How do you cope with 2 under 4? I can't.

[aglassofwater]

Today was a particularly bad day. DH was sick and I looked after the DC's all day on my own. I have a 7mo DD and a 3.5yo. DD has a cold. I am in floods and can't stop. I feel utterly useless. I wish I could be better at this.

I feel like I never get anything done. We are always late to DS's nursery school. I have washing piles around the house that I haven't been able to put away.

Every night there is a great mayhem while I try to make tea, look after a fretful and tired DD and get something for DS to do. My DH is lovely and v good with the kids. He comes home exhausted and I really want to make sure he has a nice dinner to come home to and a cuppa at least. In practise this rarely happens. We hardly see each other. We never have sex because I was badly stitched and its painful. I am so tired I never really even think about it. I worry that we are separate people now.

I feel like I am neglecting DD when I am trying to get stuff done in the house. She won't wean and is still breast feeding, she won't take a bottle. I have tried many times and other people have also tried.

We don't live near family so have no extra support. DD goes into nursery once a week so I can do keeping in touch days at work but so far I have only managed a few hours in work due to feeding/being exhausted. I also have used the time to run errands in town. So DD has only been in nursery from say 10.30am til 2pm.

Today I realised I have not had a cuppa or food since 11am.

I feel like every day its just work non stop til they are in bed. Then I get about 2 hours where I catch up with some jobs and have 5 mins to myself before I have to feed dd again at 9.30/10pm. She is lately up about 3 times in the night.

I am sure loads of people have much much worse situations than me but I just can't do this and I don't know how to get better at it and I don't know how people do it.

I just don't know what to do.

When I was in your situation I had a kinda of routine. At this time I did not drive so every morning we'd get up at 7am and I would dress DD1 straight away, have breakfast. While DD2 had morning nap (9-10) I would get myself dressed.

Wake DD2 and straight in the buggy for a walk to town and back (and to get shopping for dinner) back, lunch, DD2 nap 1-3 and then DD1 and I would spend some time watching TV, having a tasty snack (usually cake-orientated) and read through whatever weekly magazine we'd bought for her this week (like cbeebies magazine etc) and this worked very well and DD1 loved spending time with the stickers while I relaxed.

Woke up DD2 and then it was generally very hard work til DH got home, and he would always be in charge of cooking the dinner for us (he made a special effort to get home early during the 'first year')

During and after dinner there was two of us, so that was an enjoyable part of the day for us and then girls in bed by 7. Rest of evening to ourselves, and dreamfeed at 10pm/11pm (then fingers crossed til morning - most of the time DD2 would sleep til about 6am, and we would try and leav her in her cot til 7am)

It is hard but for me that walk very day makes a massive difference. I had the phil and teds double and both children would sit in the buggy and be very content, sometimes I would even allow myself to listen to my mp3 player and really enjoy being out in the fresh air. If I was ever unable to have the walk, my day felt 100 times harder.

Your youngest is 7 months, and at 9 months I felt a significant shift in that things got much easier (rarely after 9 months did I hear a peep out of DD2 at night and her naps were consistant in the day) and then after the 9 months is the 1 year where your baby turns into a young child and starts to walk etc and al the time your older child is getting older too and more independant.

Stick with it, you've done the hard newborn bit, it will all start to calm down

thanks for advice jewels - am off to do the dream feed.

it gets better - hang onto that thought
who cares if the washing is piling up and the house is untidy? it's not like it will be like that forever - in a year's time you will be able to do so much more

slow cookers are the key to the evening meal btw - get it all organised in the morning and avoid the hours of hell between 5 and 7 when it all goes wrong

I have 3 - 4.6 with SNs, 2.9 & 13 mo - at the moment I am just surviving.

Jewels, snap!

I've got a 4year old and a 12 month old so I've been where you are. It's such a difficult time when you're still feeding on demand, and then preparing possibly 2 different meals for the kids, and another for you and DH - coupled with the sheer exhaustion and trying to juggle everything, it's no surprise you feel a bit battered!

It will get better. DD didn't sleep through until about 9 months - I'd pull her into bed with me so I could at least doze whilst doing the middle of the night feeds. Other things that helped me through it - make meals as simple for you as possible, and if it's something you can make for the kids and then spice up for you and DH so much the better as it will save you cooking twice (I really like Fay Ripley's recipe book - food that everyone can eat);
get out - anywhere -park, library, local cafe for a cup of tea, round a friend's house; cbeebies is your friend, especially at tea time (the promise of zingzillas is sometimes enough to have tea eaten by 5.15!!);
talk to DH - i totally lost interest in sex until I stopped BFing at 10 months - your hormones are still all about the baby and frankly, I had small people hanging off me all day and I didn't want a big one hanging off me at night . Your DH sounds like he's pretty understanding - a glass of wine together and a chat about your days might help you feel less separate. Lastly - I instigated a very strict bedtime routine - bath by 6.30, bed for baby by 7 and then some quiet time with DS. It didn't always work - but when it did, I had some time to catch up on mumsnet the housework.

Hope that helps a bit - it will get easier, we've turned a huge corner since DD was about 11 months - and don't forget to give yourself some time off too if you can - can DH take the kids on a Saturday morning so you
can skip off out the house?

Good luck

I'm so pleased to see your post because I thought I was the only one who wasn't coping. I have a 1 year old and a 2 year old and no family or friends nearby. The DCs are both very good, really, but I feel I'm constantly grumpy and snippy with them because I'm either tired or guilt-ridden that I can't given them both the attention I would like and that I have let the housework slide a bit too much. Unfortunately, we can't afford a cleaner at the moment because I think that would make a big difference. HOWEVER, on the days when I seem to have it a bit more together, I find I can get a bit done by enlisting the 2 year old's help and giving her little chores - she is now quite adept at putting washing in the drawers, getting the cutlery/crockery out of the cupboard for their lunch and passing me pegs when I'm hanging the washing out. Can you do something similar with your older one?

Although I haven't really been able to offer much advice, take comfort in the fact that you are not alone. I'm taking comfort from those posters who said it gets easier!!

AGOW, tis really, really hard having 2 young children. Mine are 4.5 and 3 months, so much bigger gap than some. I am not working (although going back p/t next week (hooray)), have a cleaner and a teacher for a DH who is home by 4pm everyday. However some days I am ready to run from the house SCREAMING by the time DH gets home. It gets to you, it truly does

aglass I totally empathise with you.

Have cleaner once week who does ironing! ds 3.9 and dd 19 both go to nursery 2.5 days a week whilst I am at work! DH works all time only family are inlaws round here and they work all time (family business)
DH brill when he is here mostly my motto is if in doubt get out! We are always out can't sit in!

But I find it totally overwhelming! Never been diagnosed with pnd or any depression but had lot of trauma in the past and always feel like it's waiting to bite me! My housework everyone told me to leave but this totally affects me that and not getting dressed in the morning! It has an adverse effect on my mental health!

Dh and I don't have much time for each other but we just muddling through!

I think things have got easier and I know there will be challenges all along but I'm not perfect and I can't keep trying to pretend I am!
I think what I'm trying to say is cut yourself some slack whereever you can!!

I hope you have a quiet night and you find a way to make it easier on yourself! X

Glassofwater - I quite literally could have written your post! DS is 3.5 and DD is 8mths and we often have the meltdown nightmare whilst I'm trying to cook dinner! I've taken to sitting DD in her highchair next to the worktop so she can see what I'm doing and DS has now taken to sitting next to her so he can see too!

DS has started to copy everything DD does which is driving me insane (especially when he tries to stand on my lap and bounce on me ) and when he's not trying to knock her over or snatching his toys away from her the love between them id wonderful to see.

I guess what I'm trying to say is what's been said already - It is hard, and quite frankly it's bloody shitty sometimes, but you get by, and eventually you start to realise that the lovely stuff actually outweighs the rubbish bits. (hopefully).

Oh, and as for the washing, the less said about that the better Can't remember the last time any of my clothes made it to the wardrobe. And I've 'lost' a few items of clothing for months at a time due to the piles of laundry in various places in the house (because even when it does get upstairs it rarely goes away)

Oh and by the way - you do know you're only allowed to do 10 KIT days before it affects your statutory pay don't you? (I think that's right - you might want to check it out?)

Dear aglassofwater

part of me felt like I was reading something I wrote...but there are things to do to help

like others said, the freezer is your best friend. Make lots of batches of bolognese sauce, make burgers and bake them and then freeze in bags, have fishfingersa and pots of beans and anything that can be kept in portions. Put them in the fridge overnight and then zap them in the microwave. Having ready cooked homemade burger together with toast and cheese makes it really easy to feed DS in minutes... Cook twice a week and freeze, it will save you time.

Again, like others said, try to go out during the day as much as you can. Staying in makes children and parents go a bit mental, time passes more quickly and pleasantly outside and you'll meet mums and make new friends.

Go and see your GP about the bad stitching, I had a similar problem and was in agony for almost 2 years, finally went to the doctor, got referred and had the overstitching corrected; we got our sex life back.

Get big baskets to put your washing in, piles or clothes look a lot better contained!

Good luck and courage!
Courage, it will get better and one day you'll find

...and one day you'll find your DC playing together and you with a smile on your face doing absolutely nothing!

So glad to find this thread. I guess I knew it wasn't just me who finds having 2 small children (26 mo and 2 mo) bloody hard work but it really helps to see in black and white that I'm not alone. I hope it helps you too, OP. Some good tips, too. I already do the laundry basket one - such a small thing but it really does help psychologically. And they are easy to move when vacuuming - when I get around to vacuuming, of course .

Wow - am so glad to hear its not just me. I was wondering how the hell everyone copes. Am sooooo looking forward to things getting better.

I fell asleep feeding dd in bed last night so didn't sleep properly/ just dozed and am really tired again today. Still, going to Legoland today woo hoo
am now rushing about packing

ill be checking back for all these helpful ideas

Aglass; Was thinking about your problem with your DD not taking a bottle, don't know what you've tried and tested but, I breatfed both my DD's til 9 months and niether of them would take from a bottle. What I did when I decided to give up bf was to make up baby rice with formula milk for one meal a day to introduce taste to them, then once they took that I offered formula milk in a Tommy Tippi cup, so no sucking was involved. Neither of them took it straight away but they were gonna have to have it at some point so I just kept offering it until they drank some. Eventually over a couple of weeks they did it! I know all babies are different and what works for one doesn't always work for another, but anything is worth a try when you're exhausted! It really does get easier

thanks honeymunster I am trying a tommy tippi cup like you suggest. so far she has only had a few sips but fingers crossed that she will take a bit more. I'll try again in the morning.

A doidy cup or a little medecine cup might be worth a go to, as a bridge. Perhaps sometimes they just don't realise they can get milk from that funny plastic thing mum keeps putting to their mouth.

It's just relentless sometimes, isn't it?

Loads of good tips already- I highly recommend the batch cooking (although sometimes we do end up having bolognese sauce in various guises for 3 days running!)

Do you have a children's centre nearby? If you do, they are fabulous places, they do loads of different playgroups etc. and some have creches so you can do activites for yourself. There should also be a breastfeeding workshop where you can get advice, I know that 7 months into your second child you might think you're beyond a bf group BUT I got some brilliant weaning advice from mine, made it all fairly painless.

I would also say that at some point in the week, DH should take sole charge of the children (and laundry and cooking) and you should get a couple of hours to yourself. I would happily sit in a quiet, darkened room away from all the fucking noise for that time but whatever makes you feel a bit less frazzled

As someone who has been there, got the T shirt and is just about still sane, can I just say...

Hang in there, it gets better, it's worth it and you will look back on it and laugh

I had three under 2.3 yrs... one every 12 months (no.3 was slightly unplanned....) and then my 4th child before my eldest was 5...
I survived by being pretty routine based.. we got out every day for a walk, toddler group, later pre school for the eldest.. getting OUT saved my sanity!

I used to have big baskets for chucking toys, laundry etc in. I gave up ironing entirely (and still don't..)

Try and relax... you don't have to be superwoman and honestly the time flies past sooooo fast. Mine are now all teens... all four of them.. and my house is probably even untidier than it was back when they were all tiny!!! I found being Mum to lots of little ones damn hard work but it's worth it in the end..

(oh and enjoy them... OMG teens are soooo much worse LOL)

Last night I tried DD with a bottle - no joy - but then I put a bit of milk on a spoon and fed it to her - then tried the bottle again - I can't say that she drank much, but she seemed happier with the bottle in her mouth than before. Also, I now wash the sterilising solution off with boiled water as I think the smell/taste of it can't help. Am going to try again tonight, so fingers crossed (DS1 held out until the day I went back to work, didn't go back to work after DS2, so he was solely breastfed until 1 year) really need to get this cracked by mid-July as I have evening meetings that I need to go to).

You have to give up cooking in the evening! Especially if you have DS out of the house in the day. I have an almost 4 DS and 18 month DD and they go beserk if I so much as try to put a pot of water on to boil in the evening. Almost all their food is in the freezer - even tiny portions of frozen rice. On the weekends, when DH is around, I'll make them food that can't be frozen.

I had an awful time last year when I had them both at home with me all the time except for 9 hours a week when DS was at playschool. We have no family around and not many close friends as we are quite new to the area. The house didn't get tidied for the whole year, couldn't get a cleaner even though my mother offered to help pay, because it was just too much of a tip. I think we had sex 2 1/2 times that year. DS wasn't sleeping through when DD was born so I was too exhausted to even attempt to get DD into 'good' sleeping habits and just ended up sleeping with them both (which did help me survive). I have just night weaned DD this last week (and feeling very proud about it). I also used a sling a lot, and that helped.

I actually found it got harder and harder for the first 12 months and then things got much better, but that was mostly because DS started preschool every day.

I was glad to read your post as I think it will be me in 6 months - have a 2yo DD and 39 weeks pregnant with DC2!

I'm finding it a nightmare looking after DD all day while so heavily pregnant and the housework really has taken a slide. Some things that has helped-

cleaning - I often clean the bathroom / whizz around upstairs putting clothes away while DD is in the bath - she's pretty good at entertaining herself, and I can always tell her to help by 'cleaning' the bath with her flannel. She also 'helps' do the dusting while I hoover.

cooking - don't beat yourself up about a 'proper' meal every night for DH! We have fresh pasta and sauce from the supermarket at least once a week, and we've also got into the habit of doing the M&S 2 dine for a tenner meals on a friday night, which is a nice treat. I'm also a bit of a master of one-pot meals these days that can be started while DD naps, such as chilli, risotto, pasta sauce etc - and always make more so you can freeze it.

2 other things - I NEVER iron! DH does his own work shirts and that's about all that gets done in our house. I figure why should I do it for him, he used to do it himself before we had kids, and now I'm even busier than when I was working. And, kids don't need a bath every night, a wipe with a flannel will do.

Hope it gets easier, you'll be giving me advice on here in a few months I'm sure...

Some great advice here...I could have written your post...I have a 3.5yr and a 17 months old, and its bloody hard work. I am very lucky as I have a weekly cleaner but its still endless, and I feel like I never have any time to myself.

Yes yes yes to batch cooking, we do bolognaise sauce, chicken stew etc and freeze in portions for the kids and us.

Mine do play together now but always with a few arguments as the little one wants everything the big one has, but on the whole its so lovely to see and they do enjoy each other.

I find too that if I am busy and get out and about and most importantly have some adult conversation then its a good day but if I don't do much we all get fed up and its crap.

Wow, thanks for all the great advice. Keep it coming.

The better weather is helping. We had a bbq today and it was a bit better to deal with. i.e. the mess is outside not inside. DS has been playing outside all day too.

DD also seems to be undertaking BLW after nicking her bro's bread and butter.

DH is off work at the min so that makes it easier too.