order to cope with the marriage. She fucked up massively by picking a shitty man, staying with him and having more children after it became apparent just how shit he was, and now all of us has to deal with the consequences of that choice. There is a part of me that despises her for clinging to the relationship with that disgusting man and making excuses, like not being able to leave until I left school. It is hard for me to have any respect for her. She chose to stay in a relationship with him rather than protect me, time and time again, and I don't know why.

One of the biggest problems I have with my mother is that she hasn't (and refuses) to do the work needed to unpick the weird behaviours she developed in that marriage, and it's impossible for me to have a relationship with her until she does.

Honestly, @user12345678901234 you need to stop crying over the bloody dishwasher and blaming your kids for making you cry. They are not responsible for your feelings, you are. All of you are dealing with the fallout of the marriage and it is not something you will get through overnight. There will be so much to unpick. Unhealthy behaviours and dynamics that you're not even fully aware of yet. You're still in a place of making all of it about you - look at the thread title you chose.

Stop comparing your children to your ex. It doesn't help them or you. It will fuel their anger, and it will also allow you to stay in victim mode. There's comfort in a familiar role, I know that, but it is not the right thing for any of you. They are not your ex. They are young people who grew up with domestic violence who have developed unhealthy coping strategies and now need to learn some new ones and have a tough road ahead.

The main thing I think you should be doing right now is working on fixing yourself, getting your own mental health sorted, so you can be the stable adult your kids need.

Their abusive father? Wonderful advice...

Wow! I have to say your message is hard to read. But you are absolutely correct and I’m so grateful that you’ve taken the time to write this.
In my heart of hearts I know this is exactly how it is.
I promise I will start trying to address all of this.
I’m so sorry you went through this.

My DH had therapy for anger issues (he wasn’t violent of anything but he had this simmering rage and I was walking on eggshells). As he calmed down I got angrier to the point I was getting furious over everything. He eventually told me his therapist said this may happen. When there is no space for you to express your own anger you lock it away, once theres space it comes boiling over, it’s apparently very common.

Could it be that your daughters are now expressing the rage they have felt their entire lives?

@Bringemouti realised that a lot of the anger I have is old anger that I literally was not allowed to express in childhood when I would be shamed and punished for it. It didn't go away, it just got stuck. EMDR has helped.

@user12345678901234 I think you've been incredibly strong OP. You've got a house, a job and one of your kids has made it to uni. Sounds like the other one will follow too. And you haven't brought another man into their lives. You've done it all alone. Give yourself credit and stop apologising to everyone. Your children are adults now and will soon be making their own life choices. There's only so much one person can give.

I think this is true for them.
They are definitely angry about what’s happened and at me too, for allowing it.
I realised this a while ago and have absorbed a lot of it.

OP, you have to stop dwelling on their behaviour. Your relationship with them will take a long time to normalise. The abuse is all they have known, so they have a great deal to work out.

You need to heal yourself, and focus on being stable and strong for them and for you. This will start to build trust and from there, respect. You’re asking for something you haven’t earned yet.

I think you've done an amazing job to get out of that abusive marriage, taking your children with you, and starting to set up a life on your own. The strength that takes cannot be ignored, so well done.

All parents blame themselves for the way their children are, that's just the parents lot, just like we (secretly) celebrate their successes as our own too. I think your daughters have a lot to deal with, and they are lost. They had a father who modelled terrible behaviour, so they learned from that. And they had a mother who acquiesced out of fear or to keep the peace, so they think you'll do the same again. But now you are gaining your own strength, and they have to learn how to deal with a whole new side of you that they haven't seen before. Stand your ground gently, love them deeply, and show them that you deserve respect. It is incredibly hard to do, and its unlikely you can do it alone. You have your sister and your friend on your side, so they can offer you strength. If there is any way you can get to therapy as well, do that. You can't make your daughters go to therapy, so leave that battle. It's not one you need to fight. But keep talking.

I really feel for you.