Problems with adult daughter

[Bonkersblonde]

Not sure if I need advice or just to vent

My 23 yo daughter left my home 2 years ago to move in with a friend. That didn't work so she then moved in with her dad (we're amiably separated). Her boyfriend was also living there. Both were working after she had a spell of unemployment and after he'd really had enough of them (lack of paying rent, leaving mess about, generally being difficult) they moved in with his parents. She then lost her job (temp contract not renewed) just before Christmas and things fell apart with his parents so they've ended up here 6 weeks ago.

Her working life has been littered with temp jobs and her either quitting or being let go. She’s got few qualifications so can’t apply for anything particularly well paid. She says she wants to work but I think she just wants to either lie in bed all day (what she’s doing now and has done for years) or have a job land in her lap.

Since they moved in I can see little evidence of job seeking and I've had rent off them for 1st 3 weeks- nothing since (he's working).

They drink too much and although he's up and out for work, I've just tried to rouse her and it's impossible.

I've just retired and normally rent my spare rooms out to generate income but they're occupying one and not paying rent regularly.

I'm at the end of my tether with it and just can't see a way out. They also fall out regularly and he stomps off to his parents but it back the following day all hearts and flowers again

They're both 23

Help!

Bumping this for anyone around this evening 😊

This is ridiculous, they are taking the mick out of you , they heed to pay proper rent , tidy up after themselves or get out , be firm.

Remove them both from your home.

Either they each shape up on their own eventually or they won't.

You, her father, his parents, etc., are fostering dependence. Cease enabling and intervening.

Regrettably, their current behavior likely stems from being overly indulged and not adequately prepared for reality during upbringing.

Their entitled behavior in their twenties is a result of parental actions. It should have been addressed during childhood if you had attempted to take control, (assuming you didn't) perhaps your daughter wouldn't be like "this"..she may have also needed therapy.

This behavior may also be deep rooted depression.

It's necessary to expel them, as challenging as it may be, to compel them to mature. You cannot continue to be their safety net. Their lack of progress is due to constant rescue.

Blimey. Harsh

Well thanks but that’s neither possible nor practical.

They would be on the street because there is nowhere else to go.

I was hoping for a more scaffolded and practical approach if anyone else had had a similar problem (which by a quick look through, it seems there are lots)

Thanks- yes. Trouble is she’s not earning and he’s trying to pay off an overdraft and for his
cse (not extravagant and needed for work) etc etc

difficult but I know you’re right

Sympathies OP. What can you do with an adult DD to make them work/function?

Yes I was going to suggest looking at other similar threads. You’re not alone in your circumstances. Many adult children not thriving turn out to be ND or have undiagnosed SENs. Especially young women as they mask better. Look at those threads too. There is a reason she’s not keeping jobs. ASD?

There’s no miracle here but as a first step, will you ex come and you both talk calmly with her?

He is not trying to pay off his overdraft if he is spending so much on drink

I would not feel any obligation to house him especially as he is not paying rent. I would give them one month from now and say they had to go. It's outrageous that you are retired and depending on that money and they are taking advantage like that.

Thanks DrBlackbird- she is almost certainly undiagnosed ADD and doesn’t see consequences.

He also has trauma as he was adopted at 6 out of a drug addicted household- some of the things he’s been through are inhuman (worst was his father breaking his ankles to stop him climbing out of the cot).

So difficult

Well, tough love has to come into play.

They need to be paying you rent.
If they are not working then they must sign on to universal credit, where they will be expected to put in hours per week looking for work, in the meantime, they will get some money.

They must pay you for rent, electricity, and food.
This is basic and very fundamental to life, you have to pay your way.

I would also say - she is your dd, she can stay, but he can't. Send him bakc to his parents. If they don't like it, tough, the answer is to find a flat/room and get your own space.

It's feasible, you just resist them exploring that potential, perhaps because of your fondness for them or your daughter's dependence on you, reminiscent of her younger years.

Perhaps you enjoy being relied upon by your daughter, fearing that if she became self-sufficient, you'd lose her. However, there are always options and alternatives available.

Do you truly believe these two indulged individuals wouldn't devise multiple solutions and take action if they were on their own? While it's a possibility, it's unlikely they would choose to sleep on the streets and face homelessness. They would likely seek accommodation such as renting a room, going to a shelter, or staying in a hotel, getting assistance, benefits, even couch surfing, etc.. Your daughter wouldn't abruptly quit multiple jobs. . She'd learn how to hold onto it. You give your daughter less credit than deserved.

What's necessary is tough love. Everyone needs to stop enabling them and stand their ground. While you may think you're aiding them by rescuing them, you're actually harming your daughter and impeding her progress.

You're not equipping her to thrive independently; instead, you're shielding her and fostering extreme codependency.

I suggest giving them a deadline to move.. give them 2 months or less. Stand firm.

Absolutely do I NOT resist them exploring their potential (laughable) or do I enjoy being relied upon. She’s lived away from me for 2!years and I can’t wait for her to be away again.

Don’t misunderstand- I love her more than I can say, but don’t want her living here.

Easy to say “stand firm”.

What’s the practical solution here- when literally NOTHING works?!?! Saying “stand firm” when I’ve done nothing but- giving ultimatums that come and go….

change the locks.

Give them an ultimatum.
Rent paid weekly/ monthly in advance, sign up to benefits and work, or they must leave.
They have 1 months to get their act together.

Be very serious, warn them that they will have to leave, and that you will physically kick them out. That you will change the locks and that they will have to leave. Make sure they understand that you will follow through.

Then after 1 month with no sign of rent, you change the locks when they leave the house.
pack up their stuff and put it in the porch/garage etc.

You do not have to have them living with you!

If they are living together at yours, I guess there is limited incentive to leave.

When we were younger living at home was so uncomfortable that you would do anything to leave and that was a massive push to get your arse in gear!

Could they afford to rent a room together? Can you afford to go guarantor for them (maybe with his parents) to secure a bedsit maybe?

My two DS have ADHD. When they turned sixteen it was college, an apprenticeship or volunteering 40 hours per week, staying in bed until 1pm was not an option.
Both hated college but stayed (with part time work in cafes) until they found full-time apprenticeships.
In almost everything else I'm not a strict parent and did everything I could to enable them in the direction they wanted, both chose engineering. With one this included me driving one 60 miles to work for a few weeks until he passed his driving test. The other worked a free internship to demonstrate his keenness and was offered a position.
I'm proud of how much both DSs have achieved but am also quite sure they'd have happily stayed up all night on their xboxes and stayed in bed given half the chance, like some of their friends. It's time for some tough love.

I think you need to sit them both down and make a plan with them.

Benefits - use one one of the benefit calculators and see if they are entitled to anything. If so, help them to fill in any nevessary forms

Jobs - sit with them and look at Indeed and other sites to find jobs . help them fill them in.

cb - help them to create a cv

Leaving it up to them isn’t working so it’s time to intervene and be bad cop.

Maybe also try and plan a timeline . To get any job by end of April with viewvtk getting better job buy May.

worst was his father breaking his ankles to stop him climbing out of the cot

That's beyond imaginable that someone could even dream of doing that to another human, let alone their own child.

If you think she may be ND did you ever explore getting her assessed when she was younger or has she ever explored getting an assessment herself?

@Bonkersblonde

giving ultimatums that come and go….

It's not really an ultimatum if you don't stick to it though. It is hard to be tough on your flesh and blood but she knows, as does he, that there's no danger of you actually follow through so there's no need to get their act together.

A PP mentioned the possibility of you being a guarantor. Be very careful because if/when they don't paid the rent, etc you will be liable for any costs you have guaranteed. Maybe, instead, see if you can pay their deposit and first month's rent (not to them but direct to their landlord), thus limiting your financial liability.

Once they've left change the locks (or just the barrels of the locks) as soon as possible. Don't just rely on them returning your house keys. Then advertise for a lodger at a realistic market rent for your area.

They can also take a look at www.entitledto.co.uk to see what benefits they can claim or talk to Shelter or Citizens Advice for help. Good luck OP. 🌹

We (me and her dad) have discussed getting a room for them and paying 2 months worth of rent the they're on their own

I think if things don't change pretty soon that's going to have to be the option.

Another issue is he is getting very stressed by the whole situation and was actually in tears the other night.

He works as a carpenter and his boss is messing him about by trying to pay him cash and not through the books which he's not happy about.

I don't want to push him over the edge.

The whole situation will be better when she has a job

I agree re the ankles- beyond imaginable. Thankfully he doesn’t remember much apart from being in hospital.

We wanted to get her assessed when it was becoming obvious re ADD but she was then 16 in her GCSE year (birthday is in Sept so old in the year) and flatly refused any assessment. Said it would be a stigma. Or actually the words were something like “I’m not a f@cking weirdo” or similar.

So the guy adopted from the drug addict house who had his ankles broken while still in the cot seems to be doing more in terms of employment than your daughter who has access to two parents with a healthy relationship....

Why have you let her get to 23 without qualifications? I never understand this . How did you think your daughter would support herself as an adult?

Sorry to seem so harsh OP but you need to take some responsibility.

She is not in some rural village in a 3rd world country , she has access plenty of resources to improve her current situation.

Sit down with her and draw up a life plan and some goals with her .
Starting with enrolling herself on some education and getting a job .

Set a rota of what needs to be done in the house and e.g cleaning etc and get them to pull their weight . They will want to do it because sleeping under bridges and in doorways is not a glamours prospect especially for the bone idle .

HTH

Also a diagnosis of ADD/ADHD may shed a light on symptoms etc doesn't actually help with much in reality ( I should know ) .

The only tangible benefit is that perhaps if she enrolled back in education she would have extra exam time etc and access to some additional student funding for learning equipment etc .
Employers can also put reasonable adjustments in place but again , I have never found that to be tangible support .

She needs a plan and some consistency.
Renting her a room will do nothing to actually change her position in life and she will probably spiral into debt and further bad habits .

Or actually the words were something like “I’m not a f@cking weirdo” or similar. absolutely charming.

Does she realise how offensive that is?

We didn’t “let” her get few qualifications. She has a handful of GCSEs.

Believe me- I’d think the same as you.

Mt elder daughter is about as different as they come- 2 horses, same stable, very different results.

We tried bribery, rewarding, grounding, removal of all devices, talking to her nicely, shouting at her, asking her friends to help, doing things with/for her, attempting to help with homework, having a routine, having a chore chart, having a star chart, doing the disappointed thing, getting grandparents to speak to her, giving her deadlines, trying no deadlines

You tell me what else we could have done.

Absolutely nothing works with her- she has been stubborn and absolutely her own person since the minute she was born.

I take full responsibility for trying everything

Attacking me for being a crap parent is both unhelpful and upsetting.

Well done to anyone who has functioning and fantastic kids. They’re not all the same….

I think that the first thing to do is sit them down and say that they can’t continue living at your house as a couple in the current situation.

He needs to go back to his parents’ house so she can focus on getting herself sorted out. I expect there’ll be shouting and tears, but stand firm and say that the current situation can’t continue.

I have said up thread to kick them out.

I think you do actually need to do something quite drastic.

So get a load of information together.
benefits calculator etc.
Sit down for a talk. Show them what they can get, and offer to help them sign up.
Offer them the deposit and one month's rent on a place. Maybe even help to set them up (let them take the bedding and a few plates. )

But then they are on their own. This will get them out of your house, and get them into the system, and then they will have to find their own way.

But you do have to stick to it.
and i would change the locks once they have moved out so that they cannot access your house when you are out